# Tell me again why Bernie Sanders isn't electable? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 8, 2015, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014 "2015-06-08T22:36:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/181 "2015-06-13T22:13:28Z")
> [@Spoke](#): > > My chief impression of the Likud worldview is from my perspective here in the US. I have little stake in Israeli politics, except that I would like to see peace there. > > My impression of the Likud Party from my perspective in the US is that in dealing with the Palestinians, they are the party of intransigence, the party of expanding settlements, and the party of colonization. Sincerely, thank you for your honest response. There are plenty of people who would have responded with snark or wiki links. You didn’t and deserve to be commended for it. I’ll merely note that there’s little evidence to support this historically. All of Israeli’s left wing political parties, even the supposed “peace parties” endorsed the last two invasions and Netanyahu has offered better deals than Rabin offered and it was one of Labor’s famous icons who was far the the left of anyone in Labor today who famously said “I’d rather have the Sinai and no peace than peace and no Sinai”. Respectfully, your problem seems not to be with Likud supporters but with Israelis in general. > [@](#): > > That is also the end of my discussion of Israeli politics. Start your own thread if you like. Fair enough, but you were the one who brought up Israeli politics not me. > [@](#): > > We are here to discuss why Bernie Sanders is or is not “electable.” Do you have any thoughts on that topic? Sure. He’s nothing. Ever time there’s been an election without a sitting Democratic President we’ve had an insurgent Democratic nominee beloved by Liberal intellectuals and college students standing against the more established democratic figures. In 1988 it was Paul Simon, in 1992 it was Jerry Brown, in 2000 it was Bill Bradley, in 2004 it was Howard Dean and in 2008 it was Barack Obama. All of them except Obama crashed and burned very badly. All of them failed badly largely because they failed to convince what you might call lunch pail Democrats to support them over the more established figures. Part of this is because lunch pail democrats don’t pay as much attention to the news and politics as people like you and me. In the case of Obama he was vastly smarter and more charismatic and very good at convincing the largest group of lunch pail Democrats that he understood them, spoke for them and could embody their hopes and dreams. Who do you think Sanders more closely resembles? Obama or Jerry Brown/Paul Simon/Bill Bradley? Hillary is going to eat him for lunch and when she’s done she’s going to spit out his bones. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/182 "2015-06-13T22:22:33Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > You mean, like, Eric Cantor? Sheldon Adelson? Joe Lieberman? > > Yeah, maybe not so much. That’s 3 conservatives and 2,999,997 to go (depending on which demographic numbers you believe). Keep listing… ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/183 "2015-06-13T22:43:36Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > That’s 3 conservatives and 2,999,997 to go (depending on which demographic numbers you believe). Keep listing… More like two and counting. I’d hary classify Joe Lieverman as a “conservative” any more than I’d classify John McCain as a liberal. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2015, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/184 "2015-06-14T00:21:35Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > It’s not impossible, but it _IS_ kinda counter-intuitive. Don’t most Jewish people in America self-identify as liberal? > > ISTM that anti-semites would tend to gravitate toward right-wing organizations. Yes a majority of American Jews self-identify as liberal. And there are [liberals who are anti-semitic](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/06/us/debate-on-a-jewish-student-at-ucla.html). But Sanders lack of electability does not get to the point that his being Jewish would play a role. Or for that matter that some who support Israel would find him not so desirable … he is [rated](http://www.ontheissues.org/international/Bernie_Sanders_Foreign_Policy.htm) “+2 by AAI, indicating pro-Arab pro-Palestine voting record.” He is not electable because is (minimally perceived as) too left of center for most Democrats, let alone for most in this country. He is not electable because even if he was not he does not have the war chest that the battle requires and would be unlikely to acquire one. He is able to articulate some positions that benefit from his ability to express them well. I am glad he is in process. But he cannot win. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2015, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/185 "2015-06-14T01:40:30Z")
This is a wonderfully hilarious thread. The liberals started off by saying that Sanders has absolutely no chance to get elected, for many reasons but especially because he’s a socialist and that’s a poison word. Then the conservatives came in and screamed that Sanders is a socialist, which is poison, so he is unelectable. And the liberals respond by posting; yes, that’s exactly what we said. Then the conservatives reposte with: no, you don’t understand anything - he’s a socialist! L. Right. He’s a socialist. Not in the sense you say, but that doesn’t matter, the fact that you think so makes him unelectable. C. You’re not listening. He’s a socialist. Socialist. Socialist. Socialist. That makes him unelectable. L. Exactly. He’s unelectable. C. No, you’re wrong. The right answer is that he’s unelectable. L. Isn’t that what we said? C. You’ve completely misstated our position. 513 days and counting. :)😕:eek::mad::rolleyes:🆒:p;):D:o:dubious::(:smack: ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2015, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/186 "2015-06-14T01:44:52Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > This is a wonderfully hilarious thread. > > The liberals started off by saying that Sanders has absolutely no chance to get elected, for many reasons but especially because he’s a socialist and that’s a poison word. > > Then the conservatives came in and screamed that Sanders is a socialist, which is poison, so he is unelectable. > > And the liberals respond by posting; yes, that’s exactly what we said. > > Then the conservatives reposte with: no, you don’t understand anything - he’s a socialist! > > L. Right. He’s a socialist. Not in the sense you say, but that doesn’t matter, the fact that you think so makes him unelectable. > > C. You’re not listening. He’s a socialist. Socialist. Socialist. Socialist. That makes him unelectable. > > L. Exactly. He’s unelectable. > > C. No, you’re wrong. The right answer is that he’s unelectable. > > L. Isn’t that what we said? > > C. You’ve completely misstated our position. > > 513 days and counting. > > :)😕:eek::mad::rolleyes:🆒:p;):D:o:dubious::(:smack: I don’t think you understand. He’s a socialist. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2015, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/187 "2015-06-14T18:28:54Z")
