# That does it...we're all fucked **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 28, 2000, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907 "2000-06-28T18:11:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![oldscratch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ed655f/32.png) [@oldscratch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oldscratch)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2000, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/21 "2000-06-28T22:45:15Z")
I would ask a question of both DBCooper and SouthernStyle? Do you support abortion in cases of rape? ---
**Author:** ![divemaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/divemaster/32/78_2.png) [@divemaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/divemaster)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2000, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/22 "2000-06-28T23:01:11Z")
> [@](#): > > I would ask a question of both DBCooper and SouthernStyle? Do you support abortion in cases of rape? Watch out guys! He’s settin’ you up! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![oldscratch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ed655f/32.png) [@oldscratch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oldscratch)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2000, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/23 "2000-06-28T23:06:26Z")
How cruel of you divemaster. Of course I’m “setting” them up. Although not really, I’m just trying to find out where they stand on the issue. I’ll take you along my line of thinking. Most laws prohibit late-term abortions except in case of rape, inscest, or health. That seems somewhat hypocritical. Either the baby’s life is sacred or it’s not. You can’t say that a child is more innocent if it was or wasn’t the product of rape. There is nothing against those laws in the supreme court ruling. Yet, I would think that anti-abortion forces would be as against those laws as they are RvW. Just sitting here wondering. ---
**Author:** ![DBCooper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c77e96/32.png) [@DBCooper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DBCooper)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2000, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/24 "2000-06-28T23:17:22Z")
No, I don’t support abortion in cases of rape. It is arrogant, downright vile, even, to prognosticate the future of a newborn based simply on the circumstances of his or her conception. It’s an awful thing to have happen, be forcibly impregnated, but nonetheless, a life has been created, albeit unexpectedly. ---
**Author:** ![Saysha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Saysha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saysha)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2000, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/25 "2000-06-28T23:20:49Z")
Truly true. Even a mother for choice feels saddened when this sort of thing is even an option, or a necessity. > [@](#): > > \*\* > Sigh . . . it’s not as if women are having partial-birth abortions for fun, guys . . . it’s almost always done to save a woman’s life, not because a girl gets to the eighth month and changes her mind. > \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Saysha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Saysha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saysha)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2000, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/26 "2000-06-28T23:27:57Z")
My son is going to be 10 months old on July 4th. Reading these postings has seriously given me a headache, not to mention an ovwerwhelming urge to run home to my children. I am for Choice, always have been, and have had to excercise the option. But this, this partial birth thing, what in the hell is the purpose of this? Health reasons? WHOSE HEALTH?? And is it just me, or are there some sickos out here doing what they can to give us nightmares? “Drain the contents”? For fux sake, people, take your nasty agenda elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![oldscratch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ed655f/32.png) [@oldscratch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oldscratch)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2000, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/27 "2000-06-28T23:32:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > I am for Choice, always have been, and have had to excercise the option. But this, this partial birth thing, what in the hell is the purpose of this? Health reasons? WHOSE HEALTH?? \*\* Whose health do you think? The mothers. Read up on why people actually get the abortions. Things like, if you have the baby you could die, you might never walk again, things like that. > [@](#): > > \*\* > And is it just me, or are there some sickos out here doing what they can to give us nightmares? “Drain the contents”? For fux sake, people, take your nasty agenda elsewhere. > \*\* As long as the baby is in the mother it is her’s to do what she will with it. People will be having abortions weather you like it or not. Might as well make it comfortable and legal as possible ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Cool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecb155/32.png) [@Joe\_Cool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Cool)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2000, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/28 "2000-06-28T23:50:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > As long as the baby is in the mother it is her’s to do what she will with it. People will be having abortions weather you like it or not. Might as well make it comfortable and legal as possible > \*\* What a beautiful argument. People are going to commit rape and murder whether we like it or not, too. Might as well legalize them too, I suppose? And why not theft, battery and arson? Hell, all those things have been illegal for a long long time, and they still happen. Proof that “prohibition doesn’t work” and we might as well cave and make the people who do them comfy and well-adjusted, right? Be real. ---
**Author:** ![DBCooper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c77e96/32.png) [@DBCooper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DBCooper)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/29 "2000-06-29T00:08:05Z")
Yikes. Here we go. _runs from room_ ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/30 "2000-06-29T00:12:49Z")
And another abortion thread breaks out. I thought David and Gaudere sprayed for them a couple weeks ago? ---
**Author:** ![Omega](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a6a055/32.png) [@Omega](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omega)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/31 "2000-06-29T00:13:11Z")
True! I declare that women are nothing but slaves to the baby that they so irresponsibly allowed to be produced inside of them. That child is 100 times more important than her, her decisions, her future, her career, or any of the countless hindrances put upon her by the gift of God, the miracle, that has sprouted in her loins. Why should we allow women the ability to do what they wish with their bodies? Why should they be allowed to determine the course of their lives? I say we’re not going far enough! They should not only be forced to have a child against their will and better judgement, but they should also be subject to my whim and have sex with me whenever I choose!!! They should also do my laundry, make my bed, clean up my room, clean my toilets when I order them to! End women’s suffrage!!! They should be in the home barefoot and pregnant anyway!!! ---
