# The 10 Greatest Books of All Time **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 13, 2008, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059 "2008-12-13T22:06:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Icerigger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icerigger/32/432_2.png) [@Icerigger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icerigger)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2008, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/21 "2008-12-13T23:17:44Z")
> [@](#): > > The White Mountains by John Christopher Tripods, Tripods! ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2008, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/22 "2008-12-13T23:22:07Z")
> [@blinkingblinking](#): > > I am not sure what you were reading but it was not anything I posted. I did not call the ‘greats’ unreadable and terrible. I think I was reading the part where you said something to the effect of Lolita is unreadable and Slaughterhouse 5 is terrible, each of which was picked by you from a list of what people called the “greats” for reasons you just couldn’t figure out. Maybe I’m remembering wrong or something. > [@](#): > > I said in my opinion ‘Lolita’ is unreadable and ‘Slaughterhouse-5’ terrible. They are what is called ‘examples’. I did say I suspected many critics of being pretentious in listing their ‘best’ books. …oh. So this is a thread where you’re trying to figure out why people disagree with your opinion? ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2008, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/23 "2008-12-13T23:36:25Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > …oh. So this is a thread where you’re trying to figure out why people disagree with your opinion? Jeez, cut him some slack, he obviously didn’t expect people to pick his every word apart and he doesn’t want to fight about it. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2008, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/24 "2008-12-13T23:41:08Z")
You got it. ---
**Author:** ![Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bc8723/32.png) [@Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fish)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2008, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/25 "2008-12-13T23:48:41Z")
I notice that his 10 greatest books are all fiction, too. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/26 "2008-12-14T00:11:58Z")
> [@blinkingblinking](#): > > I always think the lists would be more eclectic and more ‘popular’. … > Does anyone care to comment on why these lists always seem to favour the same ‘classics’? Depending on what is meant by “greatest,” it doesn’t surprise me at all that the books (or novels, if you want to focus on novels) that are considered the greatest are not necessarily the most popular. A truly great book may well be over the heads of most readers, and be capable of being fully appreciated only by a relative few. But, at least one valid way of defining greatness is to say that **the greatest books are those that have the most to offer those who are able to appreciate them**. For example, I’ve read Faulkner’s _The Sound and the Fury_, or at least tried to. I didn’t get out of it nearly as much as I would have if I were a better reader of that sort of literature or if I were willing to put more time and effort into understanding it. I can see how it may well have taken genius to write, and I have at least some idea why the people who do “get” it find it so impressive. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/27 "2008-12-14T00:16:39Z")
> [@Fish](#): > > I notice that his 10 greatest books are all fiction, too. Oh right… Dale Cooper is a character on Twin Peaks. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Ruminator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Ruminator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruminator)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/28 "2008-12-14T01:02:17Z")
> [@blinkingblinking](#): > > I always think the lists would be more eclectic and more ‘popular’ > … > Does anyone care to comment on why these lists always seem to favour the same ‘classics’? My guess is that you are misunderstanding what these top-100 type of lists actually represent. They do not try to list the “most enjoyable” books. The committees of judges that vote on these “greatest books” lists are voracious readers that have read thousands of books each. For example, one of the judges on the Modern Library list is Daniel J Boorstin. That guy used to work at the US Library of Congress. These demanding readers want books with complexity, symbolism, allegory, multiple-interpretations, clever allusions, etc. While all of today’s best-selling authors (Stephen King, Clancy, Grisham, Crichton, Rowling, etc) do incorporate these literary techniques into their own works, they do not approach the unique combination of these qualities that Shakespeare and Tolstoy have achieved. ---
**Author:** ![appleciders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85f322/32.png) [@appleciders](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/appleciders)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/29 "2008-12-14T01:11:24Z")
One of your lists has three Ayn Rand and three L. Ron Hubbard books in the top ten. Seriously? ---
**Author:** ![blinkingblinking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ea5d25/32.png) [@blinkingblinking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blinkingblinking)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/30 "2008-12-14T01:17:29Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > I think I was reading the part where you said something to the effect of Lolita is unreadable and Slaughterhouse 5 is terrible, each of which was picked by you from a list of what people called the “greats” for reasons you just couldn’t figure out. Maybe I’m remembering wrong or something. > > …oh. So this is a thread where you’re trying to figure out why people disagree with your opinion? Would you mind not replying to any of my threads ever again? Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Ruminator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Ruminator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruminator)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/31 "2008-12-14T01:18:07Z")
> [@appleciders](#): > > One of your lists has three Ayn Rand and three L. Ron Hubbard books in the top ten. Seriously? There are 2 separate lists on the Modern Library page – “Board’s List” and “Reader’s List.” The L Ron Hubbard books are on the “Reader’s List” aka the “unwashed masses’ list.” ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/32 "2008-12-14T01:27:52Z")
