# Telltale signs someone is marrying just for the green card **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 6, 2015, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363 "2015-07-06T01:09:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![drachillix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/48db29/32.png) [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/21 "2015-07-06T22:50:38Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > There are some serious ramifications to this, because it’s technically possible that this immigrant might not be a total hottie or could even be flat-chested. “Mail order brides” in the way they are commonly perceived are not possible anymore at least in the US and or flat illegal (running afoul of human trafficking laws). In most cases at bare minimum you have to go visit them in the home country and be prepared to provide evidence of an in person relationship. For example, I am most likely going to end up married to a Philippine woman that I spent a couple weeks with recently. The process to bring her over assuming all paperwork is completed properly and approved can easily run around $2k and take up to a year. Thats not counting airfare and such. ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/22 "2015-07-07T01:38:25Z")
> [@drachillix](#): > > For example, I am most likely going to end up married to a Philippine woman that I spent a couple weeks with recently. Here’s another factor that isn’t discussed in polite company. You’re probably a slightly overweight, middle aged white guy. The small quantity of young, skinny American women have better prospects available - super tall, super good looking, super rich American men. But, compared to the breeding pool a woman in the Phillipines has available, you’re a. taller b. better looking (for some reason asians seem to want to look like caucasions, not sure if this is a glitch in human brains or cultural. In animal mating experiments, it has been discovered that you can create artificially attractive fake animals that females want more than anything available to them.) c. You’ve got bigger feet…and a bigger dick. d. You’re brash and more confident, even if timid by USA standards e. You’re rich with a cushy job, even if only middle income by USA standards ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/23 "2015-07-07T02:43:12Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Yah, INS is very very suspicious. I always tell the story of my aunt, who married very late in life (47) and thus had a tiny wedding. The INS official asked to watch the video of the wedding, and came back, saying, “We think this is not a real wedding. We know Hindus have huge weddings, with tons of people, and you only have a dozen people here.” And they were forced to submit additional proofs. > > You can’t just hop back and forth, either. This. The son of a friend married a Russian (not from an ad, she was a doctor) and the INS wanted to see evidence of their relationship over there before she moved here to be married. My daughter married a German, much less of a hassle since they don’t seem to get a lot of Germans trying to sneak into the US. (His paperwork in Frankfurt got done ahead of the date promised!) The INS is on to the obvious scams. ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/24 "2015-07-07T03:34:34Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > This. The son of a friend married a Russian (not from an ad, she was a doctor) and the INS wanted to see evidence of their relationship over there before she moved here to be married. I wonder what the INS examiner would say if you brought in a homemade sex tape on a portable DVD player… ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/25 "2015-07-07T04:47:21Z")
Why does everyone assume that: 1. All marriages are hetero (gotcha!) 2. It is always the female who needs the “Green Card” ? In my experience, it was (IT contract house) males who made sure they located some local talent to (hopefully) marry soon so they could sell their services on the open market (~30% more than they were being paid). ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/26 "2015-07-07T05:39:19Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Why does everyone assume that: > > 1. All marriages are hetero (gotcha!) > 2. It is always the female who needs the “Green Card” > ? Because it’s usually true. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/27 "2015-07-07T07:24:44Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Why does everyone assume that: > > 1. All marriages are hetero (gotcha!) > 2. It is always the female who needs the “Green Card” And that, moreover, the female is necessarily some beautiful Russian. > [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > I don’t know anything about local whores, that’s true. It also wasn’t really my point. My point was green card marriages aren’t necessarily between whores and desperate men who only get to have sex if they pay a prostitute. A green card marriage could just as likely be a 35 year old physical therapist from the Philippines who marries his American friend Jill so he can stay in the country. Not to mention that if you sponsor someone for a green card through marriage you’re financially responsible to support that person for I think about ten years, or until he or she has become economically self-reliant for two years–_even if you get divorced_. The idea of someone sponsoring _anyone_ for a green card–regardless of appearances–as a means of getting sex is simply ludicrous. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/28 "2015-07-07T07:46:25Z")
