# That Girl and Mary Richards. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 27, 2017, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286 "2017-01-27T02:28:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![salinqmind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3ec8ea/32.png) [@salinqmind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/salinqmind)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/21 "2017-01-28T23:40:09Z")
The only things I really liked about That Girl were Marlo Thomas’ beautiful hair and her wardrobe. She had been in England before the show was made and insisted on wearing a kicky, ‘mod’ wardrobe by Mary Quant. That alone moved her character a bit out of the late-50’s. (I thought at the time that if _I_ were That Girl living alone in NYC, I wouldn’t be acting like a 50’s dummy! I hated her father, what a buttinski!) … I loved MTM’s dates, the short guy stands out in my mind, she just loomed over him. He managed to stand on a stair, level with her, and kissed her, and he said, ‘well, that wasn’t exactly magic, was it?’ ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/22 "2017-01-28T23:41:20Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > I translate varkempt with “all choked up”. He was upset that they were giving Mary Richards acolades he thought should go to That Girl and was defending this position passionately. Also, I hate to say this bu,t ‘varkempt’ also conveys a kind of overdramatic not-so-serious emotional response. To me at least. What does “varshtaydict” mean? Varshtaydict, or more commonly spelled “farshtaydict,” just as “varklempt” is more commonly spelled “farklempt,” means “pissed off.” ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/23 "2017-01-28T23:44:43Z")
PS: “farklempt” means something like being too overcome with emotion to speak, like a parent at a bar mitzvah, but most definitely NOT someone overcome with anger and frothing at the mouth. ---
**Author:** ![mikecurtis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikecurtis/32/3284_2.png) [@mikecurtis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mikecurtis)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/24 "2017-01-29T00:07:25Z")
if youre gonna talk about strong single women from the 60’s dont forget julia > **[Julia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_(TV_series))** > > Julia may refer to: mc ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/25 "2017-01-29T00:30:47Z")
> [@mikecurtis](#): > > if youre gonna talk about strong single women from the 60’s dont forget julia > > [Julia - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_(TV_series)) > > mc Nothing against the show or the actress, but I could not watch a single episode of this series after I read the satire of it in _ **MAD Magazine** _, “Jewelia.” Seldom have I laughed at anything so hard and for so long! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/26 "2017-01-29T01:22:12Z")
**FUN FACT:** The secretary who tried to steal Don away from Ann in the Season 3 episode “Ann vs. Secretary” was played by Mary Frann, Bob’s wife on _ **Newhart** _. ---
**Author:** ![installLSC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/54ee81/32.png) [@installLSC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/installLSC)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/27 "2017-01-29T02:57:08Z")
[Here’s an interesting article about arguably the original single career woman series](http://www.tvobscurities.com/articles/meet_millie/), “Meet Millie” from 1952. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/28 "2017-01-29T03:15:51Z")
> [@installLSC](#): > > [Here’s an interesting article about arguably the original single career woman series](http://www.tvobscurities.com/articles/meet_millie/), “Meet Millie” from 1952. Great article, but I’m surprised that no mention was made of Florence’s role as the obnoxious Mrs Hufnagle on _ **St Elsewhere** _, or Marvin’s voicing of Choo-Choo on _ **Top Cat** _ (not to mention the hilarious garage scene in _ **It’s a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World** _). ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/29 "2017-01-29T03:22:00Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > **FUN FACT:** The secretary who tried to steal Don away from Ann in the Season 3 episode “Ann vs. Secretary” was played by Mary Frann, Bob’s wife on _ **Newhart** _. So was Mary’s new friend in “Some of My Best Friends are Rhoda.” ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/30 "2017-01-29T04:46:31Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > So was Mary’s new friend in “Some of My Best Friends are Rhoda.” **[VOICE OF JOHNNY CARSON]** I did not know that! ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/31 "2017-01-29T06:08:42Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > PS: “farklempt” means something like being too overcome with emotion to speak, like a parent at a bar mitzvah, but most definitely NOT someone overcome with anger and frothing at the mouth. Then I did use the right word as I was trying to convey a comic hurtness and not comic anger. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/32 "2017-01-29T13:22:43Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > **[VOICE OF JOHNNY CARSON]** I did not know that! And Johnny “appeared” on the _MTM_ episode “Mary’s Big Party”. [spoiler]He was supposed to show up at a party Mary was throwing. There was a power blackout. Johnny showed up near the end and spoke a little. But it was dark so you only heard him. Who knew that one of Mary’s parties would turn out bad?