# That damn bass thing **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 24, 2017, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636 "2017-02-24T15:53:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/21 "2017-02-25T06:54:14Z")
> [@Eddie The Horrible](#): > > Currently I don’t own any stringed instrument but if I can find some half-decent second hand Ibanez or Fender that’s miraculously under say, $400, then yeah I hope to eventually play some CDs on this old goofy cd deck that looks like an ET alien and try something like “Heard It Through the Grapevine” or “Devil With a Blue Dress On”. > > Really - would “Whole Lotta Love” be all that seriously difficult for a beginner? Everything will be difficult for a beginner, including fretting and note playing and even holding the bass. But the nice thing is that practice solves all of those issues. The doubles in “Whole Lotta Love” will come with time and it is a good initial target. A few things I would add is that you can get great playing guitars and basses for pretty cheap right now. CNC and other automation has really improved that story and to be honest with a budget of $400 you could get almost anything from the Squire Classic Vibe series and they are built very well. As an example the MAP pricing for a “Squier Vintage Modified 70s Jazz Bass” is below that. And they are far better playing than I could even try to buy for twice that price a few decades ago. I play guitar and synths and bass for fun, with no intention of ever playing live but I just enjoy playing music. I do play with friends but don’t let that stop you. Also you can learn without lessons these days, particularly with free resources on youtube etc… but don’t rule out taking lessons. The huge thing that they do is save you time and unblock your progress. But mostly just do it, if you have an desire to learn or play waiting won’t do anything but delay that urge. It may be frustrating at first but you will learn to play along with songs you like and you don’t have to nail the bass line perfectly to have fun. Even if you greatly simplify the bass line and then start to add in over time it will be a blast. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/22 "2017-02-25T09:05:22Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Dude. Don’t fuck with the bass. > > “Damn catchy and groovy”?! That’s not bass talk. Fucking hold it down. Learn the groove and own it. That’s not catchy. That’s your job. > > ETA: not trying to be a dick. Trying to make your mindset clear. The bass is fucking essential. Aww now, don’t go telling anyone how to think about their instrument. Serve the song, no matter which instrument you’re playing. Sometimes you have to hold it together so everyone else can fly, sometimes you get to take off yourself. Even though I play in what most people would think of as a garage punk band, I have plenty of chance to play lead bass. Everyone’s gotta learn the groove for it to be a good band, nothing special about bass in that aspect. That said, **ETH** seems to know he needs to walk before he can pilot a jet pack. But if he thinks of the bass as a jet pack instead of a pair of shoes, it’s a jet pack. > [@Eddie The Horrible](#): > > Currently I don’t own any stringed instrument but if I can find some half-decent second hand Ibanez or Fender that’s miraculously under say, $400, then yeah I hope to eventually play some CDs on this old goofy cd deck that looks like an ET alien and try something like “Heard It Through the Grapevine” or “Devil With a Blue Dress On”. > > Really - would “Whole Lotta Love” be all that seriously difficult for a beginner? Hehehe, I was thinking about suggesting some John Paul Jones lines earlier, but he can run the gamut from wild to basic. He knows how to serve the song better than almost anyone who’s touched the instrument. Plus, some people can’t take listening to Zeppelin for a variety of reasons. Since you’re willing to listen to it, I’ll suggest what I can. “Whole Lotta Love” was probably the second or third song I learned. It’s dead simple. Work those three notes, get the feel right, and know when to stop and start. When you have that down to the point where you’ve got the feel for it, and can come in at the right points (it’s mostly one part), then tackle “Rock n Roll”. The latter is less simple than the former, it’s genuinely a blues progression and some fills. “Rock n Roll” will wear your ass out just getting down how he plays that blues line so fast if you’re using your fingers to pick. If you’re using a pick and using an alternate picking pattern, it’s much easier. Don’t worry about getting the fills right at the moment, approximate them as best you can, but your real