Knowing people on the other side, those applying for green cards in the USA, fraudulently it seems the vast majority go through a dual citizen spouse selling their services. One was the fifth such spouse, each divorced exactly 2 years on the dot when the green card become permanent. No one is really looking to marry a native American. \*Just for the laugh I was told by an immigration officer I was the only US citizen she knew of \ having applied for a “green card” AKA permanent residency in this country. I guess I’m doing it wrong, doh! ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/29 "2015-07-07T12:36:14Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > One of the big signs is that one of the two needs a green card. That’s like saying one of the signs that a person is criminal is that they are black. Just as most black folks aren’t criminals, most folks who want green cards aren’t marrying just to get it (with the marriage being only a marriage on paper, and an preformed intent to divorce in a few years). > [@Habeed](#): > > I don’t know about you gents, but if I had such an arrangement, I’d swagger into my social circles and flat out brag about it. I’m getting to sleep with a slamming hottie and she’s got a sexy accent to boot. Hard to see what the issue is. If sex and living together for years and years (and even having kids) are part of the arrangement, that sure doesn’t look like “marriage just for the green card;” that just looks like an ordinary marriage. If you’re intent on committing immigration fraud, it’s more typical for money to change hands at some point, or some other kind of payment (in [The Proposal,](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Proposal_(film)) the motive was career advancement). And immigration fraud is frowned upon by USCIS. If you brag about it, you might expect them to investigate, and if they think you’re faking it, the citizen can be fined/jailed, and the immigrant can be deported. I married a Japanese woman ten years ago. Shortly after we got married she applied for “conditional” green-card status. We had to apply a couple of years later to get the “conditional” removed, and that required submitting proof that our marriage was more than just a paper license. We never had to go through the sort of intensive scrutiny that was comically portrayed at the end of the movie The Proposal, but we had to (among other things) submit letters from friends and family confirming that we lived as a couple (i.e. not just living together, but also engaging in activities together outside the home). So what are the signs that might make the USCIS suspicious of a sham green-card marriage? I’d suggest these, for starters: -the marriage partners spend little time together (compared to a typical couple) -they know little about each other -they don’t live together -the immigrant transferred a big chunk of money to the citizen at some point -timing (the immigrant’s visa was about to expire just after the wedding) -a cheap wedding, or even just a civil ceremony None of these things is concrete _proof,_ but if you’re a USCIS agent, and you see a few of these things, you’re probably going to call the couple in for an interview and start asking lots of uncomfortable questions. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/30 "2015-07-07T14:40:36Z")
I know someone who married for a green card. I don’t know the details, only that he was already in the US and wanted to stay. So a friend agreed to “marry” him. I don’t know what she got out of it. When they were interviewed by the INS, they were separately asked questions and their answers compared. One question he was asked was what the color of her underwear. He said he never noticed. Anyway, he got his green card, divorced her, married another American woman and has two kids and a law practice. I assume he got his law degree in the US, maybe even before the marriage. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/31 "2015-07-07T15:44:55Z")
I have been asked more times than I care to tell (four) to marry someone to get them a green card. The earliest was when I was seventeen. :eek: And at a later time they offered me $1000. I was offended. Only a grand??? ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/32 "2015-07-07T21:19:49Z")
> [@Habeed](#): > > My point was that in the long term, the local whores aren’t cheaper. Sort of like how buying a new car or getting a longer term lease is cheaper than renting the same car from the car rental place. > > In the market for women, hourly prostitutes are more expensive per hour than “mistresses” who are like a longer term lease, and marriages for the money are the cheaper on an hourly basis. > > In terms of up-front and total cost, obviously, the relationship is inverted - the wife is much, much, much more expensive than the other 2, but if she stays a decade or more and does a lot of work, it is cheaper. > > Of course, sometimes leasing a car is actually cheaper than buying. In the case of women, that’s probably often the case. I’m wondering where you get the idea that the marriage will be one big Sex-a-Rama. As you will note from the other posts, the blushing bride is usually not at home. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Nylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Mr.Nylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Nylock)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/33 "2015-07-07T21:25:50Z")
I just wish I could post all the Facebook updates regarding this acquaintance and his wife for SDMB perusal. But, alas, such a thing would be wrong on many levels. Anyhow; the guy is totally infatuated with his foreign woman - it’s not just a sex thing. My idea about it being a green card, visa thing is probably kind of stupid - for reasons noted by many posters above. On the other hand the story of this guy and his wife is eerily similar to the anecdotes by some of the posters about a man falling head over heels for a swindling woman. But what is she after then? He’s not wealthy. I can’t come up with anything else. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/34 "2015-07-08T13:27:58Z")
> [@Mr.Nylock](#): > > On the other hand the story of this guy and his wife is eerily similar to the anecdotes by some of the posters about a man falling head over heels for a swindling woman. > > But what is she after then? He’s not wealthy. I can’t come up with anything else. She doesn’t have to be after him for wealth, just financial security and a reasonable assurance he will not step out on her might be enough. Men deride women for being “golddiggers” and conveniently forget that in the West until a couple of generations ago that was the only financial security we had (our husband’s) and in other places, still might be the only or the majority of it. ---
