# Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles Season 2 thread \[open spoilers after it airs\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 24, 2008, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000 "2008-09-24T15:39:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![Flander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8c91f0/32.png) [@Flander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flander)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/401 "2008-12-05T18:28:43Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > God, I hate puns. Man, you are on the wrong message board! 😛 Back to the OP, I’m curious to see what Riley’s role is in all this. How many more episodes? ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/402 "2008-12-05T18:38:49Z")
> [@Flander](#): > > Back to the OP, I’m curious to see what Riley’s role is in all this. How many more episodes? We are at the exact halfway point, so 11 more episodes. I too want to know what Riley’s full game is. Hopefully it comes back for even more with a season 3. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/403 "2008-12-05T19:01:59Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > No, it was actually a very bad one. Most of my objections made perfect sense, to be honest. No, to be honest, I was correct the first time. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/404 "2008-12-05T19:06:50Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > No, it was actually a very bad one. Most of my objections made perfect sense, to be honest. Well, let’s see… > [@](#): > > 1. What fucking library were they in? Library of Congress of our Imagination? Agreed. Way too much physical data, way too readily available. I can understand them being able to pull up the things they did on the internet, but the actual physical papers? Not so much. > [@](#): > > 1. So let me get this straight, the Dillinger-nator is on a mission to kill the Governor of California (inside joke? Governator?)…in 2010. But he is sent back to the wrong time. When was he supposed to be sent back? Because it seems to me that the “plan” to build a building and wait in the walls for 60 years is pretty fucking stupid. That whole story was just stupid as hell and made no sense. Trying to interrupt the time stream as little as possible. If he hadn’t had the building built, maybe that guy wouldn’t have been elected governor. Who knows? > [@](#): > > 1. Terminator Glau is getting feelings. WTF?!?! I do not like this idiocy at all. It’s a learning processor. Makes them better terminators if they can act like human beings. It obviously helped Cameron in this episode, because otherwise the librarian wouldn’t have been as helpful. And next time she needs library access at 2 a.m., she’s got her next friend lined up. > [@](#): > > 1. So she did steal the lighter and John’s like. “Meh”. After he almost beat a guy to death over it. Again, he almost beat the guy to death because he didn’t lay off Riley. John obviously couldn’t care less about the lighter, before, during or after the fight. > [@](#): > > But how could the Terminator know that everything would continue as normal if he just did all that stuff he did to get the building built? I mean, buterfly’s wing and all that stuff. He couldn’t. All he had to go on was that he was supposed to kill the governor in that room in 2010, and that’s what he set out to do. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/405 "2008-12-05T19:24:48Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > Agreed. Way too much physical data, way too readily available. I can understand them being able to pull up the things they did on the internet, but the actual physical papers? Not so much. Eh, as a librarian, you’d be surprised what kind of stuff is available at a local history library with a decent enough budget. They also said it had at least four floors and a basement. If the LA Public Library can have an entire room of historial phone books ([http://www.lapl.org/central/history.html](http://www.lapl.org/central/history.html)), a fictional library can have all that stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/406 "2008-12-05T19:31:03Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > It’s a learning processor. Makes them better terminators if they can act like human beings. It obviously helped Cameron in this episode, because otherwise the librarian wouldn’t have been as helpful. And next time she needs library access at 2 a.m., she’s got her next friend lined up. If anything, I think this episode explicitly emphasized Cameron’s lack of feelings. She can learn and manipulate to achieve her end goals. However, no reaction to accidentally causing her library contact to commit suicide (which was strongly implied. Why have that whole bathroom conversation otherwise?) She just started manipulating the next contact. I liked this episode even though it was a break from the main story. It was getting hard to believe that a terminator with a mission was simply hanging around the house taking orders from a whiny dude and his neurotic mom. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/407 "2008-12-05T19:32:43Z")