[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Cayuga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Cayuga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cayuga)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/33 "2017-01-29T20:35:40Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > I think That Girl was a necessary step. Thomas was only the second woman, after Lucille Ball, to be involved in the production of her own tv show. She was bra-less, which was a big step forward. It was the first show about a single woman with her own career. And, the series finale didn’t end with a wedding, contrary to what the network wanted, because Thomas didn’t want the show to end with the message that marriage was the only natural goal for young women. > > All of those were major changes from the sitcom world of the 60s. Very true. Ann Marie (I always wondered where her last name went\*) was a probably necessary intermediate between 1950s TV and Mary Richards. And while she was, technically, “single and working,” per the OP, 1) she met Donald in the first episode and dated him through the run of the show, so that’s not so much “dating” as “in a committed relationship,” and 2) she didn’t really work all that often. I assumed her parents were paying the rent on her Upper West Side apartment and probably putting money in a bank account each month so she could buy food. Mary was the first character to date around a lot and actually support herself with her own work. \*Don’t bother; I know. ---
**Author:** ![seal\_cleaner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@seal\_cleaner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/seal_cleaner)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2017, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/34 "2017-01-30T00:47:40Z")
Donald was a single version of the Dumb Dad so prevalent in sitcoms. Consternation was his go-to emotion. ---
**Author:** ![Greg\_Charles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/839c29/32.png) [@Greg\_Charles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greg_Charles)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2017, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/35 "2017-01-30T13:05:06Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > Varshtaydict, or more commonly spelled “farshtaydict,” just as “varklempt” is more commonly spelled “farklempt,” means “pissed off.” The closest hit I can find in Yiddish word lists is: Far-tshadikt − Confused, bewildered, befuddled, as if by fumes, gas Do you have a better reference I could try? ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_s\_Son](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19adc/32.png) [@Jim\_s\_Son](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_s_Son)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/36 "2017-01-31T04:29:34Z")
> [@Cayuga](#): > > Very true. Ann Marie (I always wondered where her last name went\*) was a probably necessary intermediate between 1950s TV and Mary Richards. And while she was, technically, “single and working,” per the OP, 1) she met Donald in the first episode and dated him through the run of the show, so that’s not so much “dating” as “in a committed relationship,” and 2) she didn’t really work all that often. I assumed her parents were paying the rent on her Upper West Side apartment and probably putting money in a bank account each month so she could buy food. > > Mary was the first character to date around a lot and actually support herself with her own work. > > \*Don’t bother; I know. Did “Honey West” (Anne Francis) ever date around? She certainly supported herself as heading her own detective agency although I always assumed she was involved with her partner Sam Bolt (John Ericson…who is still alive at age 90). When it comes to “That Girl” I always remember what one producer said about Marlo Thomas “I don’t know if I would work with her again but I don’t know if I wouldn’t. I’ll say this: she can decorate my house anytime. The woman has exquisite taste”. Still when you consider that Marlo Thomas was originally offered the housewife role in “My Mother the Car”, she did pretty good with making “That Girl” a step forward. ---
**Author:** ![sinjin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@sinjin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinjin)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/37 "2017-01-31T04:55:21Z")
62 year old woman who grew up in the 70’s: I loved Mary Richard and hated Ann Marie. Ann Marie was a 50’s girl with a job. Mary was who I wanted to be, except I wanted to be an engineer. Her co-workers so resembled mine in the Aerospace industry in the 70’s it was ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286/38 "2017-02-02T22:27:36Z")
> [@mikecurtis](#): > > if youre gonna talk about strong single women from the 60’s dont forget julia > > [Julia - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_(TV_series)) > > mc Exactly what I came in to mention…Of course, there was always Honey West. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-girl-and-mary-richards/778286.md?page=1)