**Author:** ![moojja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e5b9ba/32.png) [@moojja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moojja)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/35 "2015-07-08T15:45:01Z")
> [@Mr.Nylock](#): > > I just wish I could post all the Facebook updates regarding this acquaintance and his wife for SDMB perusal. But, alas, such a thing would be wrong on many levels. > > Anyhow; the guy is totally infatuated with his foreign woman - it’s not just a sex thing. > > My idea about it being a green card, visa thing is probably kind of stupid - for reasons noted by many posters above. > > On the other hand the story of this guy and his wife is eerily similar to the anecdotes by some of the posters about a man falling head over heels for a swindling woman. > > But what is she after then? He’s not wealthy. I can’t come up with anything else. Is she treating him badly? What makes you think she is using him besides the fact she is a lot better looking? Because if he is over the moon for her and treats her really well, why wouldn’t she want to marry someone like that? She might think of herself lucky for finding someone great. From you OP it just sounds like they have a slightly unconventional marriage. Do you know even know why she’s going home so often? Is her parents sick, does she have job, or other responsibility in her home country? I know a lot of married couples (Asian/Mexican) who have lived apart for a certain amount of time. It usually due to outside pressures, like money, jobs, family responsibilities, or even visa issues. They don’t all like it, but none of them thought of it deal breaker. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2015, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/36 "2015-07-09T12:04:19Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > I don’t know anything about local whores, that’s true. It also wasn’t really my point. My point was green card marriages aren’t necessarily between whores and desperate men who only get to have sex if they pay a prostitute. A green card marriage could just as likely be a 35 year old physical therapist from the Philippines who marries his American friend Jill so he can stay in the country. None of the cases i know were for money. In every case, the American was helping a friend. None of the aliens involved was especially hot, but that didn’t matter because (in two the three cases) sex wasn’t part of the deal. > [@Habeed](#): > > Here’s another factor that isn’t discussed in polite company. You’re probably a slightly overweight, middle aged white guy. The small quantity of young, skinny American women have better prospects available - super tall, super good looking, super rich American men. > > But, compared to the breeding pool a woman in the Phillipines has available, you’re > a. taller > b. better looking (for some reason asians seem to want to look like caucasions, not sure if this is a glitch in human brains or cultural. In animal mating experiments, it has been discovered that you can create artificially attractive fake animals that females want more than anything available to them.) > c. You’ve got bigger feet…and a bigger dick. > d. You’re brash and more confident, even if timid by USA standards > e. You’re rich with a cushy job, even if only middle income by USA standards you left out an important point. American men rarely beat their wives, and face both social and legal disapproval they do. At least, a gay guy who lived in Taiwan for a few years said all his single female friends thought that was a benefit of dating Americans. “They are so nice” was the code word. I have a friend who married a Filipina recently, and was pretty much exactly what you describe. And that’s exactly why he decided to date overseas. He spelled it all out to me before he started. His wasn’t a mail order bride. It was more like long-distance internet dating. When he found a women he thought he might love, he flew over to date in person. Eventually, he married an attractive young doctor. As far as I can tell, they are happy together. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Nylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Mr.Nylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Nylock)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2015, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363/37 "2015-07-10T00:10:34Z")
> [@moojja](#): > > Is she treating him badly? What makes you think she is using him besides the fact she is a lot better looking? Because if he is over the moon for her and treats her really well, why wouldn’t she want to marry someone like that? She might think of herself lucky for finding someone great. From you OP it just sounds like they have a slightly unconventional marriage. > Do you know even know why she’s going home so often? Is her parents sick, does she have job, or other responsibility in her home country? > I know a lot of married couples (Asian/Mexican) who have lived apart for a certain amount of time. It usually due to outside pressures, like money, jobs, family responsibilities, or even visa issues. They don’t all like it, but none of them thought of it deal breaker. It’s not like she’s particularly great looking - but he is a particularly unattrtractive person IME. The whole attractiveness thing is really just a small portion of the whole equation - it’s more of an after thought that stems form other things. It’s like he always writes on Facebook about his wife is coming home - and then she has to stay longer - that’s the thing. I get this sense of someone not really making an effort to come home and just finding one stop gap measure after another to delay it. They have been married for two years and it seems as if she has not met any of his family, and he spends a lot of time with his family from what I can tell. The whole thing just doesn’t pass the smell test. Usually I just tend to assume that people in relationships are happy with each other; I tend to have rose tinted glasses in that subject. So, for me to have this pervasive sense that something is amiss in this in this relationship means that the thought has worked its way through many layers of blissfully ignorant denseness regarding relationships and marriages. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/telltale-signs-someone-is-marrying-just-for-the-green-card/724363.md?page=1)