# That Screeching Moment When You Realize Just How Fucked Up Things Are **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 18, 2008, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004 "2008-01-18T12:45:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Omegaman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e480ec/32.png) [@Omegaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omegaman)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/21 "2008-01-18T16:30:35Z")
Mooo! ---
**Author:** ![lisacurl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/41988e/32.png) [@lisacurl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisacurl)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/22 "2008-01-18T16:56:17Z")
You want to find out what people really are? See what they do in a natural disaster. Welcome to reality, Naomi Klein. Most people aren’t very selfless or nice. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/23 "2008-01-18T17:07:32Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Not as bad as French Impressionists. A love of Monet is the root of all evil. [/QUOTE] I forgave the “Thetan” one, but now you’re really pushing your luck… ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/24 "2008-01-18T17:29:15Z")
[“You think you’re so clever and classless and free, But you’re still fucking peasants as far as I can see.”](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njG7p6CSbCU) ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/25 "2008-01-18T17:30:46Z")
[QUOTE=Jackmannii] So she doesn’t want any part of going to a hospital serving nasty, dirty refugees, decides she doesn’t really need medical care, then passes out from a concussion (demonstrating just how good her judgment was). [/QUOTE] Concussions can have that effect on people. I wouldn’t draw conclusions about her over-all ability to reason based on her actions immediatly after receiving a blow to the head. The “nasty, dirty refugees” part is, as near as I can tell, purely your own invention, as the point she’s clearly making is that she figured that any medical institution in the city would be swamped by patients, and she wouldn’t be able to get any medical attention because of the crowd. Luckily for her, there are still plenty of doctors who are in it just for the money, and don’t give a damn about actually helping people. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/26 "2008-01-18T17:34:13Z")
[QUOTE=silenus] So you’re saying violent revolution and some salutary hangings are called for? 😃 [/QUOTE] And then it’s long pig pie for everybody!!! 😛 (\ **Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/27 "2008-01-18T17:58:21Z") [QUOTE=Miller] …the point she’s clearly making is that she figured that any medical institution in the city would be swamped by patients, and she wouldn’t be able to get any medical attention because of the crowd. [/quote] Yes, waiting for care clearly is for the “little people”. > [@](#): > > Luckily for her, there are still plenty of doctors who are in it just for the money, and don’t give a damn about actually helping people. Yeah, they should just have spit on her and headed downtown to help the deserving. Most likely she was triaged to a less busy facility precisely because her injuries didn’t look too serious. Her reaction to actually getting attention is to sneer at the people who helped her. Bizarre, but not as bizarre as assuming that physicians shouldn’t be on duty at a suburban hospital, because of course no one in the area could possiibly have been injured in the storm or had other acute or chronic medical problems needing attention, being suburbanites and all. I can’t tell if the docs she allegedly saw playing cards were on ER duty, but from experience I can tell you that demands in the ER vary widely. One minute things are slack, and the next all hell has broken loose. Maybe she has valid wider points to be made, but everything posted so far about her revelatory hospital experience sounds like anecdotal bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/28 "2008-01-18T19:44:47Z")
Let me add to your list of outrages - I’m just about finished reading a book called["Crash Proof: How To Profit From the Coming Economic Collapse" by Peter D. Schiff.](http://www.amazon.com/Crash-Proof-Economic-Collapse-Sonberg/dp/0470043601) Aside from the point of his book (how to profit from the economic wasteland that the U.S. is about to become), it’s a frightening read about how the United States got into the position it’s in today - an incredibly diverse, wealthy nation that’s damned near bankrupt. There are many, many reasons to hate the rich and the governments that cater to them off the backs of the masses. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/29 "2008-01-18T19:52:47Z")
Actually, let me add to that - the wealthy have a lot to answer for, but so do governments that make getting re-elected their first and foremost priority, instead of actually running the country for the benefit of everyone in it. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/30 "2008-01-18T20:00:09Z")
Heck, I’m reading Galbraith’s **The Culture of Ocntentment** , and he laid it out pretty well in 1992. Ditto for David Halberstam’s **The Next Century** , written in 1991. In both instances, these intelligent-seeming individuals present cases that are pretty convincing to me, that a very major (if not the overriding) intent and result of US policy over the end of the 20th century was to increase the concentration of wealth in the hands of the wealthiest. And if you accept even a fraction of what they say as true, it is clear that the trends they identify has not slowed a bit in the most recent 2 decades. It is hard to refute that the rich are continually getting richer and richer, while not all that many other public objectives seem to be improving anywhere near apace. If further increasing the richest’s share of the wealth has not been the intent, it has certainly been the result. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/31 "2008-01-18T20:12:00Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Not as bad as French Impressionists. A love of Monet is the root of all evil. [/QUOTE] It has a Corot-sive effect on society. ---
