# That Five Note Riff ("Close Encounters of the Third Kind"") **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 27, 2010, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709 "2010-06-27T21:06:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2010, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/1 "2010-06-27T21:06:00Z")
What was its function? Was it supposed to activate people or turn them into zombies? Was it a code or recognition signal? I always wondered how anliens reaching the earth would communicate with us-would musical notes be the best way? ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2010, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/2 "2010-06-27T21:28:23Z")
If it helps at all, I have always wondered the same thing. I’m sure some musicologist/psychologist will be along to explain the science behind those notes/tones and how they touch our very souls. However, all I can say about them is that one of the local channels uses them as a signal that some bad weather is on the way and that you should get to the TV to see where and when the danger will be. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2010, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/3 "2010-06-27T21:29:43Z")
In the movie it was a tonal language. I thought that was clear from the dialogue. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2010, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/4 "2010-06-27T21:35:42Z")
I heard once that the riff in Close Encounters was based on “When You Wish Upon a Star,” every other note or every third note or something like that. Any truth to that? ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2010, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/5 "2010-06-28T00:15:52Z")
I was always under the impression it was used to express the idea of communication, without really communicating. By repeating the same tone over and over, you got the idea across that someone or something was trying to get your attention and it is not just random. Sort of like humans (in English at least) try to communicate with dogs or horses by holding out a hand and repeating “here boy” over and over, in somewhat soothing tones. I think the idea is the animal will realize you are trying to communicate and show good faith with the outreached hand, looking it in the eye and making that same sound over and over again. I think that is why in the film it gets a laugh when suddenly the alien craft goes nuts and blares the notes out fast and loud - much like a parent would do in frustration after their kid goes “look, look, look, look…” for the 100th time. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2010, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/6 "2010-06-28T00:42:59Z")
Didn’t it translate to the co-ordinates of the Devils Tower? Or was that something else? ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2010, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/7 "2010-06-28T00:43:11Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > I heard once that the riff in Close Encounters was based on “When You Wish Upon a Star,” every other note or every third note or something like that. Any truth to that? [Close Encounters of the Third Kind - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Close_Encounters_of_the_Third_Kind#Musical_score) has some things to consider on that score. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2010, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/8 "2010-06-28T01:07:01Z")
> [@DMark](#): > > I think that is why in the film it gets a laugh when suddenly the alien craft goes nuts and blares the notes out fast and loud - much like a parent would do in frustration after their kid goes “look, look, look, look..” for the 100th time. So I wonder what happens when the aliens figure out they were jamming with the computers while yelling with frustration at the meaty things standing under their ship? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Nobody38](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/67e7ee/32.png) [@Nobody38](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody38)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/9 "2017-07-11T20:09:34Z")
People… I know the meaning of those 5 notes… I really do… They are DECCG!!! 45337!!! Watch the first 3 videos, it will make it clear… Have a nice day!!! \ ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/10 "2017-07-11T20:16:23Z")
Retorted. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/11 "2017-07-11T20:49:08Z")
According to Exploring Theory with Practica Musica by Jeffrey C. Evans, among the first, most audible, harmonic partials are Do, Do an octave higher, So, Mi, and Re. _Close Encounters_ has Re, Mi, Do, Do an octave lower, and So. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/12 "2017-07-11T20:52:52Z")
Ah, man! I was hoping **Ralph** was back! And, yeah. They were to turn you into zombies. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/13 "2017-07-11T20:53:31Z")
_That_ was certainly a clod encounter of the absurd kind. ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/14 "2017-07-11T21:15:30Z")
Have no recollection where I heard/read this but: D-E-C-C-G were somehow supposed to correspond with H E L L O No clue if it’s true or not. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/15 "2017-07-11T21:30:57Z")
> [@Nobody38](#): > > People… I know the meaning of those 5 notes… I really do… They are DECCG!!! 45337!!! Watch the first 3 videos, it will make it clear… Have a nice day!!! > > \ That’s a mighty nice pile of mashed potatoes you have there, son. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/16 "2017-07-11T21:39:08Z")
**[Moderating]** **Nobody38** , I have removed your link on suspicion that it’s spam. In the unlikely event that it’s not, please explain your thesis using words, by typing those words on your keyboard. Nobody wants to watch three videos just to understand what you’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/17 "2017-07-11T23:04:07Z")
Two things wrong with our newbie’s theory. a) Those aren’t the notes being played (once they contact the ship, it’s G - A - F - f - C). b) The numbers you assign to these note values is wrong, using any scale. The tune is in F-major, not… A minor, I guess, using your notes. So the numbers (assuming F = 1) are 23115. …Which still mean nothing to me, especially given the removed link. Although amusingly the first Google result I get is for California law #23115: > [@](#): > > No vehicle transporting garbage, swill, used cans or bottles, wastepapers, waste cardboard, ashes, refuse, trash, or rubbish, or any noisome, nauseous, or offensive matter, or anything being transported for disposal or recycling shall be driven or moved upon any highway unless the load is totally covered in a manner that will prevent the load or any part of the load from spilling or falling from the vehicle. We weren’t really starting off on the best foot, apparently–just nagging the aliens not to pollute. ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/18 "2017-07-11T23:33:27Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Didn’t it translate to the co-ordinates of the Devils Tower? Or was that something else? No, that was the two groups of three numbers that were being received by the radio telescope. Nobody could figure out what they were until Laughlin remembered he was a cartographer before he was tapped to be Lacombe’s translator. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2017, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/19 "2017-07-12T00:04:29Z")
Any on yuns know Charles Ives’ “[The Unanswered Question](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXD4tIp59L0)?” (This is a very, VERY quiet piece of music. The “question” first gets asked around 1:30 in this link.) (In essence, a horn asks the question with a five-note motif, and the rest of the instruments try to answer it. They do not succeed.) Ultimately, I’m pretty sure the CE3K motif is not supposed to “mean” anything. The aliens have a tonal language (as noted upthread) and they’re probably just sayin’ “Howdy.” (Or “Which way is the restroom?” one of the questions most asked by visitors from afar.) ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2017, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709/20 "2017-07-12T00:27:52Z")
> [@choie](#): > > b) The numbers you assign to these note values is wrong, using any scale. The tune is in F-major, not… A minor, I guess, using your notes. So the numbers (assuming F = 1) are 23115. To be completely fair, since we have no harmony to go on, it can certainly be interpreted in an Am (or Dm in your case) context if you wanted to. It would be a rather odd harmonization, but, hey, it’s possible. F major is by far the most likely tonal center, though (C major and Am work fine, too, using your notes. Dm – which would be the equivalent to the poster you’re responding to’s notes using your notes – is a bit more of a stretch, ending the melody phrase on the 7th note of the scale. BUt, hey, these are aliens. Maybe they’re into intergalactic jazz or something.) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-five-note-riff-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/544709.md?page=2)