# Texas Cop Tasers Granny **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 11, 2009, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417 "2009-06-11T04:23:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/101 "2009-06-11T19:00:20Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > What don’t you get? I said she was never a threat that deserved tasing. You said she WAS a threat because she was speeding in a construction zone. Further wiggling on your part just looks like you’re trying to drag me down into some complicated mess of an argument that has nothing to do with what you or I originally said. I’m not going to play. > Ok, good. I can (and did, in fact) stop reading there, in that case. If you think taking someone to jail because they’re upset and don’t want to scribble on your piece of paper then you’re the one not being reasonable. If you think taking a great grandmother onto the edge of a “particularly dangerous stretch of highway”, screaming in her face, pushing her twice, shocking her out of all control over her body, and then taking her to jail because she’s upset and doesn’t want to scribble on your piece of paper is “perfectly reasonable” then I don’t care to argue with you. > > And to everyone: is there any indication that he tried to make clear the consequences of not signing? Was she charged with not signing the ticket? I don’t belive “not signing the ticket” was a crime. From what I understand, it simply meant that she would not be released with what amounted to a notice to appear in court. At this point you might want to read how, upon agreeing by default to be arrested, her subsequent resistance to arrest amounts to a new crime. But these sort of facts get in the way of an good old tantrum (eveyrone needs to cry now and then, huh. crying’s okay), so I won’t bother you with anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/102 "2009-06-11T19:00:37Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > She got tazed because at every point during the encounter she chose to escalate the situation From your point of view. From my point of view, the cop - _the one with all the authority, mind you_ - chose to escalate the situation. > [@billfish678](#): > > Well, RISKING going to jail, getting pushd, getting tasered or getting tackled or getting shot to just NOT sign a piece of paper which just means you GOT this piece of paper is pretty stupid and irresponsible as well. Well, sure, granted. I was taught to say yes sir/no sir/have a nice day and scarcely a peep else when I’m pulled over. Because of this, of the 15 or 20 times I’ve been pulled over (I was a real idiot of a driver in my teens and early 20s :o) I’ve gotten exactly 2 real tickets and 1 warning in my life, and never been asked to step out of my vehicle. Some people are just dumb. If being dumb was a tasin’ we’d all be shocked to shit every once in awhile. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/103 "2009-06-11T19:04:10Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > That’s not how it works. If the cop gives her the ticket without making her sign it, she never got the ticket. > > It’s how the law prevents cops from abusing their power and writing a bunch of bogus tickets. Of course in this day and age they could just do that, video the incident well, then tack on an additional serious “wouldnt sign the ticket” charge to the original speeding ticket. I am actually somewhat surprised they dont already do that these days. This assumes the tag has been run, a general ID has been made, and this car or person isnt of special interest already to law enforcement types. Then of course some other crabby grandma would refuse to show her liscense or try to drive off early and we would still be back to square one. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/104 "2009-06-11T19:05:31Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > That’s not how it works. If the cop gives her the ticket without making her sign it, she never got the ticket. > > It’s how the law prevents cops from abusing their power and writing a bunch of bogus tickets. Considering the overwhelming evidence that she DID get it (officer’s word, officer’s copy, and video tape of her receiving it with her voice, vehicle, and license plate on it), that’s what’s called an outdated and stupid law. And I have a feeling she would not have gotten away clean if he’d left the ticket with her and went about his business. Courts have a funny way of finding loopholes around these things. > [@whole\_bean](#): > > I won’t bother you anymore. _Thank_ you. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/105 "2009-06-11T19:08:27Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > No, nobody has said that she did not have to obey laws. This is a red herring. > [@gonzomax View Post](#): > > She was a serious threat to him, I am sure. But he could have cuffed her and taken her in if he felt the world would be safer with her in jail. Unless I’m mistaken the Texas State statute concerning NOT signing the ticket has already been cited by **MOIDALIZE** …but as Gonzomax said, the cop should have let her go. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/106 "2009-06-11T19:08:35Z")
[QUOTE=Cisco] From your point of view. From my point of view, the cop - the one with all the authority, mind you - chose to escalate the situation. [/QUOTE] Right, better he chat her up in oncoming traffic till she has to pee, get’s hungry or _Matlock_ comes on. That, or let her learn the invaluable lesson that old people, along with naked wizards, don’t get traffic tickets if they don’t want them - let that shit get out of the knitting circle and there’ll be a highway full of Crown Vic’s at unmanageable speeds - at least they’ll be off the road by dusk, at which time every Piccadilly will become a den of lawlessness. ---
**Author:** ![rolandgunslinger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/cdc98d/32.png) [@rolandgunslinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rolandgunslinger)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/107 "2009-06-11T19:09:36Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > She had the ticket. She had to pay it. She was upset. Tickets are very expensive and it may have been a hardship for her. > But she was definitely a threat to the poor defenseless cop. He probably should have shot her. She was not a little old lady but a big strong granny criminal type. He was out of his league . Thank god he had a taser. It saved his life. Bullshit! Being a granny is no excuse for breaking the law. I guess we should feel sorry for that poor defenseless 88 year old man who went on that shooting rampage. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/108 "2009-06-11T19:17:48Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > Considering the overwhelming evidence that she DID get it (officer’s word, officer’s copy, and video tape of her receiving it with her voice, vehicle, and license plate on it), that’s what’s called an outdated and stupid law. And I have a feeling she would not have gotten away clean if he’d left the ticket with her and went about his business. Courts have a funny way of finding loopholes around these things. Gah! Are you being intentionally obtuse? The question isn’t whether she got the ticket, but whether she agreed to appear in Court. Will you at long last process what we’re telling you. Commit a crime —\> get arrested. Commit a lessor offense (like a traffic violation) —\> get the option to be released upon an agreement to appear in court. She did not agree. She gets arrested. Don’t agree with the law, fine move to Texas and have it changed. > [@Cisco](#): > > _Thank_ you. Seriously, don’t mention it. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/109 "2009-06-11T19:24:29Z")
> [@whole\_bean](#): > > That, or let her learn the invaluable lesson that old people, along with **naked wizards** , don’t get traffic tickets if they don’t want them - I knew that robe was throwing off my game somehow 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/110 "2009-06-11T19:31:26Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > Ok, good. I can (and did, in fact) stop reading there, in that case. Well, you missed the good part. Probably just as well for you, as it contained a thoughtful, compelling, well reasoned response to your position, one I would have enjoyed seeing you try to rebut. \*Que sera sera. \* ---