> [@Folly](#): > > However, no reaction to accidentally causing her library contact to commit suicide (which was strongly implied. Why have that whole bathroom conversation otherwise?) Where are people getting this from? He had cancer and one day he didn’t come to work, so they had to call a temp. Wouldn’t the more likely explanation be that he’s in the hospital? ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/408 "2008-12-05T19:42:04Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Where are people getting this from? He had cancer and one day he didn’t come to work, so they had to call a temp. Wouldn’t the more likely explanation be that he’s in the hospital? Not in my opinion, but who knows. I think we won’t see that library guy again, and probably don’t even see the library again. Just a one off for this ep. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/409 "2008-12-05T19:50:56Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Where are people getting this from? He had cancer and one day he didn’t come to work, so they had to call a temp. Wouldn’t the more likely explanation be that he’s in the hospital? I agree we don’t know what happened. He killed himself, he’s just at the hospital, he’s home sick, he just quit - the thing is Cameron said he was her only friend but wasn’t particularly affected by his not being there. It took her all of one second to decide this new after-hours librarian will be her friend, which shows a distinct lack of true feelings, but an increasing understanding of how to fake them and make friends, IMO. I also agree it was mostly a stand-alone episode. It showed us Cameron doesn’t just stand still all night. She’s actively learning and protecting John all night long. I bet she’ll never tell John or Sarah she stopped another Terminator on her own. That autonomy makes her more interesting, to me. ---
**Author:** ![tr0psn4j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@tr0psn4j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tr0psn4j)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/410 "2008-12-05T22:12:58Z")
> [@](#): > > But how could the Terminator know that everything would continue as normal if he just did all that stuff he did to get the building built? I mean, buterfly’s wing and all that stuff. So he builds the building and hides in the walls. If the governor has the speech there, the terminator gets to complete his mission. If the speech doesn’t take place history has changed and the mission is now irrelevant. So it seems normal to me. Only thing that seemed like bad strategy was not going after John Connor instead of powering off until assassination day. That is unless killing the governor is more important than John Connor. Or why not kill great grandpa Connor in the 20s? How could that be any different than going after Sarah in T1. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2008, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/411 "2008-12-05T22:57:58Z")
If I may return to the Turk . . . This may be like playing chess with your young son; you want to string the game along enough for him to execute some strategy. You think ahead 20 moves, conforming to his various attempts. If the end-game is check-mating his king, a reasonably adept player can always make it happen in exactly 20 moves. An 888 from the future thinks all he needs to do in order to preserve the chain of his-story is to construct a building. Seems pretty “stark” to think that a dead magnate’s kid is summed up by an outdated art deco monstrosity. That’s why I think the whole “go back and kill J.C.'s great-grandma who was a nurse in the Crimean War” idea is flawed. The end-game for Skynet is jeopardized if the timeline is uncertain. Stark, BTW, explains Howard Roark entirely. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2008, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/412 "2008-12-06T02:48:57Z")
> [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](#): > > That’s why I think the whole “go back and kill J.C.'s great-grandma who was a nurse in the Crimean War” idea is flawed. The end-game for Skynet is jeopardized if the timeline is uncertain. Not to mention the fact that Skynet does not have this information. They know John Connor’s mother is named Sarah Connor and that she lives in LA. As T1 showed, they don’t even know which specific Sarah Connor. Figuring out his grandparents would be difficult and could lead to too much change in the timeline. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2008, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/413 "2008-12-07T14:41:10Z")
> [@tr0psn4j](#): > > So he builds the building and hides in the walls. If the governor has the speech there, the terminator gets to complete his mission. If the speech doesn’t take place history has changed and the mission is now irrelevant. So it seems normal to me. Only thing that seemed like bad strategy was not going after John Connor instead of powering off until assassination day. That is unless killing the governor is more important than John Connor. Or why not kill great grandpa Connor in the 20s? How could that be any different than going after Sarah in T1. Honestly? Because at this point it seems that John Connor is probably a big part of Skynet getting created. They all seem to be tied in together pretty tightly at this point. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2008, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/414 "2008-12-07T17:26:39Z")
