# Thank you, Canada **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 21, 2006, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505 "2006-09-21T01:55:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2006, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/21 "2006-09-24T15:21:35Z")
The Commissioner of the RCMP is facing calls for his resignation over the Arar affair, and while the official line from the government is that he’ll stay on, I can’t say the various comments amount to a ringing endorsement of the Commissioner: [Tories sidestep issue of Zaccardelli’s future](http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1158875419946&call_pageid=968332188492&col=968793972154&t=TS_Home). For example, the Foreign Minister commented earlier this week: > [@](#): > > Some MPs have said Zaccardelli should resign over the Mounties’ conduct and Foreign Minister Peter MacKay hinted yesterday the commissioner’s future could still be up in the air. > > “That will be a decision taken in the future,” MacKay commented when asked if the government continues to have confidence in Zaccardelli. And just yesterday, a new issue broke: allegations that the top RCMP brass took a “go-slow” approach to investigating charges of nepotism and misuse of funds within the RCMP itself, meaning that a limitation period has kicked in and no action can be taken against the targets of the probe: [Top cop’s future clouded after ethics probe](http://www.canada.com/topics/news/politics/story.html?id=17290f46-8d0c-445b-8d92-ebd7112d6ae0&k=83008): > [@](#): > > A new threat to embattled RCMP Commissioner Giuliano Zaccardelli’s future as Canada’s top cop is emerging from inside the ranks of his own police force. > > An internal probe into alleged nepotism, misappropriation of pension funds, contracting irregularities, breach of trust, dereliction of duty, harassment and improper hiring practices concluded last week with Zaccardelli admitting time has run out to impose disciplinary action on four senior members of the force. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2006, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/22 "2006-09-24T15:54:02Z")
ALBERTO GONZALES, U.S. Attorney General: We were not responsible for his removal to Syria. I’m not aware that he was tortured, and I haven’t read the commission report. Unbelievable. :rolleyes: Does the US Attorney General think people are sent to Syria for the weather? Perhaps he should Google for ‘Abu Graib’ ‘CIA flights’ and ‘current US torture policy’… ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2006, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/23 "2006-10-13T04:19:25Z")
A couple of updates: Late last month, Commissioner Zaccardelli, the head of the RCMP, appeared before the Commons Committee on Public Safety to testify on the Arar affair. The first thing he did was [apologize to Mr. Arar](http://cmte.parl.gc.ca/Content/HOC/committee/391/secu/evidence/ev2361182/secuev10-e.htm#Int-1658760): > [@Commissioner Zaccardelli](#): > > Mr. Arar, I wish to take this opportunity to express publicly to you, to your wife, and to your children how truly sorry I am for whatever part the actions of the RCMP may have contributed to the terrible injustices that you experienced and the pain that you and your family endured. > > I know that an apology can never give back to Mr. Arar what was taken from him, but what we can do is move forward with changes and reform. That means in very concrete terms identifying and acknowledging errors that were made, implementing whatever change is required to address them, and by recommitting ourselves to the very heart of our purpose: to do our best to serve and protect all Canadians and our country. And, more recently, Prime Minister Harper has directed that the Foreign Minister send a formal protest to President Bush about Mr. Arar’s treatment at the hands of US officials: [‘Come Clean on Arar’, Harper tells Bush](http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20061007.ARAR07/TPStory/National): > [@](#): > > Canada will protest against the U.S. handling of the Maher Arar security file and seek an explanation of the government’s behaviour, Prime Minister Stephen Harper told President George W. Bush yesterday. > > The United States has to come clean and acknowledge its inappropriate handling of the file, Mr. Harper said he told Mr. Bush in a telephone conversation. > > Mr. Harper said he called Mr. Bush to tell him Canada is upset about the findings of an independent panel of inquiry that “American officials had not been candid and truthful in their dealings with Canadian officials in the case.” > > Canada will lodge an official protest through formal diplomatic channels and expects a response, Mr. Harper said in Calgary. Mr. Arar is still waiting for an apology from Mr. Harper, who’s not said no, but not apologized, either. Speculation in the media is that the PM’s been advised by the federal gov’t lawyers not to comment while settlement negotiations with Mr. Arar are under way. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2006, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/24 "2006-10-13T05:16:20Z")
