# Tell me about the Christian flag **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 19, 2019, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299 "2019-07-19T11:16:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/61 "2022-05-02T20:32:51Z")
From the first article: > Justice Elena Kagan had a similar question. If a city wanted to use its flagpoles for a community-building program, but wanted to try to place some limits on it, she asked, would the city have to allow someone to raise a flag bearing a swastika? When Staver again responded that the answer was yes, Kagan suggested that, as a result, cities would not actually be able to implement such programs “because **no city is going to want to** put up a swastika or a KKK flag or something like that.” (Emphasis mine.) Oh, Elena, you sweet summer child. I wish I shared your optimism. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/62 "2022-05-02T20:33:19Z")
How long before Boston shuts down their flag policy completely? I give it exactly as long as it takes for The Satanic Temple to submit an application for one of their flags: > **[Flags](https://thesatanictemple.com/collections/flags-1)** ---
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/63 "2022-05-02T20:41:35Z")
The Satanic Temple exists for the sole purpose of preventing the US from unreasonably favoring Christianity over atheism. They don’t actually worship Satan, which is a common misconception. And yeah. I’d rather have a Satanic Temple flag up than a swastika. But you know that’s coming. The swastika attempt, I mean. “We’ve never turned down a flag request.” ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/64 "2022-05-02T20:52:48Z")
TST is great. As you note, they don’t actually worship Satan or believe in anything supernatural at all, but the name alone riles up Christians. At the same time, they can’t be written off as a joke like the Flying Spaghetti Monster stuff. I suspect that Boston couldn’t even refuse to fly a swastika without violating the 1A, but even if they could find some narrow way of excluding truly offensive symbols, they’d have no such luck with TST. Christians will not be happy about that and the solution will be to shut down the flag program completely. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/65 "2022-05-02T21:07:29Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > How long before Boston shuts down their flag policy completely? The sooner the better. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/66 "2022-05-02T21:11:59Z")
As an atheist I don’t feel the need for a Satanic goat to protect me from the Christians. Sure, who doesn’t admire its copulatory capacity, but unlike our herdsman ancestors, not enough to get all mystical. [Especially since there already is an atheist symbol](https://www.cem.va.gov/hmm/emblems.asp) approved for military headstones. Although there too I don’t hold science in such high esteem either. I don’t trust science as a virtue unto itself. Can’t cotton to the humanist symbol either. Where’s the skeptic’s symbol option 🤨? BTW: the sandhill crane represents peace and family happiness, the pomegranate wisdom. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/67 "2022-05-02T21:31:28Z")
TST would be all too happy to never display their symbols on government property, as long as all other institutions were held to the same rules. But in the meantime, they have been fairly effective in getting these kinds of things shut down. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/68 "2022-05-02T21:50:01Z")
This Boston thing looks like one of those “what could possibly go wrong” scenarios where **everyone** can see what could possibly go wrong. If the allegation is that by allowing a nongovernmental flag to be displayed next to the state’s that constitutes an endorsement… then does that mean the city was endorsing every other cause or organization that ever raised a flag there? The mind boggles. And if to the contrary that is a neutral space for everyone, then it’s for everyone. The so-called “Christian flag” lame as it may seem is not inherently inciting a crime or disruptive of public peace, nor obscene. So Boston had a high, high bar to clear to justify treating it different from the others if the display was “open to all”. Kagan does have a prescient point though: the only answer for Boston or any other city that does this sort of thing but who don’t want to let everyone participate, is to just _stop doing it_ altogether. ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/69 "2022-05-02T22:56:16Z")
> [@Swampwolf](#): > > I love how none of the versions of that pledge have the words “Under God.” Some versions of Christianity don’t consider God as important as Jesus, unlike the Catholics with their 3-in-1 stance. ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/70 "2022-05-02T23:06:10Z")
Here’s a link to the [**Supreme Court story**](https://apnews.com/article/stephen-breyer-us-supreme-court-religion-boston-massachusetts-a872f0bfe945ca59d5077515449ec4b4), with a pic of the Christian flag, for those who haven’t seen it. Self correcting, that is not the Christian flag. It is actually RWB with a white field and a red cross on blue where our national flag shows stars. ---
**Author:** ![Bootb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2022, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/71 "2022-05-02T23:17:55Z")
> [@Swampwolf](#): > > I love how none of the versions of that pledge have the words “Under God.” God cannot be “under God.” That’s a logical impossibility. > [@kaylasdad99](#): > > If you listen to [Red Skelton](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJNL_rhGDq4), he makes it clear that you CANNOT pledge allegiance to two different entities; to attempt it effectively invalidates BOTH pledges, AND renders one’s allegiance without value. Continuing with this theme, since the US pledge of allegiance does say “under God,” this is a sign that a Christian’s political allegiance is under, or subordinate, to his allegiance to God. What you said is equivalent to taking a married man whose parents are still alive, and saying that his duty to his wife invalidates his duty to his parents. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2022, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/72 "2022-05-03T00:02:51Z")
> [@Bootb](#): > > What you said is equivalent to taking a married man whose parents are still alive, and saying that his duty to his wife invalidates his duty to his parents. Disagree. Allegiance is a unitary thing, unlike duty, which can take many forms, among them _filial_ duty and _uxorial_ duty. Also, subordination does _NOT_ equate to invalidation. ETA: It _does_ equate to prioritization. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2022, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/73 "2022-05-03T00:24:42Z")
> [@carnut](#): > > It is actually RWB with a white field and a red cross on blue where our national flag shows stars. What is “RWB”? Probably not a custom car company. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2022, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/74 "2022-05-03T02:46:37Z")
Red White and Blue ---
**Author:** ![The\_Librarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_librarian/32/402_2.png) [@The\_Librarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Librarian)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2022, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/75 "2022-05-03T07:11:29Z")
That is not the kind of display that would make me think nice things. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2022, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/76 "2022-05-03T08:25:59Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > I’ve never heard of this flag, but I just want to say that’s some incredibly shity vexillography. For a flag designed from scratch, it is just bad design - _why_ a canton? Usually it’s for another complete flag or a single meaningful symbol. Why a _square_ canton, out of all proportion? Why red on blue, which is crappy contrast? I’m not saying it’s “county flags of Liberia” bad, but it’s pretty crap. Trying a little too hard to never look like, or be mistaken for, a white supremacist flag, would be my guess ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2022, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/77 "2022-05-03T21:55:39Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Trying a little too hard to never look like, or be mistaken for, a white supremacist flag, would be my guess That’s my guess too. “Look, it’s American and White,” quickly comes to mind. It looks like very amateur design. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2022, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/78 "2022-05-04T07:34:46Z")
There’s nothing in the story of its provenance that suggests that was ever a concern. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2022, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/79 "2022-05-04T07:53:47Z")
Not the kind of thing one would document, even if it came up in the discussion and planning. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2022, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299/80 "2022-05-04T11:16:36Z")
Careful about seeing what we want to see, based on our opinion of those using it today. More likely they weren’t even thinking too much about it and just half-arsed it. The denominations of origin don’t strike me as likely so aligned (at least any more than general society at the time), this latter controversy seems to me more like one of those cases of unfortunate “takeover” of symbols. (ETA: I would not be surprised if whoever they put in charge of half-arsing it first thought to use something like the British Navy White Ensign) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-about-the-christian-flag/837299.md?page=5)