# That's just sad now, Kanye West. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 29, 2019, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663 "2019-10-29T18:25:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/61 "2019-11-21T11:34:01Z")
I won’t call you a SJW, but I will say that I don’t agree with the nihilistic attitude that any and all actions are equal in worth and value and morality, therefore, you can’t express disaproval or distaste for them in any way–which is what the term “slut shaming” implies. I won’t call KK a slut–but I will call her that slime of sweat and dead skin that accumulates between your toes when you wear shoes with no socks on a hot day. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/62 "2019-11-21T11:44:06Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > I won’t call you a SJW, but I will say that I don’t agree with the nihilistic attitude that any and all actions are equal in worth and value and morality, therefore, you can’t express disaproval or distaste for them in any way–which is what the term “slut shaming” implies That’s preposterous. _All_ it says is that, of the category of things one can legitimately express disapproval or distaste for, some random woman’s level of sexuality should not be one of them. There’s nothing “nihilistic” about that, and it does _not_ imply “all actions are equal in worth and value and morality”. I have _plenty_ of actions I have no problem expressing distaste and disapproval for. And if this were a different forum, I’d be starting round about now… ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/63 "2019-11-21T17:02:20Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > _All_ it says is that, of the category of things one can legitimately express disapproval or distaste for, some random woman’s level of sexuality should not be one of them. Why not? What makes you the arbiter of which moral judgements people are allowed to express and which they aren’t? Are people allowed to voice disapproval at male promiscuity, or is that verboten, too? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/64 "2019-11-21T18:35:42Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Why not? Because it’s a shitty thing to do. Can’t really help you if you can’t see why that is. > [@](#): > > What makes you the arbiter of which moral judgements people are allowed to express and which they aren’t? LOL at the thought that it’s just me. > [@](#): > > Are people allowed to voice disapproval at male promiscuity, or is that verboten, too? Are you asking if men can be slutshamed too? I’d say yes, but there’s a different history to it so it doesn’t really carry the same weight, now does it?. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/65 "2019-11-21T21:15:30Z")
Again, how is calling the tape porn “shaming”? Did I say that there was anything wrong with porn? And if she was on the rise as a celebrity before that: For what? The vast majority of people had never heard of her before that tape. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/66 "2019-11-21T21:22:58Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Because it’s a shitty thing to do. Can’t really help you if you can’t see why that is. If finding the Kardashians repulsive is wrong I don’t wanna be right. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/67 "2019-11-21T23:12:20Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > In a recent appearance on The Late Show with James Corden, Kanye West said he received a [68 Million tax refund](http://www.msn.com/en-us/music/celebrity/kanye-west-says-he-got-a-dollar68-million-tax-return/ar-AAJwsJf?ocid=ientp): Actually the cite you listed didn’t say tax refund. It said tax return. In the article he talks about how he made $115m last year but was $35m in debt. He’s not the most articulate person in the world. It looks like he’s saying he’s $68 million on the plus side this year. What’s the expression for that? Your line 37? I forget. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/68 "2019-11-22T00:31:38Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Yeah! Just because he likes fish sticks?? It’s more than that. He likes to put fish sticks in his mouth. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/69 "2019-11-22T05:12:25Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Again, how is calling the tape porn “shaming”? Did I say that there was anything wrong with porn? Oh, I was unaware that you were so far outside of society that you were completely innocent of the common perceptions of porn in it. My bad. :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > And if she was on the rise as a celebrity before that: For what? For having famous, rich father(s), and wearing nice clothes, and hanging out with other Hollywood socialites, like Paris Hilton and Lindsay Lohan. > [@](#): > > The vast majority of people had never heard of her before that tape. You’re aware her reality show was in production before the tape surfaced, right? Believe me, the Kardashians were going to be a thing, tape or no. That’s just the nature of how the TV landscape was changing towards reality shows. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/70 "2019-11-22T05:14:03Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > If finding the Kardashians repulsive is wrong I don’t wanna be right. It’s possible to find them repulsive and not slutshame them or mischaracterise their activities. Ask me how i know this… ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/71 "2019-11-22T12:09:21Z")