> [@](#): > > Does the US Attorney General think people are sent to Syria for the weather? Perhaps he should Google for ‘Abu Graib’ ‘CIA flights’ and ‘current US torture policy’… Maybe at his next press conference, he should take the opportunity to ask the reporters a few questions in order to find out what his department is doing. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2006, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/25 "2006-10-14T21:12:31Z")
Thanks for the updates, **Northern Piper**. I don’t watch or read the news religiously, but it doesn’t seem like this kind of (important) story gets much attention down here. That’s the so-called “liberal mass media” for you. Liberal, my ass. _Frontline_, I think it was, promised a follow-up. They’re likely waiting for conclusion. You guys got room up there for just one more old, tired, and retired (pot smoking) liberal ;). Je ne parle pas français. But I do google. For what that’s worth. 😛 Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/26 "2006-12-21T14:24:00Z")
A few updates: **1. RCMP Commisioner Resigns over Inaccurate Testimony to Commons Committee** Commissioner Zaccardelli resigned earlier this month. It sounds like he’d lost the confidence of several key Cabinet members (notably the Minister of Public Safety, to whom the Commissioner reports). The final nail in his coffin was that he had to go back in front of the Commons committee and admit that he had given inaccurate testimony when he was in front of them in September, about the key issue of when he personally knew about the false information that the Mounties sent to the US authorities in the Arar affair. That was it - he resigned the next day: [Zaccardelli insists he told the truth about Arar](http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061206/rcmp_zaccardelli_061207/20061207?hub=CTVNewsAt11). (If you use the news feature on Google.ca for “Zaccardelli” you’ll get some more articles.) **2. Federal Commission of Inquiry Recommends More Oversight of Intelligence Agencies** As a follow-up, the Commission of Inquiry has released Part II of its findings, recommending much more comprehensive over-sight committees, not just for the Mounties but for all federal intelligence agencies, including giving the watchdogs subpoena powers to get information from the Mounties: [Highlights of the Second O’Connor Report](http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20061212.wararpoints1212/BNStory/Front). Mr. Arar says he’s pleased with the final report, but would like to see more personal accountability within the Mounties for the officers responsible for the faulty information to the US authorities. **3. Minister of Public Safety Orders Inquiry into Three Other Cases** Three other Canadians of Arab background have alleged that they were detained in Syria based on faulty information that came from the Mounties. The Minister has appointed a retired judge of the Supreme Court of Canada to look into those allegations: [Day Orders Inquiry into cases of Three Deportees](http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061212/inquiry_deportees_061212/20061212?hub=Politics). **4. The American Ambassador Doesn’t Accept O’Connor Findings; Arar’s still on the US watchlist** [The Ambassador’s Lump of Christmas Coal](http://www.embassymag.ca/html/index.php?display=story&full_path=/2006/december/20/edit/) [On the Arar Case, U.S. Envoy Admits Nothing](http://www.cbc.ca/canada/ottawa/story/2006/12/18/ambassador-wilkins.html) ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/27 "2006-12-21T14:35:34Z")
Moving thread from IMHO to MPSIMS. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/28 "2006-12-21T14:46:16Z")
Thanks, **Piper** , for the update. The USBS goes on. I don’t think inquiring into and exposing governmental abuse of personal freedom is pointless at all. Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![FordPrefect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e99b99/32.png) [@FordPrefect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordPrefect)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/29 "2006-12-21T15:01:39Z")
It could easily become mundane though, unfortunately. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/30 "2006-12-21T23:21:08Z")
Some progress today: the Canadian Foreign Minister has raised the issue of Arar’s status on the US watch list with Secretary of State Rice, and she has asked Homeland Security to review the issue: [U.S. Reviewing Arar Status: Rice](http://www.thestar.com/News/article/163999). However, the same article indicates that Homeland Security still refuses to share with Canada what they say was additional information from another source that keeps Mr. Arar on the U.S. watch list. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/31 "2006-12-22T00:11:10Z")
To overstate the obvious; How convenient. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2007, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/32 "2007-01-06T20:07:53Z")