job in this song is to learn that whole step riff in an A blues progression. When you get bored with developing your forearms and hands with “Rock n Roll”, then I’d suggest “Dazed and Confused”. It’ll introduce you to chromatic runs, and has a nice middle part you can learn to play a little lead bass in. When you’ve fooled around with that some, go back and learn the fills from “Rock n Roll” At least, that’s the order I learned them in. Then I moved on to more complex stuff. Plus, even though you don’t seem interested in lessons, hit youtube for some instruction. A little bit of it will go a long way, and there’s lots of good resources to learn from. > [@rat\_avatar](#): > > A few things I would add is that you can get great playing guitars and basses for pretty cheap right now. CNC and other automation has really improved that story and to be honest with a budget of $400 you could get almost anything from the Squire Classic Vibe series and they are built very well. > > As an example the MAP pricing for a “Squier Vintage Modified 70s Jazz Bass” is below that. And they are far better playing than I could even try to buy for twice that price a few decades ago. AMEN! Your instrument dollar has never gone further. The current era is so good, I fear that it can’t last. I have a Squier VM 70’s Jazz, and it’s nearly the equal of any Jazz I’ve played. The used marked is even crazier. If you’re not picky about color and are willing to buy used, you can easily have a very nice bass for less than $200 these days. That wasn’t true when I was a kid, even lawsuit basses were $150 used, and there were still weird off brands permeating the market. A Wal-Mart First Act is better than the Cort I had as my first bass, and it costs less _before you adjust for inflation_. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/23 "2017-02-25T12:18:49Z")
Fair comments - **Eddie** , of course you should do what feels right. As I always champion on the SDMB: whatever keeps you playing is the correct answer. I guess my basic point is what folks have been saying: walk before you run. Besides, a walking bass line is really cool 😉 I point to a different Talking Heads song as having an elemental bass line: Take Me to the River. Simple to play, but a great groove. I totally support the Motown suggestion - James Jamerson is the man. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/24 "2017-02-25T13:46:50Z")
> [@Eddie The Horrible](#): > > Currently - can’t play the thing if I had multiple glocks at my head. Thinking of getting a low-end Ibanez electric with the intention of NOT playing in any eventual bands, just for noodling around while watching tv, etc. - as more of a meditative kind of distraction than anything. Probably have the thing’s intonation set with super low action to accommodate my shittiness. I’m hoping I can avoid lessons (certainly no need at this point to pursue reading) and just fudge my way, for now, and try to pick up shit by ear. > > Lately I’ve been giving a close listen to the following numbers, and was curious > to hear bassist’s opinions in terms of difficulty: > > “Chemical Wire” - Firehouse > > > “Found a Job” - Talking Heads > > > “Deja Vu” - CSNY > [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-S6md3LNgs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-S6md3LNgs) > > ETA - hoping your laptops, etc. aren’t as shitty as mine for picking up any bass in the first place. Deja Vu is more remarkable since it is being played by someone who is not known for being a bass player, Stephen Stills. He played every note of every song except for the drums on their first album. On this their second he still played quite a few different instruments. He is a very underrated musician. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/25 "2017-02-25T13:53:29Z")
Stephen Stills is not underrated in guitar circles at all. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/26 "2017-02-25T14:05:01Z")
[_Cough_](http://www.bassnectar.net/2017/02/atlantic-city-2017/) “The trick is to try to love (or like and respect) something in each and every genre of music… and to keep listening to whats newly released… so the music never gets stale.” “You’re Full of Prunes!” “No, I’m not in any band…” ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/27 "2017-02-25T14:26:11Z")
OT- I’m about as musically incompetent as one can be, but thanks for the CSNY video. I love the sound of 12 string guitars. ---