**Author:** ![Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/brown_eyed_girl/32/3574_2.png) [@Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brown_Eyed_Girl)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/111 "2009-06-11T19:38:44Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > What don’t you get? I said she was never a threat that deserved tasing. You said she WAS a threat because she was speeding in a construction zone. Further wiggling on your part just looks like you’re trying to drag me down into some complicated mess of an argument that has nothing to do with what you or I originally said. I’m not going to play. _sigh_ She didn’t get tased because she was speeding. She was a threat because she was speeding, for one, and, for two, because she failed to comply with the officer’s reasonable and lawful commands. She was tased due to the latter behavior, not the former. Get it now? ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/112 "2009-06-11T19:39:19Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Well, you missed the good part. Probably just as well for you, as it contained a thoughtful, compelling, well reasoned response to your position, one I would have enjoyed seeing you try to rebut. \*Que sera sera. > \* Ok, I’ll read it just for you. Nope, not seeing a thoughtful or well reasoned response. Just ad-hom insults, strawmen, and stuff that’s already been said and I already addressed. Wish I would’ve continued to follow my instincts and not read it. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/113 "2009-06-11T19:41:22Z")
> [@Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](#): > > _sigh_ > > She didn’t get tased because she was speeding. She was a threat because she was speeding, for one, and, for two, because she failed to comply with the officer’s reasonable and lawful commands. She was tased due to the latter behavior, not the former. Get it now? You’re the one not getting it. For the 3rd (or 4th, or whatever time): I said she wasn’t a threat that deserved tasing You said she was a thread because she was speeding This suggests speeding should be punished by tasing It’s very, very simple, really. I’m sorry that you made a horrible, irrelevant counterpoint, but at least own up to it, ok? ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/114 "2009-06-11T19:43:17Z")
Honestly, the chances of the cop hurting the woman by wrestling her are a heck of a lot greater than her being hurt by a taser. The cop absolutely did the right thing. As the cop’s immediate superior said, he’d taze his own mother under those circumstances. If it came down to “his word against hers” the cop would almost certainly be off the force and in jail; septugenarian grannies have a talent for winning cases like this. Thank God for the dash cam. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/115 "2009-06-11T19:43:32Z")
**Cisco,** Could you please read what I wrote in Post 76 and explain what problems you have from there? ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/116 "2009-06-11T19:44:21Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > Ok, I’ll read it just for you. > > Nope, not seeing a thoughtful or well reasoned response. Just ad-hom insults, strawmen, and stuff that’s already been said and I already addressed. Wish I would’ve continued to follow my instincts and not read it. Oh well. I guess I was wrong. Your rebuttal wasn’t nearly as entertaining as I had hoped. Somewhat instructive, however. ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/117 "2009-06-11T19:45:57Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > You’re the one not getting it. For the 3rd (or 4th, or whatever time): > > I said she wasn’t a threat that deserved tasing > You said she was a thread because she was speeding > This suggests speeding should be punished by tasing > > ? The threat from speeding is negligible. She was a threat for getting in the officer’s face and continually walking into traffic when directed not to. And if you don’t think a senior citizen poses a physical threat, you’ve never worked in a nursing home. ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/118 "2009-06-11T19:46:20Z")
On the same vein some of the others here have been suggesting: What exactly was accomplished here by this cop? The old lady would have had to pay the ticket. If she didn’t, first the fees would have gone up, then her licence would have been suspended. She would have had to pay. why did the officer escalate the situation? There was no need to. So instead of giving her the ticket and leaving, he tasered and arrested a cantankerous old woman. Wow! What a hero! I sure feel safer now that he is keeping the sour old ladies at bay. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/119 "2009-06-11T19:50:11Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > Ok, I’ll read it just for you. > > Nope, not seeing a thoughtful or well reasoned response. Just ad-hom insults, strawmen, and stuff that’s already been said and I already addressed. Wish I would’ve continued to follow my instincts and not read it. Huh. I guess I’ll take the bait: please show me where you address the contention that she was lawfully arrested for her failure to indicate her willingness to appear by signing the ticket; please show me where you address the contention that she was tased for resiting arrest and not speeding; please show me where you addressed the contention that because she was tased for resiting arrest and not speeding that your slide down the slope to tasing all speeders is illogical, alternatviely defend your assertion that approving of the tasing of someone for resiting arrest is the equivalent to approving of the tasing of all speeders; please show me that you understand not just how to spell the word strawman but that you actually know what it means by identifying one strawman in the referenced post. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417/120 "2009-06-11T19:50:22Z")
> [@Kinthalis](#): > > On the same vein some of the others here have been suggesting: > > What exactly was accomplished here by this cop? > > The old lady would have had to pay the ticket. If the cop drove away without having her sign it then no, she wouldn’t have. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/texas-cop-tasers-granny/499417.md?page=7)