We’re starting to find out how much the Arar affair cost the Mounties in dollars: a total of about $5 million, divided into two phases: Initial investigation (prior to Mr Arar being sent to Syria) which generated nothing more than inaccurate speculation: [Mounties spent $860,000 to keep tabs on Arar](http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070103.warar04/BNStory/Front/). Follow-up (after Mr. Arar returned), which involved: further investigations in a vain effort to prove that their inaccurate speculations had been true; leaking false reports to the media, impugning Mr. Arar’s credibity; defending themselves in the judicial inquiry and general ass-covering: **[$4.1 million](http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20070103/Maher_arar_070103/20070103?hub=TopStories)**. Damage to the Mounties’ reputation: priceless. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2007, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/33 "2007-01-06T20:37:31Z")
Sounds like us. 😉 Only our boys are worse. They still haven’t copped. So, whatever happened to Dudley Do-Right? Did they put him in charge? ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2007, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/34 "2007-01-07T04:32:50Z")
Of course he should remain on the American watch list. If he was not a terrorist before, he should be now following his being stolen away and tortured. Seriously, the entire affair disgusts me. The USA has gone off the edge when it comes to ignoring human rights, and much to my shame, Canada has to some degree supported the USA to this end. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2007, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/35 "2007-01-07T06:52:53Z")
[QUOTE=mangeorge] Sounds like us. 😉 Only our boys are worse. They still haven’t copped. So, whatever happened to Dudley Do-Right? Did they put him in charge? [/QUOTE] I sure hope ol’ [Dudley](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dudley_Do-Right) isn’t a sore spot with our neighbors to the north. If it is, I meant no disrespect and I apologize. Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2007, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/36 "2007-01-07T13:29:37Z")
[QUOTE=Muffin] Of course he should remain on the American watch list. If he was not a terrorist before, he should be now following his being stolen away and tortured. [/QUOTE] I know you meant that as a joke, but in one of the articles I read, a US official used exactly that logic. He said that one of the criteria for being on the watch list is having been previously removed from the U.S. by U.S. immigration officials. Since Mr. Arar was removed, he meets that criterion and stays on the list. And you thought Kafka made that stuff up… ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2007, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/37 "2007-01-07T13:34:31Z")
[QUOTE=mangeorge] I sure hope ol’ [Dudley](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dudley_Do-Right) isn’t a sore spot with our neighbors to the north. [/QUOTE] Hey, it’s cool. I grew up watching the cartoon version. As cartoon stereotypes for a nation goes, having a reputation for sterling honesty (although a bit dim) isn’t that bad! ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2007, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/38 "2007-01-07T16:50:43Z")
[QUOTE=Northern Piper] I know you meant that as a joke, but in one of the articles I read, a US official used exactly that logic. He said that one of the criteria for being on the watch list is having been previously removed from the U.S. by U.S. immigration officials. Since Mr. Arar was removed, he meets that criterion and stays on the list. And you thought Kafka made that stuff up… [/QUOTE] If someone could find a cite for this so I could feel free to repeat it, I would be, veruh veruh happy. -FrL- ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2007, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/39 "2007-01-07T17:38:52Z")
The full article’s no longer available on-line, because the Vancouver Sun only posts articles for 6 days - after that you need a subscription. However, the key opening line of the story is still up: [Arar stays on U.S. watch list](http://www.canada.com/theprovince/news/story.html?id=a6ac7084-daa7-4d99-a816-4592a1feb42f): > [@](#): > > WASHINGTON – Maher Arar will have to apply for admission to the United States because he’s been deported once, a U.S. Homeland Security Department official said yesterday. The Sun page has a contact address - maybe they will still provide the full article on request - might have to pay a bit, though. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2007, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505/40 "2007-01-07T17:43:22Z")
aha! found the full article on the National Post website - but it doesn’t say much more than the opening paragraph on this point: [Arar will have to apply for readmission to the United States: U.S. official](http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=e21495d3-f5bf-46db-935a-85d9f3be55fe&k=39114). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thank-you-canada/373505.md?page=3)