**Author:** ![ZonexandScout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zonexandscout/32/544_2.png) [@ZonexandScout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZonexandScout)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/28 "2017-02-25T15:27:31Z")
The OP is describing exactly what I do. I started playing a bass just for fun and to noodle around. For some reason, people keep giving me basses and combo amps, so I have several of each. My favorite is an Ibanez SR505. I especially enjoy playing rather simple songs from earlier eras. James Jamerson is definitely a fave. I also like several songs that were originally done by the Wrecking Crew. My Mt Everest would be to play Bruce Thomas’ part on “This Year’s Girl.” But the one song that I will noodle on for hours is “In The Wake of Poseidon.” Don’t know why…I just love it. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/29 "2017-02-25T15:58:02Z")
> [@ZonexandScout](#): > > My Mt Everest would be to play Bruce Thomas’ part on “This Year’s Girl.” Yeah, I was going to mention Elvis Costello’s Pump it Up as a great bassline, but it is not stuff to start out with. ---
**Author:** ![ZonexandScout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zonexandscout/32/544_2.png) [@ZonexandScout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZonexandScout)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/30 "2017-02-25T16:11:33Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Yeah, I was going to mention Elvis Costello’s Pump it Up as a great bassline, but it is not stuff to start out with. No indeed. I have to work a great deal before I can even master a single riff. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/31 "2017-02-25T16:40:05Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Stephen Stills is not underrated in guitar circles at all. Guitar circles? Is that anything like a drum circle? Cause I hate drum circles. He may be well regarded but he is still underrated. The man played every note on every instrument on one of the best rock albums in history. You rarely find him near the top of any lists. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/32 "2017-02-25T16:45:04Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Deja Vu is more remarkable since it is being played by someone who is not known for being a bass player, Stephen Stills. He played every note of every song except for the drums on their first album. On this their second he still played quite a few different instruments. He is a very underrated musician. I don’t think that’s right. His partners played lots of acoustic guitars. In fact Guinnevere has no Stills on it at all. Reportedly he just didn’t get it (?!). And that is one of the best things ever made. Talking about attacking tasty bass parts for a fresh beginner is a little much. None of them were played by beginners. But I’m not a bassist. Maybe start on rthm guitar? Any song can be interesting on rthm guitar for a beginner, and don’t you think almost all of your favorite bassists started that way? I think this was part of their process. YMMV. There’s the Ramones to play along with too. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/33 "2017-02-25T16:53:02Z")
> [@Eddie The Horrible](#): > > ETA - hoping your laptops, etc. aren’t as shitty as mine for picking up any bass in the first place. No serious, self-respecting – or even semi-serious, partially-self-respecting – musician should be listening on laptop speakers. The only bass you will hear is extreme overtones at best. If you are on a limited budget, get yourself a cheap stereo amp and a couple of old bookshelf speakers from a garage sale and plug those into your laptop headphone jack. You may be surprised how good the audio sounds; computers can reproduce amazing audio, but computer speakers can’t. Give your ears a treat while you still have them. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/34 "2017-02-25T17:02:54Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Guitar circles? Is that anything like a drum circle? Cause I hate drum circles. > > He may be well regarded but he is still underrated. The man played every note on every instrument on one of the best rock albums in history. You rarely find him near the top of any lists. Not sure what to say. His excellence as a guitar player is understood and discussed by guitar folks with much respect - he’s simply not underrated as a player. And while we’re at it “one of the best rock albums in history”? Hardly. It’s a solid folk-rock album, but not much more. Clearly YMMV. ETA: From the Wiki page on it - In a contemporary review, Rolling Stone critic Barry Franklin called Crosby, Stills & Nash “an eminently playable record” and “especially satisfying work”, finding the songwriting and vocal harmonies particularly exceptional.[12] Robert Christgau was less enthusiastic in The Village Voice: “I have written elsewhere that this album is perfect, but that is not necessarily a compliment. Only Crosby’s vocal on ‘Long Time Gone’ saves it from a special castrati award.”