# Th' hell? \*Two\* tortured Aussie babies in four years? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 18, 2004, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824 "2004-05-18T19:22:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/1 "2004-05-18T19:22:08Z")
> [@](#): > > [story 1](http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/05/17/1084646120966.html) > The NSW Director of Public Prosecutions is appealing against the sentence given to Christopher Hoerler for the manslaughter of seven-month-old Jordan Anderson at Wagga Wagga in the state’s south west. > > Hoerler was jailed last year for a maximum 11 years, with a non-parole period of eight years and three months. > > Baby Jordan - the son of Hoerler’s de facto, Louise Anderson - died on February 25, 2000, at the couple’s home. > > Jordan choked on his own vomit after being beaten and tortured, with his injuries including a lacerated liver, a torn lip, facial abrasions and broken ribs. > > His toes had also been crushed by a clamp. > [@](#): > > [story 2](http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,9593238%255E26462,00.html) > A BABY savagely attacked on Brisbane’s northside at the weekend was being monitored by the Department of Child Safety only days before her assault. > > The three-month-old girl suffered six broken ribs, two broken legs, a broken arm, a broken collarbone and a dislocated shoulder in the assault allegedly committed by her mother’s de facto husband at a Nundah residence on Saturday night. > > It is believed the baby did not receive any treatment until she began vomiting blood 24 hours after the attack. > > A man, 20, has been charged with torture and grievous bodily harm and will appear in the Brisbane Magistrate’s Court today. Yeah, I know, these monsters are not to be taken as representitives of the population in general but _damn_ this is weird. ---
**Author:** ![belladonna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9fc29f/32.png) [@belladonna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/belladonna)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/2 "2004-05-18T19:34:53Z")
Excuse me, I think I need to go vomit and then cry for about a year. ☹ Poor sweet babies, I can’t even imagine what is missing from these people that made them do these things. And can i just say that 8-11 years for torturing a baby to death is a joke. A sick, sad, unfunny joke. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/3 "2004-05-18T20:04:18Z")
> [@belladonna](#): > > Excuse me, I think I need to go vomit and then cry for about a year. > > ☹ > Poor sweet babies, I can’t even imagine what is missing from these people that made them do these things. And can i just say that 8-11 years for torturing a baby to death is a joke. A sick, sad, unfunny joke. I heartily agree, though I would have phrased it ONLY 8-11 years. Although a good biblical eye-for-an-eye sentance would probably get a fair number of people willing to beat them to death… Not that it would ever bring back the poor kids, but other than a possible deterrant factor it would be very cathartic to the community. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/4 "2004-05-18T20:24:51Z")
And in other news… [http://www.cnn.com/2004/LAW/05/18/twins.killed.ap/index.html](http://www.cnn.com/2004/LAW/05/18/twins.killed.ap/index.html) What the fuck is going on? ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/5 "2004-05-18T21:27:01Z")
There are no words. One the one hand, I can’t see it as a bad thing that the 17 year old no longer has twins in her care, since her other child was taken from custody. On the other, it’s sad that little ones, who never really had a chance to know love and joy, died so painfully and it’s happening all over. ☹ Makes me sick to think I have a similar genetic pattern with them. Here’s a question, why wasn’t the 17 year old placed in state protective custody herself? He was the father of both kids, were they married in any way? She must have been 15? when she got pregnant the first time. In this town, I know of a teenager that age who was removed from the custody of her mom and placed in state care to protect her, her mother was found unfit, because she did not object and take legal action against the adult male who got the girl pregnant. The mother was an acquaintance of mine, I’d urged her to report the guy, but she didn’t. Sad, makes you feel ill, and logically you know there’s really not much you can do unless you can help young folks learn to think of others, and to respect themselves, love themselves and others. I can’t even cry though, too much horror lately has numbed me. I probably will end up crying later, about it all. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/6 "2004-05-18T21:30:56Z")
Damn those dingoes! Sorry, sorry…totally inappopriate, I know… ---
**Author:** ![Primaflora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/898d66/32.png) [@Primaflora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Primaflora)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/7 "2004-05-18T21:34:54Z")
The Brisbane baby is still alive. I think my sister’s working on the ward where the baby is being cared for. There’s a hell of a lot more than 2 babies dead because of the inefficiency of the Dept of Children’s Services though :(. The track record here is beyond heartbreaking but it ultimately goes back to a lack of funding. It’s sickening how many babies are in the oversight of the dept when they are hurt or killed. I’ve never heard of any girls being placed in protective custody merely for becoming pregnant. Some of the schools around here (very socioeconomically depressed area) have mother-baby units to serve the needs of these kids. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/8 "2004-05-18T21:58:41Z")
The pregnancy, and her naming an adult male as the father was the reason she was taken away from her mother. The mother admitted she knew about the circumstances, and also admitted she did nothing. Basically the system took the girl away from a permissive environment, to try to “save her from herself”. I don’t quite know what to think of this in a way, except that it’s a good thing she’s being made to go to school (something else the mom didn’t do) and being guided more carefully. Hopefully she won’t end up pregnant again for a while. So, it wasn’t just that she turned up pregnant, it’s that she was “being allowed to be promiscious” and “an adult male was allowed to molest her unchallenged” and “she wasn’t disciplined and made to go to school”. The mom could have walked her into the building to her first class, but didn’t. (Her schedule would have allowed her to do this.) This is Kansas, in the U.S.A. btw, not Australia, so the laws probably also differ. I have not problem at all with childcare units in schools, I think it’s good to help young mothers finish school. It makes me sad that there is a large need for such things now though. So many people becoming parents so young, instead of enjoying their youth, and taking time to grow. ☹ Not saying everyone who becomes a parent very young is a bad one either, I know someone who became a mom at 16, and she’s a GREAT mom. Hope the Brisbane baby pulls through, with no lasting damage if possible. Hope it finds a good loving home, that will teach it self respect/love of self, and respect/love for others, with a real desire to be a good citizen. Prayers sent. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/9 "2004-05-18T22:13:40Z")
