# Tell me more about English beer **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** beer\ **Created:** [December 23, 2020, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763 "2020-12-23T19:22:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2022, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/81 "2022-12-29T08:24:58Z")
Yes, I was going to say [hop pillows](https://remedygrove.com/wellness/Sleep-Deeper-with-Hops-A-Natural-Cure-to-Insomnia) are a thing for some people. Bit of social history: spending a week or two “hopping” in Kent used to be the nearest poorer people in south and east London got to a holiday, until wages and paid leave improved: > **[Forgotten Stories: hop-picking in the fields of Kent - London's Royal Docks](https://londonsroyaldocks.com/forgotten-stories-hop-picking-fields-kent/)** > > For many Royal Docks area families it was their only holiday. The working and living conditions would have today’s ‘elf and safety police up in arms. But as journalist and historian Colin Grainger recalls, it’s almost impossible to find anyone who... ---
**Author:** ![Made\_in\_Macau](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eada6e/32.png) [@Made\_in\_Macau](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Made_in_Macau)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2022, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/82 "2022-12-30T13:52:08Z")
I came in to say Sam Smith’s - but many posters got there first 2 yrs ago. Assuming you mean British beers I’d like to eulogise for Brains beers. I grew up in Cardiff and the brewery was in the middle of the city. The yeast/hops smell from the brewery was a constant in my childhood and adolescence. The brewery was not small, but not national either - not even in Wales. It had pubs all around the city and some across the south Wales coast, selling 3 varieties - Bitter, Dark or SA - the tradition being the breweries best bitter is named after the brewer - Stanley Arthur Brains. SA was my beer of choice, although it’s strength meant it was often called ‘Skull Attack’, I loved that beer. After living in Cumbria for the last 25 years (good to see the cumbrian beers mentioned above - plus Jennings beers from the town of Cockermouth…) I was in Cardiff in the summer and had a pint that I’d been looking forward to with some anticipation. It was crap. Worse, it was different. It transpired Brains had sold out to one of the UK’s biggest beer producers and they’d wrung the neck of their golden goose. This is obviously not a unique story, but it made me sad in a Proustian way. So I’ll raise a bottle of Samuel Smith’s best bitter to all you beer lovers instead. MiM ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2022, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/83 "2022-12-30T20:22:33Z")
I used to love Newcastle Brown Ale when it was imported here to the U.S. But, they stopped importing the English version here a few years ago, and instead, apparently licensed the name to Lagunitas Brewing, which introduced a new (and completely different) beer in the U.S., under the Newcastle Brown Ale name. Highly disappointing. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2022, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/84 "2022-12-30T20:57:35Z")
Yeah upthread, I mention buying both when they transitioned from the English to the Lagunitas formulation. Having them side by side, yes, they are not at all the same, so if you liked the OG Newcastle, you will be disappointed by the Lagunitas formulation. I didn’t like the original, so I preferred the new one, but I don’t understand changing the flavor so much and alienating all the people who enjoyed it. I can’t imagine they’d pick up more new drinkers of it to make up for the ones they lost, but I could be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Treppenwitz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treppenwitz/32/3445_2.png) [@Treppenwitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Treppenwitz)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2022, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/85 "2022-12-30T21:09:02Z")
> [@Made\_in\_Macau](#): > > …After living in Cumbria for the last 25 years (good to see the cumbrian beers mentioned above - **plus Jennings beers from the town of Cockermouth** …) I was in Cardiff in the summer and had a pint that I’d been looking forward to with some anticipation. It was crap. Worse, it was different. It transpired Brains had sold out to one of the UK’s biggest beer producers and they’d wrung the neck of their golden goose. > This is obviously not a unique story… My bold. Now you have me confused. > **[Jennings brewery: Doors shut on 200 years of brewing history](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cumbria-63472653)** > > The Jennings brewery site on the River Cocker is being sold for £750,000 by owner Carlsberg Marston. Unless this has been reversed and I missed it, Jennings brewery is no more. The old, old story. j ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2022, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/86 "2022-12-30T21:12:26Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I didn’t like the original, so I preferred the new one, but I don’t understand changing the flavor so much and alienating all the people who enjoyed it. - Usually, corporate idiocy. Though I would have thought that a smaller brewery like Lagunitas wouldn’t be as likely to pull that crap. WAG-the ingredients in the original Newcastle aren’t available here, specifically the hops though the water might also be a factor. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2022, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/87 "2022-12-30T21:13:54Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I didn’t like the original, so I preferred the new one, but I don’t understand changing the flavor so much and alienating all the people who enjoyed it. My guess is that they decided to create a formulation that was more in line with what they thought American beerdrinker palates would like. It’s less sweet than the original, now uses American hops (with a slightly higher IBU score), and has a stronger, smoky/roasted flavor. The articles below also quote Lagunitas/Heineken spokespeople that U.S. sales for Newcastle (and brown ales in general) had been declining, and they made the change in an attempt to reinvigorate the brand. > **[Lagunitas Begins Brewing Newcastle Brown Ale | Beverage Dynamics](https://beveragedynamics.com/2019/02/07/lagunitas-begins-brewing-newcastle-brown-ale/)** > > Two breweries owned by Heineken USA are collaborating. The company has announced the March 2019 relaunch of Newcastle Brown Ale, brewed by Lagunitas > **[Newcastle Brown Ale takes unlikely journey — from import to craft, from...](https://www.chicagotribune.com/dining/drink/ct-food-newcastle-brown-ale-lagunitas-20190314-story.html)** > > Newcastle Brown Ale was long known as a British import in the U.S., but faltering sales led to its reinvention as an American craft beer by Lagunitas. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2022, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/88 "2022-12-30T21:15:37Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Though I would have thought that a smaller brewery like Lagunitas wouldn’t be as likely to pull that crap. TIL that Heineken bought a 50% stake in Lagunitas in 2015, then bought it outright two years later. Lagunitas then began brewing their new, American Newcastle recipe in 2019. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/89 "2022-12-31T00:48:13Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I love beer, but my experience is somewhat limited beyond what’s universally available in the US – a handful of local and regional craft brewers (Great Lakes Brewing is one of my favorites) If you’re drinking beers from the Great Lakes brewery, you don’t need to look to foreign countries. I mean, you’ve got access to Elliot Ness Amber Lager, Dortmunder Gold, a nice Irish Ale… and Edmund Fitzgerald _NITRO,_ dude! My local tavern always has two Great Lakes beers on tap. No other brewery except New Glarus (we’re in Wisconsin, we have to have Spotted Cow, it’s a law). ---
**Author:** ![Treppenwitz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treppenwitz/32/3445_2.png) [@Treppenwitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Treppenwitz)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/90 "2022-12-31T10:26:32Z")
More on Newcastle Brown. I’ve posted on these boards before (but not in this thread) about how it used to have a unique “twisty” taste. For some reason, today I remembered that Lunatics’ Broth\* was originally a blend of two beers, one of which was Newcastle Amber (which used to be commercially available); and another, stronger beer which was never sold to the public. [Here’s a discussion regarding this](https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=3224.0). It seems that at some point this practice stopped (cost reduction, anyone?) but my WAG is that at least a token effort was made to match the original peculiarity of the flavor. If Lagunitas are not invested in that history, perhaps it’s not a surprise that their version tastes different. j \* - historically the local name - don’t blame me. NB that Theakston’s Old Peculier seems to have also been referred to in the same way. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/91 "2022-12-31T13:07:25Z")
> [@Treppenwitz](#): > > about how it used to have a unique “twisty” taste. What is “twisty” supposed to evoke? I honestly have no idea what is meant by that. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/92 "2022-12-31T13:30:50Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > > [@Treppenwitz](#): > > > > about how it used to have a unique “twisty” taste. > > What is “twisty” supposed to evoke? I honestly have no idea what is meant by that. - It’s how you can tell the beer hasn’t gone off. It takes on a “bendy” flavor if it has. :flees: ---
**Author:** ![its\_the\_daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/bb73d2/32.png) [@its\_the\_daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/its_the_daddy)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/93 "2022-12-31T13:33:24Z")
Don’t know about ‘twisty’, but here’s the song we used to sing in the folk clubs in the '60’s > **[Brown Ale Crazy](http://www.ed-pickford.co.uk/brownalecrazy.html)** > > Mike Elliott routine from 'Out of the Brown' 1977 ---
**Author:** ![Treppenwitz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treppenwitz/32/3445_2.png) [@Treppenwitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Treppenwitz)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/94 "2022-12-31T14:38:24Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > What is “twisty” supposed to evoke? Yeah, well… it was as if the various flavors didn’t combine as a whole, but rather remained separate and wrapped around each other. If that makes any sense. Forty odd years ago, it really was a unique beer. j ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/95 "2022-12-31T15:39:13Z")
I believe the term people might be looking for is “parti-gyle.” _In short: Parti-gyling means getting multiple beers out of the same mash. The brewer boils successive runnings separately, and then, ideally, blends them to different strengths._ ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/96 "2022-12-31T17:34:52Z")
Is that what happens with Newcastle Brown? Is “parti-gyle” like where you brew your main beer and then get a “small beer” (I know Anchor Brewing, if it doesn’t still, at least used to sell a small beer.) ETA: Oh, or wait – in this technique it all gets blended into the same beer, I guess? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/97 "2022-12-31T17:40:00Z")
Into several different beers, usually. It was a standard brewing method “back in the day.” Making a small beer out of a secondary mash is just good business sense when you have to stretch your grain supplies. I’ve done it with a barleywine mash before. I have no idea whether or not Newcastle ever did such a thing for their brown crap. It just seemed to me to be what folks might have been talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Treppenwitz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treppenwitz/32/3445_2.png) [@Treppenwitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Treppenwitz)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2022, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763/98 "2022-12-31T18:06:32Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Is that what happens with Newcastle Brown? In the days when Newcastle Brown was a blend, no. The stronger of the two beers was aged before being used in the blend, so it would (obviously) have to be a separate mash. j [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tell-me-more-about-english-beer/928763.md?page=4)