[11] In a retrospective review, Jason Akeny of AllMusic believed some of the songs’ themes “haven’t dated well” but “the harmonies are absolutely timeless, and the best material remains rock-solid”.[9] In 2003, Rolling Stone ranked Crosby, Stills & Nash number 259 on their list of the 500 greatest albums of all time.[13] ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/35 "2017-02-25T17:10:55Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > I don’t think that’s right. His partners played lots of acoustic guitars. In fact Guinnevere has no Stills on it at all. Reportedly he just didn’t get it (?!). And that is one of the best things ever made. You’re right I overstated it from a memory of what I heard before. He played nearly all of the music on each of the tracks except Nash played acoustic guitar on two songs and Crosby played rhythm on a couple. Crosby was annoyed that Stills was planning on doing the guitar on songs he wrote until he heard the tracks. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/36 "2017-02-25T17:24:46Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > You’re right I overstated it from a memory of what I heard before. He played nearly all of the music on each of the tracks except Nash played acoustic guitar on two songs and Crosby played rhythm on a couple. Crosby was annoyed that Stills was planning on doing the guitar on songs he wrote until he heard the tracks. Well I agree on how good it was. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/37 "2017-02-25T17:30:05Z")
Wow! Thanks everyone for all the helpful ideas so far - definitely to get followed up on. Some other points: > [@scabpicker](#): > > lawsuit basses > [@scabpicker](#): > > Cort I. What the hell are with these bass names? Lawsuit? So, is there a Civil Action Ibanez? Cort? Named after Bud, then? Was he a half-decent bassist? Is it as good as a Micheal J. Pollard Squire II or Billy Barty B.C. Rich “Gremlin”? > [@Count\_Blucher](#): > > [_Cough_](http://www.bassnectar.net/2017/02/atlantic-city-2017/) Gosh:eek:…Very…ambitious, stuff! Maybe I didn’t investigate further enough on youtube, but is my impression correct that it’s more midi stuff, than anything? When I first saw that splashy page I thought - cool - there’s gonna be a phalanx of actual bassists, or something, but…methinks I could be whooshing myself, here. I’m torn between using a pick (which, correct me if I’m wrong, facilitates speed?) or just the plain old fingers. I’m not as interested in speed at this point, and also sometimes the sound of a pick doesn’t feel as…warm?..as fingertips, so I think I’ll forgo a pick for now. But now I’m all wussed-out over the thought of having to build up blister/calluses on the fingertips after _finally_ getting rid of calluses on other parts of my hands after having quit drumming. Something tells me this is going to be a stupid question, but I’ll take the plunge… Why have I never seen a capo on a bass? I’m guessing they’re of no use to a beginner bassist. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/38 "2017-02-25T17:42:57Z")
Lawsuit = instruments made in Japan in the 70’s and early 80’s. A period when U.S. instruments had real quality issues, so th Japanese copies were a great alternative- they are still more affordable when you find them on Reverb or eBay. “Lawsuit” refers to a lawsuit Gibson filed against Ibanez over the shape of their headstocks - I think that is what Gibson argued is unique to its brand. I don’t think the trial happened because Ibanez quickly changed. But now the word is used in general to describe Japanese-made guitars from that era. Cort = brand made in the Far East. Capo: bassist’s typically don’t play chords so a capo doesn’t seem necessary, but I’d want a bassist to comment. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/39 "2017-02-25T18:13:17Z")
Interesting. I’d imagine Gibson flexing its alpha male muscle (more money for litigation?) over Ibanez to do something about their headstocks. Heh I’m wondering if Japanese manufacturers took umbrage took to that term. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2017, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636/40 "2017-02-25T18:50:12Z")
Gibson used the headstock shape because it was the best approach for the suit. Kind of like busting Al Capone for tax evasion. I’ve never heard if any Japanese manufacturers have been offended by the term. But to be clear, they were replicating Gibsons and Fenders exactly, so it’s not like they had much to complain about. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-damn-bass-thing/780636.md?page=3)