# That Chinese (???) -sounding riff **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 26, 2005, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839 "2005-01-26T23:06:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![I\_can\_t\_believe\_that\_s\_butter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8edcca/32.png) [@I\_can\_t\_believe\_that\_s\_butter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_can_t_believe_that_s_butter)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2005, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/1 "2005-01-26T23:06:11Z")
Firstly, I only _think_ it’s Chinese; I apologize if I’m wrong. It’s that little ditty like what you hear in “Kung Fu Fighting”—DA da-da DA DA da da DAAAAAH. It sounds pentatonic to this amateur ear. I suppose that this is similar to what was identified here a while back as “Streets of Cairo”; you’ll hear it in cartoons and what-not. What is it? ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2005, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/2 "2005-01-26T23:18:37Z")
I know what you are talking about. There was a variation of it used in Blade Runner. I don’t know, but I guess that it stems from the old Charlie Chan movies. ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2005, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/3 "2005-01-26T23:22:23Z")
Man, that is so weird. I was planning on posting this very thing. I always picture it as the opening outdoor shot when a movie is telling you the action is now taking place in China or Hong Kong or so on: (GOOONNNNGG) deetle deetle deet deet dah dah deet! ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2005, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/4 "2005-01-26T23:26:42Z")
Is it the riff from “I’m Turning Japanese”? ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2005, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/5 "2005-01-26T23:35:44Z")
Go here and play E, E, E, E, D, D, B, B, D > **[Virtual Online Piano - Piano World](https://pianoworld.com/fun-stuff/virtual-online-piano/)** > > Play the piano with your computer! The Virtual Online Keyboard is like having a digital piano, online! An interactive online piano you can play from your computer. The Virtual Piano. Click the ABC button to label the keys for you.…Read more › ---
**Author:** ![Flander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8c91f0/32.png) [@Flander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flander)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2005, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/6 "2005-01-26T23:48:18Z")
> [@pravnik](#): > > …play E, E, E, E, D, D, B, B, D Don’t forget to play each note with it’s fourth for the true “oriental” melody! I don’t mean to be offensive and apologize if my use of “oriental” in this context is bad. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2005, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/7 "2005-01-27T02:58:00Z")
Could it be the overture from The Mikado? Sound sample [here](http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000029KF/qid=1106794632/sr=2-3/ref=sr_2_3/104-9895481-1102332#product-details) ---
**Author:** ![RobuSensei](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/919ad9/32.png) [@RobuSensei](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RobuSensei)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2005, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/8 "2005-01-27T03:56:28Z")
If you have iTunes, you can hear a clip of “Kung-Fu Fighting” [here](http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=7227464&selectedItemId=7227462) (the last track on the album). If it’s the riff I think it is, you can hear it in the backing tracks. I always assumed that, like fortune cookies, this was a “Chinese” thing that was created in America. I don’t recall hearing that exact riff in my Asian music class back at St. Olaf… 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2005, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/9 "2005-01-27T04:02:50Z")
> [@Gangster Octopus](#): > > Is it the riff from “I’m Turning Japanese”? I read one review that described that riff as “teriyaki-flavored.” ---
**Author:** ![JoeSki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b487fb/32.png) [@JoeSki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoeSki)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2005, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/10 "2005-01-27T07:09:07Z")
> [@RobuSensei](#): > > I always assumed that, like fortune cookies, this was a “Chinese” thing that was created in America. Fortune cookies were invented in the staes? That’s interesting. Do you have a site for that? I’d like to know more. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2005, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/11 "2005-01-27T07:25:27Z")
Puffy (AmiYumi, not P-Diddly) also used it in the opening of their first hit _Asia no Junshin_, to start the song on a non-Japanese note. Japan’s part of Asia? Try telling people here that. ---
**Author:** ![baronsabato](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed655f/32.png) [@baronsabato](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/baronsabato)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2005, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/12 "2005-01-27T17:24:04Z")
> [@JoeSki](#): > > Fortune cookies were invented in the staes? That’s interesting. Do you have a site for that? I’d like to know more. This site will tell you all you need to know about the fortune cookie. [http://sanfrancisco.about.com/cs/daytrips/a/fortunecook.htm](http://sanfrancisco.about.com/cs/daytrips/a/fortunecook.htm) Not only is it not authentically Chinese, it also isn’t authentically Chinese-American. It was invented by a Japanese-American restauranteur for his Japanese Tea Garden. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Carnage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/max_carnage/32/12775_2.png) [@Max\_Carnage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Carnage)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2005, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/13 "2005-01-28T19:17:57Z")
