# Terri Schiavo + 5 years **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 26, 2010, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872 "2010-03-26T14:18:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/181 "2010-04-03T01:09:44Z")
> [@LIONsob](#): > > Ají de Gallina > Back in post #86 of this thread I asked you a direct question that you have ignored, Have you ever had to make the decision to end the life support of someone that you cared about? > If you were put into that position would you carry out that persons request to end support even if it was against your religious beliefs? Sorry. No and no. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/182 "2010-04-03T01:22:44Z")
Hmm. As a service to your loved ones, you should probably have that tattooed on your forehead, just in case one of them starts thinking about giving you a medical PoA. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/183 "2010-04-03T01:30:52Z")
> [@Terraplane](#): > > Why so opposed then to letting somebody else go ‘home?’ I’m perfectly convinced that there was nothing left of Terri Schiavo besides her body, but even if I’m wrong, why would you prefer to keep somebody locked in the prison of their own unresponsive body for years before letting them go to this wonderful home you speak of? It is not my decision to make, and I am not sure there was nothing left of Terri, and I feel her parents should have been allowed to care for her body if they wanted. Terri herself was never in any danger, either in or out of her body. The fight was really over a body. The only difference being her husband couldn’t marry his mistress, and then there was the long shot that Terri just might wake up. That would have really stirred the stew. Stranger things have happened. Life is complicated. Nothing is simple. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/184 "2010-04-03T01:31:05Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > Sorry. > No and no. No as in you would resign as attorney, or no as in you would act as attorney contrary to the wishes of the person for whom you were acting? ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/185 "2010-04-03T01:31:31Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Hmm. As a service to your loved ones, you should probably have that tattooed on your forehead, just in case one of them starts thinking about giving you a medical PoA. I understood the question as having the responsibility suddenly given to me, without control. As a service to your loved ones you can tattoo on your forehead “I’m willing to pull the plug”. Everyone who’s ever spoken with me about this subject knows my position. Should anyone ask I would inform them of my beliefs and let them decide if I am a good option for them. And just before anyone says so, I know several people who would agree with me even if I’m not on their list. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/186 "2010-04-03T01:35:22Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Terri just might wake up Nonsense. You are ignoring the facts. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/187 "2010-04-03T01:46:37Z")
When it comes to POAs, a person can pick the attorney and give directions such as “pull the plug,” “do not pull the plug,” or “do what you think is best in accordance with your convictions.” It is a pity Shiavo did not have a POA, for that may have prevented the most disgusting special interest and politicial circus that arose. ---
**Author:** ![LIONsob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/76d3ee/32.png) [@LIONsob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LIONsob)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/188 "2010-04-03T02:36:53Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > Sorry. > No and no. I guess that says a lot about christian compassion! Sometime the responsability to make a final decision is forced upon a person with no warning and no way to avoid it and forcing your wants/beliefs on a terminaly ill or braindead person is just as cruel as torture. I hope that you never find yourself in the position of having to honor a loved ones last wishes, I am also glad that I am not related to you and that I will never have to trust you to carry out my last request. Peace LIONsob ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/189 "2010-04-03T03:01:19Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > It is not my decision to make, and I am not sure there was nothing left of Terri, and I feel her parents should have been allowed to care for her body if they wanted. Terri herself was never in any danger, either in or out of her body. The fight was really over a body. The only difference being her husband couldn’t marry his mistress, and then there was the long shot that Terri just might wake up. That would have really stirred the stew. Stranger things have happened. Life is complicated. Nothing is simple. Do you care about Terri’s own wishes? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/190 "2010-04-03T03:07:18Z")
As someone who’s been involved in that type of situation three times over the past six months – twice involving others, once undergoing rather elaborate surgery myself – I have only strengthened my convictions. And have told my family, friends, doctors, lawyers and anyone else that would listen, that the day I suffer brain-damage (beyond what I already have) and need to be kept artificially alive basically for the sole egotistical purposes of _others_ who’d like to deny death, that I WANT that plug pulled ASAP. Cruelty, egoism and a side of freak-show are not my bag. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/191 "2010-04-03T03:53:11Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Do you care about Terri’s own wishes? I think at this point, the answer is obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/192 "2010-04-03T04:11:58Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > It is not my decision to make, and I am not sure there was nothing left of Terri, and I feel her parents should have been allowed to care for her body if they wanted. Terri herself was never in any danger, either in or out of her body. The fight was really over a body. The only difference being her husband couldn’t marry his mistress, and then there was the long shot that Terri just might wake up. That would have really stirred the stew. Stranger things have happened. Life is complicated. Nothing is simple. Perhaps we should stop burying or cremating corpses? After all, they might wake up! Stranger things have happened. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/193 "2010-04-03T04:12:11Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > I’ll quote from the [Catechism of the Catholic Church](http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/ccc_toc.htm) (for it expresses my opionions in full): > > …Thus an act or omission which, of itself or by intention, **causes death in order to eliminate suffering constitutes a murder gravely contrary to the dignity of the human person and to the respect due to the living God, his Creator**. The error of judgment into which one can fall in good faith does not change the nature of this murderous act, which must always be forbidden and excluded… Simply insane bullshit. A horse with a broken leg gets more humane treatment – as in being put out of its misery. Jebus! When will this pre-medieval thinking go away? To think we’re in the 21th Century and it prevails amongst the willfully ignorant. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/194 "2010-04-03T04:38:33Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > then there was the long shot that Terri just might wake up. No. She. Never. Would. Wake. Up. She no longer had a brain. Just a mass of liquid in her skull. HOW many times does this have to be pointed out, **lekatt**? ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/195 "2010-04-03T05:01:38Z")
> [@LIONsob](#): > > I guess that says a lot about christian compassion! > Sometime the responsability to make a final decision is forced upon a person with no warning and no way to avoid it and forcing your wants/beliefs on a terminaly ill or braindead person is just as cruel as torture. > I hope that you never find yourself in the position of having to honor a loved ones last wishes, I am also glad that I am not related to you and that I will never have to trust you to carry out my last request. > Peace > LIONsob It says more about your lack of understanding about compassion and reading comprehension. If the person has such clear instructions, I don’t know why they need me. The idea that a person forcing his beliefs on me (making me pull the plug when I don’t want to) is somehow better than me forcing mine, is ridiculous (even if I’m not forcing anything). How do you know we are not related? I always wonder in these debates why anythyng else I dying person does is always legally suspect (buying, selling, marrying, writing wills). > [@RedFury](#): > > Simply insane bullshit. A horse with a broken leg gets more humane treatment – as in being put out of its misery. > > Jebus! When will this pre-medieval thinking go away? To think we’re in the 21th Century and it prevails amongst the willfully ignorant. You did read the whole quote, didn’t you? I’d rather you did not call me willfully ignorant without explaining specifically what it is I am ignorant of. Is it more humane to kill rather than alleviate pain? ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/196 "2010-04-03T05:10:14Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > Is it more humane to kill rather than alleviate pain? I am of the OPINION (and that’s all it is) that yes, sometimes it may be a kindness. A favorite uncle of mine developed cancer. It hit him fast. It hit him bad. The doctors kept giving him stronger and stronger drugs, eventually morphine. The problem is, as the cancer progressed, pain killers had less and less effect. The only good thing about it was, he went fast. So. What happens when the pain killers aren’t working anymore, and the disease has progressed to the point that the person is simply dying? Prolong the agony? I would say no. There comes a time when the ONLY decent thing to do, is to let go. Anything less is cruel and barbaric. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/197 "2010-04-03T05:12:59Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > I am of the OPINION (and that’s all it is) that yes, sometimes it may be a kindness. A favorite uncle of mine developed cancer. It hit him fast. It hit him bad. The doctors kept giving him stronger and stronger drugs, eventually morphine. The problem is, as the cancer progressed, pain killers had less and less effect. The only good thing about it was, he went fast. So. What happens when the pain killers aren’t working anymore, and the disease has progressed to the point that the person is simply dying? Prolong the agony? I would say no. **There comes a time when the ONLY decent thing to do, is to let go.** Anything less is cruel and barbaric. (my bolding) Agreed. ---
**Author:** ![rolandgunslinger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/cdc98d/32.png) [@rolandgunslinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rolandgunslinger)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/198 "2010-04-03T05:28:31Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > No. She. Never. Would. Wake. Up. > > She no longer had a brain. Just a mass of liquid in her skull. HOW many times does this have to be pointed out, **lekatt**? Let me get this out of the way. I honestly believe the poor woman was brain dead. But, how does ones brain become a mass of liquid? I’m not trying to be snarky. I’m just curious. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/199 "2010-04-03T05:34:08Z")
> [@rolandgunslinger](#): > > Let me get this out of the way. I honestly believe the poor woman was brain dead. But, how does ones brain become a mass of liquid? I’m not trying to be snarky. I’m just curious. Excess spinal fluid around an atrophied brain? Tissue degeneration? I’m just supposing. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872/200 "2010-04-03T06:06:41Z")
> [@Aji de Gallina](#): > > I always wonder in these debates why anythyng else I dying person does is always legally suspect (buying, selling, marrying, writing wills). In the first place, plenty of dying people do those things and their actions are held to be legally valid (do you really imagine that dying people in general aren’t legally allowed to make wills, if they’re mentally competent?). In the second place, we’re talking about decisions people made **before** they were dying. If a healthy person expresses a preference not to be kept on life-support in a permanent vegetative state, then it seems to me that if that person eventually ends up in a permanent vegetative state, that preference should be respected by family members and caregivers. Yes, I agree that it’s smart for a healthy person to state their preference explicitly and officially in a legal document, but I don’t see why being brain-dead should somehow make it “legally suspect” for a person to have rejected the option of life support back when they **weren’t** brain-dead. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terri-schiavo-5-years/533872.md?page=11)