Did anyone else think that Riley stole the lighter to get John into a conflict with the guy so that he would leave with her? Because John was getting pretty impatient and on the verge of leaving by himself. She did call John and told him originally that the guy was hassling her, then when John arrived, she seemed calm and wanted John to stay and party. Stealing the lighter and making sure John would get involved when the guy started hassling her seemed to be a good way to manipulate John into being alone with her so she could get more of the information that Jessie wanted from her. She’s already shown she can be as manipulative as Cameron in order to fulfill her goal. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2008, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/415 "2008-12-07T17:45:53Z")
I dunno. Jesse & Riley are from a future where John is spending too much time with, and taking too much counsel from Cameron. It seems their goal is to drive a wedge between John & Cameron and get him back on track, but in their future, how would they know what the right track is? Acting like a trouble making princess and getting John into juvenile high school fights seems like a stupid way to pull John away from Cameron. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2008, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/416 "2008-12-07T18:11:44Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > I dunno. Jesse & Riley are from a future where John is spending too much time with, and taking too much counsel from Cameron. It seems their goal is to drive a wedge between John & Cameron and get him back on track, but in their future, how would they know what the right track is? Acting like a trouble making princess and getting John into juvenile high school fights seems like a stupid way to pull John away from Cameron. She wanted to get John alone with her and get the information from him that Jessie is after. Getting that information to Jessie is what’s going to help drive a wedge between John and Cameron, not merely Riley getting John to spend time with her in the first place. To Riley’s mind (and she’s a juvenile herself, right?) getting John protective of her is what’s going to get him talking. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2008, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/417 "2008-12-07T19:40:44Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > Did anyone else think that Riley stole the lighter to get John into a conflict with the guy so that he would leave with her? Because John was getting pretty impatient and on the verge of leaving by himself. She did call John and told him originally that the guy was hassling her, then when John arrived, she seemed calm and wanted John to stay and party. Stealing the lighter and making sure John would get involved when the guy started hassling her seemed to be a good way to manipulate John into being alone with her so she could get more of the information that Jessie wanted from her. She’s already shown she can be as manipulative as Cameron in order to fulfill her goal. Oh, absolutely. I have no doubt whatsoever that it was totally intentional on her part. The thing is, do we know why Riley is involved in this yet? Is it just to get John a girlfriend that’s 100% organic matter because some people in the future think Cameron has too much influence on him, or is it something else? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2008, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/418 "2008-12-07T20:28:54Z")
If Riley wanted to leave with John, she could’ve just left with him when he showed up. If he wanted him to be protective, she could’ve lied and said one of the guys molested her or something. And if she wanted to invoke sympathy/protective feelings, she wouldn’t have shown off that she was a liar and pissed John off by showing off the lighter. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000/419 "2008-12-08T12:22:09Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > You don’t want everyone paying attention to the incredibly tall and attractive woman who just walked in the room or that scary monster of a man who just glares. Because the more they pay attention, the more likely they will notice something is off. Likeable yet instantly forgettable so to speak. > > Then again, we also probably wouldn’t watch a show like that. Maybe that’s the trick…y’know all those unremarkable sitcoms and young-adult dramadies that’ve been canceled before even getting through one season, over the last few years? In a few of them, if they’d lasted, the last episode or two would have been one of the ho-hum characters suddenly going on a killing spree and terminating most of the other characters as the nukes fall. The _finale_ was what the true show was about, all along…everything else was just a prologue; a massive cold opening. Entire seasons, holiday specials, Emmy nominations—all just a _cover_. The infiltration would just have been _that_ good. 😃 (Eh, it’s been almost a week since the ep aired, and I only just got to see it. That’s my contribution.) Anyway, how geeky am I? The first thing I thought after seeing the DillingeNator’s correct target date (other than wondering why he wasn’t more dusty…maybe he had _really_ good insulation in his building, or something): we now know for certain he wasn’t a Terminator sent from the original T1/T2 timeline, since he was attacking someone after the 1997 Judgement Day date. 😃 That’d actually be interesting, come to think of it, if the show wanted to try it…have a Terminator or resistance fighter show up or be discovered who was expecting JD back in the 90s, and was left directionless when Cyberdyne went down in flames and their mission became moot. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terminator-the-sarah-connor-chronicles-season-2-thread-open-spoilers-after-it-airs/465000.md?page=20)