**Author:** ![DBCooper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c77e96/32.png) [@DBCooper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DBCooper)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/32 "2000-06-29T00:18:54Z")
Ok, it looks like we have an idiot stowaway on the S.S. Unresolvable Debate (Omega). Might as well lock this one up now, moderators. I hate blanket abortion debates, and that’s not really what I was trying to do in the OP. **I** sure as hell am jumping ship. ---
**Author:** ![Omega](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a6a055/32.png) [@Omega](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omega)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/33 "2000-06-29T00:33:59Z")
Ooh, idiot… Such an imaginative reply. Sorry for adding a little levity to an obviously unresolvable and pointless debate. Perhaps I was just trying to flush out an intelligent, sarcastic retaliation rather than the usual, typical insult that comes from someone that shares a different point of view on the subject. Sorry to come out in such a way as a newbie, I forgot that my opinion matters much less than yours as evidenced by my lower post count. ---
**Author:** ![SouthernStyle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@SouthernStyle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SouthernStyle)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/34 "2000-06-29T02:11:09Z")
To **oldscratch** - My position on abortion doesn’t matter here. This subject at hand is the procedure referred to as “partial birth abortion”. (You wan’t to discuss abortion in a broader sense let’s go to another thread.) To **tracer** - Since there is no known survey that accurately reports the number of partial birth abortions, it’s difficult to take the ratio of 1 in 10,000 as factual. But assuming (just for a moment) that it is, how many 3rd trimester abortions were then performed? And \*\*Saysha[/] - Thanks for picking up on the “drain the contents” line. > [@](#): > > by oldscratch > > Whose health do you think? The mothers. Read up on why people actually get the abortions. Things like, if you have the baby you could die, you might never walk again, things like that. Better do your homework. Most abortions in this country are voluntary. And I’ve yet to see as few as _one_ study that accurately states the number of partial birth abortions performed in a year and the reasons. > [@](#): > > by **Scylla** > > Look at it this way. Pretend you got a blockage in your colon. Would you rather have them attempt to break it up where it is so that it can come out naturally, or would you rather be sliced in half and have it removed that way? This discussion isn’t about curing constipation. It’s about using a medical procedure for the sole purpose of aborting a viable (or nearly viable) fetus (a.k.a. baby). ---
**Author:** ![Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df788c/32.png) [@Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/35 "2000-06-29T02:28:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > This procedure - which is not known to me, but which sounds quite archaic - is less dangerous to the health of the mother than a Caesarian section? Surely not. The only point of it seems to be to kill the baby. > \*\* Less dangerous than a Caesarian when the placenta has become partially detached and started to bleed so profusely that the mother and baby would both bleed to death in the time it would take you to perform a Caesarian? -Ben ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/36 "2000-06-29T03:02:59Z")
There are between a million and a million and a half abortions a year. If one in 10,000 is accurate, then that would mean that there are between 100 and 150 3rd trimester abortions a year. I thought I saw the figures from CDC or the Nationan Institute of Health Statistics recently, though, and the number of 3rd trimester abortions–while admittedly low–was considerably more than 100-150 nationwide. ---
**Author:** ![Sneevil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@Sneevil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sneevil)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/37 "2000-06-29T03:33:48Z")
> [@](#): > > Nebraska was attempting to pass a state law that would ban partial-birth abortions. In their continuing effort to hasten the apolcolypse, however, the Supreme Court (batting 0-3 lately, in my mind) overruled said hypothetical law. This is the really troubling part. Who the hell is the supreme court to ‘overrule’ the will of the people of the State of Nebraska? This increasingly overbearing and arrogant strong central bureaucracy called the Federal Gov’t has long since overstepped its Constitutional authority in way too many areas of our lives. ---
**Author:** ![Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanook_of_the_North_Shore)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/38 "2000-06-29T03:43:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > Nebraska was attempting to pass a state law that would ban partial-birth abortions. In their continuing effort to hasten the apolcolypse, however, the Supreme Court (batting 0-3 lately, in my mind) overruled said hypothetical law. > > This is the really troubling part. Who the hell is the supreme court to ‘overrule’ the will of the people of the State of Nebraska? This increasingly overbearing and arrogant strong central bureaucracy called the Federal Gov’t has long since overstepped its Constitutional authority in way too many areas of our lives. > \*\* Well in this case no it hasn’t. The Supreme Court is constitionally empowered to review all the laws of the land for adhereance the to Consitution, including state laws. So no I wouldn’t say they overstepped anything. ---
**Author:** ![capacitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@capacitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capacitor)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/39 "2000-06-29T03:49:09Z")
According to several news accounts, the supreme court majority wasn’t as concerned about specific procedures but that the law as was written would subject all those who had second-trimester abortions, using any procedure, to penalty. ---
**Author:** ![DBCooper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c77e96/32.png) [@DBCooper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DBCooper)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2000, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907/40 "2000-06-29T05:52:42Z")
Um…sorry, Omega. Next time, however, you’d probably oughta follow up your irreverant brand of hilarity with a subtle disclaimer or perhaps a smiley, otherwise people might misconstrue what the hell you’re talking about. Sigh…this is all so depressing. All this arguing is so futile. It’s changed nothing. Like somebody said, there’ll always be abortions. The very nature of humankind would have to change in order to completely erase the earth of these sort of abominations. I’m going to bed now. Ahhhh…good old sleep. That’s where I’m a viking!!! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-does-it-were-all-fucked/23907.md?page=3)