I posted this same question about a year ago and no one could answer it then either. Maybe the Master himself should be invoked. ---
**Author:** ![JohnBckWLD](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d6d6ee/32.png) [@JohnBckWLD](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnBckWLD)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2005, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/14 "2005-01-28T21:33:14Z")
A Question on the origins of a specific tune, as well as mention of Fortune Cookies (being a San Francisco invention) prompted this warning: **Be very leery of internet sites claiming to know the true origin of specific items** Case in point: Google the term “bagels were invented” - and here’s what you get on page 1: Bagels were invented in 1683 by an anonymous Jewish baker in Austria. Bagels were invented in the 1500’s by sir john bagelheimer in the German city of Jagerschlager. bagels were invented by Jewish sailors who wanted a doughy snack Brooklyn, NY" Bagels. 1683 - Worlds First Bagel. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2005, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/15 "2005-01-28T21:39:06Z")
If you do have a piano. or even that online one, just play the black keys and it’s easy to bang out some “Asian” sounding or “Nativie American” sounding “music”. ---
**Author:** ![mani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@mani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mani)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/16 "2006-05-01T23:10:52Z")
Serendipity: I was reading this thread, and the ([older one on the same subject](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=300466&page=1&pp=50). Then half an hour later I stumbled upon [this weird Betty Boop cartoon](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DXY8r6zn3k&search=betty%20boop) on YouTube. WARNING! You may find that cartoon offensive or just debased in a multitude of ways, and watching it may be a violation of copyright laws. So I felt I had to get an account here to tell you about this. The video is not dated on that page but elsewhere on the Internet it is said to be from 1935 or 1933. The riff comes in at about 2/3 of the length of the video. At first it features in a slightly variated rhythm (here represented in a formalized version of the “dee-duh notation” (dee=1/8, duh=1/4, DUH=1/2)): rhythm: dee-dee-dee-dee-duh-duh-dee-dee-dee-dee-duh-duh melody (C major/A minor): d-d-d-d-c-c-a-a-a-a-c-c But later it comes in exactly the “modern”, “Kong-Fu Fighting” variant. i.e. when this (vaguely) chinese (i.e. “asiatic”) baby prodigy starts practising shooting on (european?) tin soldiers (thereby demonstrating the extent of the “yellow danger” of the growing asiatic hordes that are trained as soldiers already from the cradle (being scared only perhaps by a jack-in-the-box with a jewish nose). _Or am I reading way too much into this cartoon?_…), and at the same time that it’s combined with a trumpet fanfare for the militaristic connotation. So, as user zut mentioned, the intro to the song [Chinatown, My Chinatown](http://parlorsongs.com/issues/1999-8/aug99feature.asp) from 1910 contains a similar theme. And it seems to me that it’s possible that it originated there. But then there must have been another influential version (let’s call it the “theme Q”) somewhere inbetween 1910 and 1935 that established the “definitive modern form” of the theme, as it appears in the BB cartoon (It is obviously totally impossible that this cartoon was itself that influential). It is of course also equally possible that even “Chinatown, My Chinatown” is only using an already established cliché. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Mad\_Hermit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5ac83/32.png) [@The\_Mad\_Hermit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Mad_Hermit)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/17 "2006-05-01T23:50:07Z")
Would this be the same riff used by Rush in “A Passage to Bangkok?” ---
**Author:** ![Kythereia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e8c25b/32.png) [@Kythereia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kythereia)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/18 "2006-05-01T23:53:22Z")
[Previous thread on (and somewhere around) this subject](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=254541). I _think_ the instrument playing this riff is always a flute, but I’m not sure… ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2006, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/19 "2006-05-02T02:41:38Z")
> [@The Mad Hermit](#): > > Would this be the same riff used by Rush in “A Passage to Bangkok?” That is the one. AND, it goes without saying that the only thing about the riff that anybody needs to know is that Rush played it. Know this, and know it well. hh ---
**Author:** ![mani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@mani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mani)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2006, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839/20 "2006-06-12T21:18:31Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > That is the one. > AND, it goes without saying that the only thing about the riff that anybody needs to know is that Rush played it. Know this, and know it well. I am happy to concede that. In fact I am convinced that nobody needs to know anything about this riff at all. However, I personally become somewhat interested in the question and have during some month done some research on the origin of the riff. I’ve referenced the results on [a web page dedicated to the riff](http://chinoiserie.atspace.com) that I created. For a resumé of my findings see [my post in another old thread in GQ on the same subject](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=300466&page=3&pp=50). (I hope that it is not considerered a major annoyance to post in both forums like this: both threads already existed.) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-chinese-sounding-riff/286839.md?page=2)