OK, then. Last year, there was a woman who was making the news a lot due to various allegations concerning President Trump. Most of the news stories referred to her as “porn star Stormy Daniels”. Were they slut-shaming Ms. Daniels? > [@](#): > > You’re aware her reality show was in production before the tape surfaced, right? Yes, because they knew that she was about to become famous enough to support such a show. Which she wasn’t, before the porn tape. That’s evidence that the whole thing was orchestrated, not that it wasn’t. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/72 "2019-11-22T12:31:40Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > OK, then. Last year, there was a woman who was making the news a lot due to various allegations concerning President Trump. Most of the news stories referred to her as “porn star Stormy Daniels”. Were they slut-shaming Ms. Daniels? Are you j_oking_? Daniels was an actual, professional porn actress. And note that calling KK a porn star is only _part_ of what makes your posts slutshaming. But by all means, continue to double down. I’m sure I’m not the only one interested in your views. Certainly throws many an ATMB thread into a new light > [@](#): > > Yes, because they knew that she was about to become famous enough to support such a show. She had foreknowledge that a leak by someone else was going to happen a year before it did, is what you’re saying. With absolutely zero evidence. > [@](#): > > Which she wasn’t, before the porn tape. I think it’s obvious you have less than zero understanding of how reality TV works. There are scores of people famous for nothing but being on reality TV shows. They weren’t famous before, either. Kim had already been appearing on TV, and in the pap rags.She was not some nobody. > [@](#): > > That’s evidence that the whole thing was orchestrated, not that it wasn’t. What, that time travel had to be involved? Sure, whatever you say…_backs away slowly_ ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/73 "2019-11-22T12:45:49Z")
Stormy Daniels and Kim Kardassian are both women who found it lucrative to deliberately release videos of themselves having sex. Therefore they are both porn actresses. It is no more shameful for one than it is for the other. And yes, of course she knew that someone else was going to leak the tape, because she arranged with the leaker for it to happen. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/74 "2019-11-22T13:03:30Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > But by all means, continue to double down. I’m sure I’m not the only one interested in your views. And I’m sure that I’m not the only one rolling my eyes at yours. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/75 "2019-11-22T13:21:05Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Stormy Daniels and Kim Kardassian are both women who found it lucrative to deliberately release videos of themselves having sex. That is not true. Kim Kardashian did not release her own tape. I don’t see why you think it helps your case to be spreading a falsehood like that. > [@](#): > > And yes, of course she knew that someone else was going to leak the tape, because she arranged with the leaker for it to happen Where’s your \*evidence \*for this? > [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > And I’m sure that I’m not the only one rolling my eyes at yours. Believe me, eyerolls from the likes of you definitely help. Roll them harder! ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/76 "2019-11-22T13:37:16Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Believe me, eyerolls from the likes of you definitely help. Roll them harder! Believe me, I am. ---
**Author:** ![planetcory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/planetcory/32/1032_2.png) [@planetcory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/planetcory)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/77 "2019-11-22T16:58:11Z")
I’m trying to understand the logic behind ‘she’s wildly popular because of her wildly popular sex tape that was wildly popular because she was a nobody.’ ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/78 "2019-11-22T20:32:50Z")
As opposed to what other reason she’s wildly popular? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/79 "2019-11-22T21:02:28Z")
Why are any of the Real Housewives of New York, Hollywood, Atlanta and East Bumfuck popular? Or why were the cast of Jersey Shore popular? Or those fake bearded yokels who make duck calls? Because people saw them on the gogglebox. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663/80 "2019-11-22T22:00:17Z")
And none of them got the show named after them. With those shows, they came up with some premise, then looked around and made casting calls to find people to put on the show. Nobody went to a producer and said “Hey, let’s make a show about Dolores!”. You only do that if the person is already famous before the show. Or you expect them to become so. Because of, say, a widely-popularized sex tape. The whole thing makes no sense whatsoever if it wasn’t all orchestrated. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thats-just-sad-now-kanye-west/842663.md?page=5)