> [@blinkingblinking](#): > > Does anyone care to comment on why these lists always seem to favour the same ‘classics’? Because the compilers of these lists feel those books belong on their lists. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/33 "2008-12-14T01:38:43Z")
I always wonder how many of these 100 Best Books will still be regarded by anyone in a century. _The History of Emily Montague_ and the entire corpus of William Congreve’s celebrated works are already vanished even from the most priggish compilations. The failed Joycean experiments seem to have the most to lose from this process, with Faulkner’s stylized kudzu next on the list. Not to say I didn’t enjoy what of their work I’ve read, just that linguistic drift will not be kind to the onionskin puns and the phonetic jumping-jacks. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/34 "2008-12-14T01:44:34Z")
> [@blinkingblinking](#): > > I thought it was obvious that I was just listing my favourite 10 books. That was part of my point. It was not the least bit obvious. You put on the title The 10 Greatest Books of All Time. Then you said here’s my list. You never gave even a hint that the list was anything other than your list of the 10 greatest books. Mind reading is not part of our talents. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Who](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Doctor\_Who](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Who)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/35 "2008-12-14T02:19:35Z")
I just want to throw in that I think Slaughterhouse Five is one of the greatest books of all time. Pretty damn close to the greatest. And THAT’S the problem with these things. They are so absolutely subjective and based on pure personal taste that they are almost completely useless. Unless you are planning a trip to the library and you want to try and check out something decent. Otherwise useless. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/36 "2008-12-14T02:29:38Z")
IMHO, FWIW, if you held a gun to my head: The Bible _The Collected Works of William Shakespeare_ _The Lord of the Rings_ by J.R.R. Tolkien _Tuf Voyaging_ by George R.R. Martin _The Forever War_ by Joe Haldeman _Aztec_ by Gary Jennings _Arthur Rex_ by Thomas Berger _Pride and Prejudice_ by Jane Austen _The Battle Cry of Freedom_ by James McPherson _The Civil War_ by Shelby Foote ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/37 "2008-12-14T03:34:15Z")
> [@Fish](#): > > I notice that his 10 greatest books are all fiction, too. And “Hamlet” wasn’t really a book, and in its usually presented form is not actually entirely representative of what Shakespeare wrote. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/38 "2008-12-14T04:04:41Z")
> [@blinkingblinking](#): > > Timeline by Michael Crichton > The White Mountains by John Christ **Timeline**?!?!?! Like _the_ **Timeline**? We’re not talking about some other secret **Tmeline** that doesn’t suck, are we? **Timeline** is the worst book ever written. You discover time travel, and the first thing that pops in your head is “Let’s start a theme park!”? Dude, Crichton, come up with a new plot. It doesn’t even make a little sense this time around. And that is not even getting into the fact that the “technology” has “flaws” that make no sense and would only exist in a world written by someone looking for cheap ways to rachet up the drama. Add to that the completely cardboard characters. And the fact that ever female acts like…well like a character written by a guy who evidently has trouble with women. And then you have the most mind-blowing waste of time ever. The only thing worse than **Timeline** the book is **Timeline** the movie. ---
**Author:** ![Vox\_Imperatoris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Vox\_Imperatoris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vox_Imperatoris)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/39 "2008-12-14T08:13:22Z")
I just don’t care if a book is considered “great” or not because of its “mastery of symbolism”. If it is not enjoyable to read, it is worthless. This is not to say that I don’t like the classics or that books without non-stop action can’t be enjoyable (I like _Crime and Punishment_ and some books written primary to express philosophical themes, for example). But James Joyce can go in the bin with the Wal-Mart Romance novels for all I care (if you genuinely enjoy it, of course, then that’s fine with me). Valete, Vox Imperatoris ETA: I don’t think there is any meaning to “10 Greatest Books of All Time”. I could come up with 10 books that I like the most, but that doesn’t mean that they are necessarily the absolute greatest works ever to be put to paper, just that I happen to like them the most. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2008, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059/40 "2008-12-14T08:39:57Z")
It’s perfectly reasonable to define “the best of all time” as “the most entertaining for me”. Classics like “The Iliad” appear on lists of the best books of all time, which astounds me. Does anyone enjoy reading stuff like that? The way I’d define the best of all time is “I enjoy them the most, and it would be hard to find a better example of it even within it’s own genre.” I like Atlas Shrugged (except the part everyone hates). I think Ender’s Game broke ground it isn’t recognized enough for. Huckleberry Finn is outrageously entertaining and timeless. I don’t really have the motivation to make a list of 10, but I can’t think of many classics I actually enjoy reading. Books that people include in lists of “literature” that they insist are a separate category from “fiction” are almost universally unreadable to me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-10-greatest-books-of-all-time/477059.md?page=3)