**Author:** ![Pazu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pazu/32/15522_2.png) [@Pazu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pazu)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/32 "2008-01-18T20:49:20Z")
Naomi Klein makes a lot of ignorant assumptions. > [@](#): > > After receiving a few stitches, Klein recounted that she wasn’t able to leave the hospital because of the curfew in New Orleans, and in order to pass time, attempted to interview the intern who was tending to her. > > “I asked if he worked the hurricane and he said, ‘No, thank God, I wasn’t on duty. I actually live in the suburbs.’” > > “Did you go to any of the shelters?” Klein recalled asking the intern. “He looked at me, confused. I wasn’t trying to be a bitch,” Klein exclaimed to chuckles from the audience. “I just assumed that someone who just learned how to be a doctor would want to go to the shelters and help. > > “It actually hadn’t even occurred to him to go to one of the shelters, just as it hadn’t occurred to any of the doctors and nurses in this hospital that, instead of being in their fortress, dealing with three or four patients … they could be out there.” 1. So, if the physicians she saw could be “out there”, then who’s going to cover service in _this_ hospital? 2. How does she know what the hospital census was? Is she seriously trying to claim there were only “three or four” patients in the entire hospital? 3. It probably hadn’t occurred to the medical intern to go volunteer at a shelter because when interns are off duty, they tend to want to do things like, you know, actually get some sleep. And maybe eat something. Does she have any fucking clue what a medical internship actually is? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/33 "2008-01-18T20:49:50Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] She also describes [HelpJet](http://www.usatoday.com/travel/flights/2006-09-18-hurricane-evacuation-style_x.htm) which is a charter air service, for those who can afford it, that will evacuate you pretty much anywhere you want to go, if it looks like a hurricane is coming. [/QUOTE] What’s wrong with this? Here are a bunch of folks who will get out of town on a private jet instead of taking up space in the commercial jets or further clogging up the roads. I used to work in the disaster recovery business, and one of the key points is that having a business in this market means you gather assets and personnel who are prepared to act, well in advance of the event. When the event happens, those assets and personnel are brought to bear, and that can very well free up the public services that would have been used for those folks. Let’s say that HelpJet takes off. You have available airport space being used for evacuation that wouldn’t have been used before, and couldn’t be used before because nobody had contracts with these plane owners. Then you spin off HelpBus, a service that contracts with bus companies to arrange for pre-disaster evacuation. Buses that would normally have been hundreds of miles away get driven in to evacuate customers. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/34 "2008-01-18T20:55:15Z")
[QUOTE=Cheesesteak] What’s wrong with this? Here are a bunch of folks who will get out of town on a private jet instead of taking up space in the commercial jets or further clogging up the roads. I used to work in the disaster recovery business, and one of the key points is that having a business in this market means you gather assets and personnel who are prepared to act, well in advance of the event. When the event happens, those assets and personnel are brought to bear, and that can very well free up the public services that would have been used for those folks. Let’s say that HelpJet takes off. You have available airport space being used for evacuation that wouldn’t have been used before, and couldn’t be used before because nobody had contracts with these plane owners. Then you spin off HelpBus, a service that contracts with bus companies to arrange for pre-disaster evacuation. Buses that would normally have been hundreds of miles away get driven in to evacuate customers. [/QUOTE] But surely the government can take care of that, what with [all the school buses](http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40765000/jpg/_40765970_buses.jpg) they have available… ---
**Author:** ![Plynck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Plynck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plynck)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/35 "2008-01-18T21:12:05Z")
It seems to me that the OP is trying to make two points. I’m going to stay away from the Naomi Klein argument, because I’m not sure what point he is making. [QUOTE=Dinsdale] Heck, I’m reading Galbraith’s **The Culture of Ocntentment** , and he laid it out pretty well in 1992. Ditto for David Halberstam’s **The Next Century** , written in 1991. In both instances, these intelligent-seeming individuals present cases that are pretty convincing to me, that a very major (if not the overriding) intent and result of US policy over the end of the 20th century was to increase the concentration of wealth in the hands of the wealthiest. [/QUOTE] This was also Johnston’s point in the Fresh Air interview. His contention is that government policies and economics from post-WWII to 1980 were geared toward the advancement of the middle class, and that those policies have skewed since the Reagan years (trickle down economy, anyone?) toward the upper income class, irrespective of the party of the administration. Based upon my own observations, this certainly seems to be true. The cost of education, even at a State University, is staggering compared to when I went to school. The division between the have-too-muches and the don’t-have-enoughs widens every day. Our infrastructure is crumbling while the wealthy move into gated communities and bitch about taxes. If I were to hazard a guess, it would be to put the blame at the feet of our electoral system. Candidates (whether for the House, the Senate or the White House) need television to get their messages out, and that requires money. Lots and lots of money. And when those who funded a campaign demand a little _quid pro quo_, it is easy to see why tax cuts and loopholes top the list. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/36 "2008-01-18T22:05:12Z")
[QUOTE=Cheesesteak] What’s wrong with this? Here are a bunch of folks who will get out of town on a private jet instead of taking up space in the commercial jets or further clogging up the roads. [/QUOTE] In a way, doesn’t that make them the _real_ heroes? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/37 "2008-01-18T22:14:06Z")
When the going gets touch, the rich are already gone. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/38 "2008-01-18T23:07:26Z")
[QUOTE=Plynck] I’m going to stay away from the Naomi Klein argument, because I’m not sure what point he is making. [/QUOTE] Well all right then, no wonder he’s so angry. He’s tired of people calling him Naomi. Is he, like, Finnish or something? ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2008, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/39 "2008-01-18T23:31:39Z")
You know, thinking about this a little more, this is how things have always been in human society - the most powerful make the rules (and the rules ALWAYS benefit them), and the rest of us suck hind tit. It was this way when Og smashed his first sabre toothed tiger’s head in and started wearing the pelt, and it will be this way until us _Homo sapiens_ manage to wipe ourselves out. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2008, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004/40 "2008-01-19T00:07:54Z")
[QUOTE=Zebra] A long time ago, I read Catch-22. [/QUOTE] **1st Lt. Milo Minderbinder:** Nately died a wealthy man, Yossarian. He had over sixty shares in the syndicate. **Yossarian:** What difference does that make? He’s dead. **1st Lt. Milo Minderbinder:** Then his family will get it. **Yossarian:** He didn’t have time to have a family. **1st Lt. Milo Minderbinder:** Then his parents will get it. \*\*Yossarian: \*\* They don’t need it, they’re rich. **1st Lt. Milo Minderbinder:** Then they’ll understand. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/that-screeching-moment-when-you-realize-just-how-fucked-up-things-are/434004.md?page=3)