Yes, **Siam Sam** , that’s true, but I think there’s a very important fact that you’re neglecting there. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/188 "2015-06-15T02:57:16Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Yes a majority of American Jews self-identify as liberal. > > And there are [liberals who are anti-semitic](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/06/us/debate-on-a-jewish-student-at-ucla.html). > > But Sanders lack of electability does not get to the point that his being Jewish would play a role. Or for that matter that some who support Israel would find him not so desirable … he is [rated](http://www.ontheissues.org/international/Bernie_Sanders_Foreign_Policy.htm) “+2 by AAI, indicating pro-Arab pro-Palestine voting record.” > > He is not electable because is (minimally perceived as) too left of center for most Democrats, let alone for most in this country. He is not electable because even if he was not he does not have the war chest that the battle requires and would be unlikely to acquire one. > > He is able to articulate some positions that benefit from his ability to express them well. I am glad he is in process. But he cannot win. No problem with any of the above. I was pretty much only interested in countering what I saw as **Terr** ’s _a priori_ insistence that to be liberal is to be antisemitic. I’ll leave it there. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/189 "2015-06-15T03:04:45Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > No problem with any of the above. I was pretty much only interested in countering what I saw as **Terr** ’s _a priori_ insistence that to be liberal is to be antisemitic. My statement was that there is virulent anti-Semitism infecting the left. How exactly does that translate to “to be liberal is to be antisemitic”? ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/190 "2015-06-15T03:09:04Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > My statement was that there is virulent anti-Semitism infecting the left. Can you support that claim? ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/191 "2015-06-15T03:25:52Z")
Which one, the claim about the putative antisemitism, or the claim that he made such a statement? ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/192 "2015-06-15T03:28:19Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Can you support that claim? DSeid just gave you [an example](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/06/us/debate-on-a-jewish-student-at-ucla.html). That crap is widespread on the left. Sometimes they masquerade it as “anti-Zionism”. But that cover is very thin. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/193 "2015-06-15T07:41:35Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > DSeid just gave you [an example](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/06/us/debate-on-a-jewish-student-at-ucla.html). That crap is widespread on the left. Sometimes they masquerade it as “anti-Zionism”. But that cover is very thin. UCLA is “the left”? That is [absurd on the face of it](http://hlcole.bol.ucla.edu/NewDealucla.pdf). Start a thread in GD, or perhaps the Pit, make your case, you and **DSeid** are failing here, and I will no longer take part in this hijack. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/194 "2015-06-15T13:50:15Z")
Anti-Semitism is virulent by nature, wherever it’s found, and it unfortunately infects all aspects of society. I question the premise that it’s any worse on the Left than on the Right. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/195 "2015-06-15T14:48:42Z")
I doubt it’s any worse, but I also doubt it is much better. Witness the unfortunate Rev. Wright and his belief that it was “them Jews” who were keeping him away from Obama, Cynthia McKinney blaming her election losses on Jews, and various [fringe groups](http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2014/02/19/entrenched-anti-semitic-views-very-rare-among-whites-and-asian-americans-common-among-blacks-and-latinos/)and [individual nutcases](http://freebeacon.com/politics/democratic-operative-caught-on-tape-in-anti-semitic-rant/). I suspect the person trying to push the dual citizenship thing against Bernie Sanders on the fraudulent Internet list was trying to accuse Sanders of loyalty to Israel above loyalty to the US. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/196 "2015-06-15T15:11:46Z")
There [was](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rahm_Emanuel) a Jew keeping Wright away from Obama, and it was probably in the best interest of all concerned. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/197 "2015-06-15T18:34:35Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Anti-Semitism is virulent by nature, wherever it’s found, and it unfortunately infects all aspects of society. I question the premise that it’s any worse on the Left than on the Right. Can you point to a post on this thread that was based on that premise? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/198 "2015-06-15T19:09:51Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Can you point to a post on this thread that was based on that premise? Can you point to anything else Diane Rehm ever posted or wrote or said in her 40 years that smacked of racism? Come on, there’s tonnes of material there, and a hundred blogs attacking her for her faux-pas. Some\*one _must have found some_thing \*else that points to being a bigoted racist. (nb- I checked, and from reading about a dozen of them- no one has found _anything_. Not one jot or tittle. ) There is also a _huge_ difference between not liking the somewhat bigoted policies of Israel and being anti-Semitic. Unless of course you’re one of those that responds to every critique of the Administration or Congress by saying “why do you hate America?”:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/199 "2015-06-15T19:10:25Z")
It was strongly implied when you asserted that anti-Semitism is “widespread” on the left. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014/200 "2015-06-15T19:30:49Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It was strongly implied when you asserted that anti-Semitism is “widespread” on the left. It is. See [http://www.wiesenthal.com/atf/cf/{54d385e6-f1b9-4e9f-8e94-890c3e6dd277}/REPORT\_313.PDF](http://www.wiesenthal.com/atf/cf/%7B54d385e6-f1b9-4e9f-8e94-890c3e6dd277%7D/REPORT_313.PDF) Or this doc describing widespread anti-semitism on [moveon.org](http://moveon.org) site: [$250,000 USDT For Sale](http://www.stentorian.com/MoveOn/moveon_hate.doc) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-again-why-bernie-sanders-isnt-electable/722014.md?page=11)