# Terrorist bombing in Bali **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 13, 2002, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058 "2002-10-13T05:37:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![kevlaw](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kevlaw/32/2281_2.png) [@kevlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kevlaw)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/41 "2002-10-14T06:25:54Z")
> [@](#): > > Indonesia, I understand, has been something of a haven for Muslim loonies, at least partly because they have considerable sympathy amongst the Indonesian population. But this is shitting in thier own nest! One thing important fact about Bali - it is Hindu. It is one of the few islands in Indonesia that is not Muslim. ---
**Author:** ![reprise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@reprise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/reprise)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/42 "2002-10-14T06:44:53Z")
As **kevlaw** pointed out, Bali is predominantly Hindu. Even though Indonesia as a whole is largely Muslim, the majority of the Muslim population there are moderate. The call for blood from the Red Cross has now been made [official](http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,5284102%255E1702,00.html). ---
**Author:** ![Dave\_Stewart\_v3.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac91a4/32.png) [@Dave\_Stewart\_v3.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dave_Stewart_v3.0)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 7:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/43 "2002-10-14T07:07:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by reprise \* > \*\*Just a reference point for those in the Northern Hemisphere. There is no burns unit in Bali, and its major hospital has the capacity to accept 10 bodies in its mortuary. > > The nearest tertiary care trauma centre to Indonesia is in Darwin, also doesn’t have the facilities or personnel to cope with this number of burns patients all at once - which is why personnel and equipment are being flown in from all over the country (Darwin is a LONG way from any other major city in Australia). > \*\* Reports say burns victims are being transported to Royal Perth Hospital, which has a special burns unit. Darwin does not have this. People with shrapnel and glass wounds are being sent to other suburban Perth hospitals. One person is reported to have died in the air. The first flight to Perth was half-filled, because of the seriousness of the injuries of the people on board. > [@](#): > > \*\* > In addition, many of the patients arriving have had no burns specific treatment. The reports we are getting indicate that many are being triaged in the open air - the nearest location which can even begin to deal with their specific medical needs is Darwin (those well enough are now being transferred from Darwin to Adelaide), and that treatment is being started way beyond the optimum “window” to commence treatment for serious burns. > > Far and away the majority of patients who have been medivaced to date have been Australian - a handful have been from other first world nations. Let’s please spare a thought for those who have little or no hope of being evacuated out to first world medical care and whose own health care system is quite unable to cope with the demands being placed on it at this time. ☹ \*\* Yes. It seems a number of local Balinese were caught in the explosion. These people were making a living out of tourism, and didn’t ask for this. For those Australians in the region (here in HK, Japan, KL, wherever), it might be worhtwile contacting your local consulate to see if there has been any provision for collecting blood for the victims. We’re not that far from Bali. Its a public holiday in HK today, so I’ll have to check it out tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![reprise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@reprise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/reprise)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/44 "2002-10-14T07:23:18Z")
A private businessman flew 9 victims back to Perth (it was Kerry Stokes), in addition to those "walking wounded who flew back on Garuda. There was a report of one death on the first medivac flight to Darwin early this morning; the death of another evacuee was reported just after lunchtime here. I’m checking 3 or 4 different news services here, and in the last hour there have been a flood of reports coming in as the media gears up for the 6pm news and the “special editions” of the current affairs programmes which follow. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/45 "2002-10-14T07:48:10Z")
It is interesting (and disturbing) that the first comment from a muslim cleric (on Java) is…“the Americans did it, Indonisians don’t have such high explosives…” If that sums up the reaction of the "religion of peace’, then I think it is time to start re-evaluating islam. I would have expected some kind of repudiation of the mentality that would wreak such ahorror…but no, apparently this man’s first reaction is to blame the USA. ---