I’ll add, I don’t think it’s as easy to remove a girl from the custody of her parent (s) if she’s pregnant and the guy isn’t an adult himself. Not certain on this, but it is rarer at least to remove custody just becuase the girl is pregnant. Hope that clarifies more. ---
**Author:** ![MelCthefirst](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eada6e/32.png) [@MelCthefirst](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MelCthefirst)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/10 "2004-05-18T22:26:34Z")
Here there are just over 1000 social workers to deal with over 40,000 cases. This is totally unrealistic. Added to this is the lack of people willing to do the job. Low salary, incredibly heavy workload, heart wrenching cases and a degree that you have to pay for - ofcourse you can’t recruit great numbers. No wonder there are child abuse cases that could have been prevented. Until society starts valuing ‘people care’ and takes responsibility for its failures, this will continue. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/11 "2004-05-18T22:33:05Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Damn those dingoes! > > Sorry, sorry…totally inappopriate, I know… Thanks **jayjay**. I was gonna make a very similar remark, but held off long enough for you to do it. Great minds and all that. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Primaflora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/898d66/32.png) [@Primaflora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Primaflora)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2004, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/12 "2004-05-18T23:47:32Z")
What the fuck have dingoes got to do with it? Why do you think it’s a witty and clever remark to make? We’re talking about babies who were tortured by their parents – it’s got nothing to do with the tragic Chamberlain case. I don’t get it :(. Why make jokes about such a horrific case, especially a stupid joke which has got nothing to do with the case? Unless you’re reducing Australian child abuse cases to equal dingo. Which is asinine and stupid and ignorant in the extreme. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/13 "2004-05-19T00:06:06Z")
They are making an indirect reference to that woman who claimed a dingo carried off her baby. I think they prosecuted her for the murder of her child IIRC. Don’t remember if she was convicted or not, but I think she was. I think they were biased, and didn’t do their jobs well enough. I don’t think the whole truth was found in that case, based on reading and watching experts speak up on the matter of dingo behavior. It was a tasteless and crude comment. Not funny to me, at least. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Primaflora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/898d66/32.png) [@Primaflora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Primaflora)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/14 "2004-05-19T00:34:11Z")
I know the case that they are referring to. It would be fucking impossible to have lived in Australia and not know the Chamberlain case. Brief recap – baby taken by dingo at Uluru. Mother charged with murder eventually. Spends time in prison. Released from prison after case reviewed and it’s clear that the ‘evidence’ which convicted her was wrong and/or false. At no point in time did either of the Chamberlains abuse their children. Lindy was wrongly convicted and won a huge payout after her release. Zero fucking correlation with these hideous child abuse cases. Unless you’re so intellectually impaired you think this stuff is amusing. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/15 "2004-05-19T01:19:46Z")
This may possibly have been my single most serious misstep in my almost four years on this board. I apologize to everyone for a very truly tasteless attempt at humor. My filter apparently miscued on this one. I’m sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Gest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9d8465/32.png) [@Gest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gest)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/16 "2004-05-19T01:21:32Z")
If you can’t keep laughing for twenty years at the grisly death of an infant, persecution and destruction of an innocent family by media and an entire nation showing how ugly it can be; what can you laugh at? Can’t we all just be glad that she wasn’t from Pennsylvania? Granted, Austria _should_ be considered more important what with Schwarzeneggar’s success and all. ---
**Author:** ![MelCthefirst](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eada6e/32.png) [@MelCthefirst](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MelCthefirst)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/17 "2004-05-19T01:36:26Z")
Australia/Austria virtually the same - somewhere foreign!? ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/18 "2004-05-19T02:12:41Z")
> [@Gest](#): > > If you can’t keep laughing for twenty years at the grisly death of an infant, persecution and destruction of an innocent family by media and an entire nation showing how ugly it can be; what can you laugh at? While I can’t speak for **jayjay** , I would point out that the only thing today that I can remember about “the dingo ate my baby” case is its treatment by comedians, including _Saturday Night Live_. And that was when SNL was funny IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Tikki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5daacb/32.png) [@Tikki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tikki)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/19 "2004-05-19T05:30:16Z")
(A little off topic but not quite.) You see, if old Fred Phelps had any sense at all, he’d be targeting child abusers like these. Of course, we all know he doesn’t have any sense, jsut like these child beating a\*\*holes. ---
**Author:** ![RandomLetters](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8edcca/32.png) [@RandomLetters](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandomLetters)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824/20 "2004-05-19T06:23:59Z")
How about we throw that sick fuck who tortured these kids to a pack a wild, starving dingoes. Will that make everyone happy? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/th-hell-two-tortured-aussie-babies-in-four-years/245824.md?page=2)