**Author:** ![Crusoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/49beb7/32.png) [@Crusoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crusoe)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/46 "2002-10-14T07:52:23Z")
You’re seriously suggesting ‘re-evaluating’ a whole religion based on one man’s comments? What would you hope to achieve? ---
**Author:** ![litost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@litost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/litost)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/47 "2002-10-14T07:56:48Z")
yes, let’s interpret Christianity based on Falwell’s statements. ---
**Author:** ![litost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@litost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/litost)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/48 "2002-10-14T08:11:20Z")
**ralph** , I am sorry for being curt but I was indeed upset at that kind of thinking. I find it strange and shocking that while one can retain perspective on what blind and hateful fundamentalism is and how it is marginalized in a country like the US, somehow when it involves people you don’t know and are predominantly across the fence, the perspective changes. I know Islam is not flourishing now as it once was, and hence the seeds and growth of blind hateful thinking are spread over a larger area. (As \*\* Tamerlane \*\* pointed out in another thread, this is largely a modern development) But, I urge you not to dehumanize an entire mass of people who follow their religion like everyone else follows theirs, i.e., peacefully. ---
**Author:** ![reprise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@reprise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/reprise)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/49 "2002-10-14T08:13:56Z")
I guess you must have missed [this comment](http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/10/14/1034222727542.html), **ralph**. One whackjob Muslim cleric and one has-been former Australian diplomat (so has-been that I don’t even recognise his name) are portraying these bombings as somehow being the fault of the US. We aren’t taking any notice of them, and I’m damned if I can understand why any thinking person **would**. Pretty much anyone with **anything** to say about these bombings can grab the media spotlight for their 15 minutes of fame right now - there just isn’t anything substantially new for the media to serve up to an information hungry public. Please don’t dignify the rantings of whackjobs like this one by giving serious consideration to his statements or affording him the status of spokesperson for his religion - he isn’t worthy of either. ---
**Author:** ![Dave\_Stewart\_v3.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac91a4/32.png) [@Dave\_Stewart\_v3.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dave_Stewart_v3.0)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/50 "2002-10-14T08:15:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ralph124c \* > \*\*It is interesting (and disturbing) that the first comment from a muslim cleric (on Java) is…“the Americans did it, Indonisians don’t have such high explosives…” > If that sums up the reaction of the "religion of peace’, then I think it is time to start re-evaluating islam. I would have expected some kind of repudiation of the mentality that would wreak such ahorror…but no, apparently this man’s first reaction is to blame the USA. \*\* Obviously you didn’t read my earlier quote from the Sydney Morning Herald, which I set now out in full: > [@](#): > > Islamic Council of Victoria president Yasser Soliman said the attacks should be condemned irrespective of who carried them out. > > “These attacks against innocent people represent a crime against God and humanity,” Mr Soliman said. > > "We declare our sympathy for all the innocent people killed and injured in the attacks, including Indonesians and people of many other nationalities. > > "But our feelings of anger and loss are further magnified by the knowledge that so many of the victims are fellow Australians. > “We express our deepest condolences to the victims, their families and their friends and we pray to God to comfort the hearts of all those affected.” > > Mr Soliman said Australian Muslims prayed that the perpetrators would soon be caught, brought to justice and punished with the full force of the law. Its a lack of tolerance and understanding which caused this. Don’t perpetuate it. ---
**Author:** ![reprise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@reprise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/reprise)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/51 "2002-10-14T08:26:46Z")
The SDMB will go down for maintenance soon, so I’ll post the “just in” and “breaking news” links to some of our major media outlets so people can get updates during the night. [Sydney Morning Herald](http://www.smh.com.au/breaking) [ABC Online](http://abc.net.au/news/justin) [News Limited](http://www.news.com.au/common/storylib/0,4810,BreakingNews%255EBREAKING%2520NEWS%255ETEXT%255Enews,00.html) ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/52 "2002-10-14T10:16:09Z")
Simply appalling. ---
**Author:** ![reprise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@reprise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/reprise)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/53 "2002-10-14T10:38:47Z")
Well, it looks like Australia may be asking the UN to add Jemaah Islamiyah to its list of prescribed terrorist organisations. [Early, somewhat sketchy, report](http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,5286350%255E1702,00.html) ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/54 "2002-10-14T14:00:50Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Dave Stewart v3.0 \* > \*\* > Its a lack of tolerance and understanding which caused this._\* Oh nonsense. It’s thuggery, barbarism and evil people which caused this. The swine who committed this atrocity didn’t do so because they itty-bitty feewings were hurt 'cause no-one understood their deep angst. :rolleyes: And the only reason to “understand” these monsters is so that you can better find their hiding places and possible targets with the goal of wiping them out to the last person. Fenris ---
**Author:** ![xejkh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/22d042/32.png) [@xejkh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xejkh)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/55 "2002-10-14T14:14:40Z")
In response to the OP: > [@](#): > > Will the Megawati government regret not cracking down on the Al Quaeda network? I think it’s unlikely, unless proof that Al Qaeda was behind the bombing comes up. This will have to wait until someone claims responsibility of it. However, the implications of the whole tragedy will force the Indonesian government to rethink it’s stand on terrorism. The authorities have been quite slack in taking a strong stand against any form of terrorism, dismissing requests from neighbouring countries to help at least in apprehending some suspects for questioning. The bombing in Bali, a predominantly Hindu island, can very well incite inter-religious animosity. Its targets – Caucasian tourists, alcohol selling nightclubs – can also be interpreted as a reaction by religious extremists against the West. To save Indonesia’s economy from ruin it is imperative that the government must do something to at least maintain an acceptable level of security. ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/56 "2002-10-14T14:25:51Z")
**Fenris** is correct. We simply need to kill these arseholes. They chose to start playing this game, and it’s not as though we wouldn’t be playing by their rules. I think ridding the planet of them is more than reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/57 "2002-10-14T14:40:16Z")
I don’t think **Fenris** , that **Dave Stewart v3.0** was suggesting that it was “our” lack of tolerance and understanding that caused this. Rather, that of the murderers and those they have persuaded to help them. And an appeal that - even our sorrow and anger - we don’t become like them. My take on the East Timor thing is not so much that taking sides with the (predominantly Catholic) East Timorese against the Javanese has pissed off Muslims, but that we failed to appreciate the upside of a horribly repressive central government in Jakarta. Those criticising Megawati should understand that she hasn’t got the power to crack down and at this stage, neither does anyone else. That’s been a dangerous situation since Habibi took over and it should have been our primary foreign policy focus. After all, that was our bipartisan foreign policy for decades. [Added in preview] With respect TLD, you have to find them. And it’s no good killing them if by doing so you create lots more. So, yes, it _is_ more than reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![Effy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9fc348/32.png) [@Effy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Effy)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/58 "2002-10-14T14:40:34Z")
**Fenris** and **TheLoadedDog** , please define “swine” and “these arseholes.” And it’s wonderful to know that you’re reciprocating by also treating this as a “game.” ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/59 "2002-10-14T14:59:07Z")
**Effy** , thank you for your input. I’ll keep this post civil, considering the forum we are in. Definition of “swine” and “these arseholes” : Terrorists. There, that wasn’t too hard. My use of the word “game”? Well, y’know how it is when you’re bored on a rainy afternoon, and you can’t decide between Hungry Hungry Hippos, Monopoly, or ripping innocent people’s heads and limbs from their torsos by blowing up a nightclub. Oh, you don’t? Your homework: look up “understatement”. Oh, and welcome to the boards. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2002, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058/60 "2002-10-14T14:59:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Effy \* > \*\ ***Fenris** and **TheLoadedDog** , please define “swine” and “these arseholes.” > > And it’s wonderful to know that you’re reciprocating by also treating this as a “game.” \*\* Who’s treating as a “game”? I can’t speak for **TLD** , but for me, I’m talking about terrorists: people who attack civilian target with the intent of killing/wounding the most people. That tactic is _not_ acceptible to civilized people. And before you ask, “civilized people” are, at minimum those who _don’t_ support or engage in terrorist activities. Fenris [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/terrorist-bombing-in-bali/132058.md?page=4)