# "The 15 warnings signs of tyranny" **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 12, 2017, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928 "2017-01-12T02:18:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/21 "2017-01-12T04:38:19Z")
Similar lists of fascist warning signs were passed around during the GWB years. Not that they were wrong. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/22 "2017-01-12T05:10:15Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > Interesting…the ‘weak minded’ left wing that believes in facts rather than feelings. > > Solutions…solutions…like, say, repealing ACA without any kind of alternative? And, while we’re here, how about the problems created by your boy Dubya that had to be cleaned up by…who? Oh, right, those weak-minded liberals. > > Please, don’t be afraid to let your bias show. Let’s all go back to life in the '50’s. You don’t know anything about me. My liberal credentials go back before you were born and I’ve never changed what I believe in. It’s the so called progressives who turned into Wall St. shills and war mongers who abandoned the principles they claimed. He wasn’t my boy Dubya, he was yours and everyone else who sat on their hands while we attacked a country for no reason. I was on the streets protesting, just as I’ve done with every war we’ve been suckered into by the bipartisan coalition of profiteers since Vietnam. Where were you? Your so called ‘facts’ turned the country over to the GOP and Trump. Accept the blame and admit the mistakes so we have some chance of fixing this mess some day. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/23 "2017-01-12T07:12:23Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Damn that Roosevelt and his New Deal – historically described as “relief for the unemployed and poor, recovery of the economy to normal levels, and reform of the financial system to prevent a repeat depression”. The man should have been impeached – he was like America’s own Hitler! :rolleyes: When did he do those things? He was saved by the war. And he interred Japanese Americans. He certainly helped but his policies did not recover the economy to pre Depression levels ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/24 "2017-01-12T07:35:14Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > He certainly helped but his policies did not recover the economy to pre Depression levels I’ve heard this argument before. I question the premise. I think you can make a good counter-argument that the Crash indicated that the stock market had been overbuoyed by speculation and had risen to too high a level. Trying to push it back up to that artificially high level would have been creating the conditions for a second crash. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/25 "2017-01-12T07:46:47Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I’ve heard this argument before. I question the premise. I think you can make a good counter-argument that the Crash indicated that the stock market had been overbuoyed by speculation and had risen to too high a level. Trying to push it back up to that artificially high level would have been creating the conditions for a second crash. There was a fairly big crash in 1945-46 as war contracts were suddenly and unexpectedly cancelled en mass, and IIRC economic health was poor and unemployment was high throughout Truman’s first term. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/26 "2017-01-12T12:51:57Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > You don’t know anything about me. My liberal credentials go back before you were born and I’ve never changed what I believe in. It’s the so called progressives who turned into Wall St. shills and war mongers who abandoned the principles they claimed. He wasn’t my boy Dubya, he was yours and everyone else who sat on their hands while we attacked a country for no reason. I was on the streets protesting, just as I’ve done with every war we’ve been suckered into by the bipartisan coalition of profiteers since Vietnam. Where were you? > > Your so called ‘facts’ turned the country over to the GOP and Trump. Accept the blame and admit the mistakes so we have some chance of fixing this mess some day. Nitpick: I prefer you switch the words ‘liberal’ and ‘progressive’. if we all get on the same page as which one is the real left and which one is actually 'centrist tolerance of evil when it suits me."…well the sooner the better. I know that sounds like snark but it isnt. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/27 "2017-01-12T13:26:57Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Nitpick: I prefer you switch the words ‘liberal’ and ‘progressive’. if we all get on the same page as which one is the real left and which one is actually 'centrist tolerance of evil when it suits me."…well the sooner the better. I know that sounds like snark but it isnt. I understand what you mean. I don’t want to be associated with any of these labels. I’ve always believed in liberty and equality and I don’t need any political group to tell me what I should believe in. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/28 "2017-01-12T13:41:59Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > If he wrote that last year I’d give him some credit but it seems to me to be nothing but an exaggerated caricature of Trump designed for the weak minded left wing who will continue to whine about the election they lost instead of providing any solutions to the problems of society that caused this situation in the first place. > > And yes, in the future when we have lost all hope of progress they will write about how the supposed progressive leadership could never accept responsibility for their failures. > [@HeweyLogan](#): > > What the poster above said. What the poster above said. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/29 "2017-01-12T14:51:05Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > What the poster above said. > > Regards, > Shodan I repeat: > [@ThelmaLou](#): > > So let me understand: you’re wholly dismissing the content of these points and saying they have no validity today because Reich didn’t write them a year ago? 'Kay… ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/30 "2017-01-12T15:16:42Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > From [Robert Reich,](http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bal-robert-b-reich-the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny-20170110-story.html) a former U.S. Secretary of Labor, professor of public policy at the University of California at Berkeley > > Has DJT missed any? > > Take notes now, because in a decade or so, there will be theses, dissertations, and books to be written on this steady progression of events. I have edited the quote in the OP as it quoted the entire article. Please keep quotes of articles consistent with fair use standards. [/moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/31 "2017-01-12T15:33:43Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > So let me understand: you’re wholly dismissing the content of these points and saying they have no validity today because Reich didn’t write them a year ago? 'Kay… Pretty much, yes. If Reich wanted credibility, he could have said, a year ago, that “we will be able to tell that Trump wants to be dictator if he does X, Y, and Z.” Waiting for Trump to do X, Y, and Z and then saying “this shows Trump wants to be dictator” doesn’t really fly. Leaving aside the fact that it is utterly ridiculous to suggest that Trump is going to be dictator, and Reich is doing nothing more than making himself out as a hysterical ninny. This kind of thing doesn’t need a point-by-point refutation; it needs someone to slap him upside the head and say “get a fucking grip - it’s going to be hard enough to deal with a Trump Presidency without you wetting your drawers in panic and encouraging others to do the same”. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/32 "2017-01-12T15:46:26Z")
These things are like horoscopes, you can take any pile of facts and exaggerate them to fit some generic narrative. It’s BS when conservatives do it and it’s BS here. How would we react to a claim about Obama’s tyranny? After all, he tried to dismiss the media (calling Fox News biased and a political organization), he ruled by executive order, he fomented distrust of law enforcement, and he expanded the powers of secret courts. I know plenty of people who believe all of those things to be true, and would readily call Obama a tyrant. There’s plenty to hate about Trump without claiming that we’re on the verge of a dictatorship. I have more faith in the system than Robert Reich, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/33 "2017-01-12T15:55:32Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I repeat: > > > [@ThelmaLou](#): > > > > So let me understand: you’re wholly dismissing the content of these points and saying they have no validity today because Reich didn’t write them a year ago? 'Kay… If you were saying Reich is accurately describing the current situation, you’d have a valid point. But you specifically were saying we should admire his ability to predict the future: > [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Take notes now, because in a decade or so, there will be theses, dissertations, and books to be written on this steady progression of events. It doesn’t work that way. Reich doesn’t get credit for precognition because he can describe events that have already happened. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/34 "2017-01-12T16:23:13Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > It appears to be an adaptation of this piece, which is a heck of a lot older than a year. > > [ Fourteen Defining Characteristics Of Fascism](http://www.rense.com/general37/char.htm) And clearly he “adapted” it to more precisely describe Trump. Kind of weak. Anyway, I haven’t noticed that Trump has attempted to “eliminate or reduce the influence of competing centers of power, such as labor unions and opposition parties.”(#10) We have no evidence that he’s made “personal alliances with foreign dictators”(#14) AFAIK, the only family member he’s giving a job to is his son in law as an advisor, not exactly “high positions of authority and power”(#11). Saying Trump has “Blame[d] economic stresses on immigrants or racial or religious minorities”(#7) is kind of a stretch. His wall building talk is more law and order stuff. He’s mostly blamed free trade and China for economic woes. During the campaign, Trump had lots of press conferences(#5) so we’ll see but regardless, number of press conferences has got to be the lamest warning sign of tyranny I’ve ever heard. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/35 "2017-01-12T16:26:54Z")
I predict that the Chicago Cubs will be champions if they come back from a 3-1 series deficit and also take a 6-3 lead over the Indians in Game 7. ---
**Author:** ![somepumpkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7feea3/32.png) [@somepumpkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/somepumpkin)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/36 "2017-01-12T16:31:26Z")
What \*\*TriPolar \*\*and \*\*Shodan \*\*said is right. The author’s timing makes it all so, “meh, just another whiner”. > [@ThelmaLou](#): > > So let me understand: you’re wholly dismissing the content of these points and saying they have no validity today because Reich didn’t write them a year ago? 'Kay… Yes, I’m dismissing the points b/c they weren’t written a year ago. Hindsight is crystal clear. > [@E-DUB](#): > > It appears to be an adaptation of this piece, which is a heck of a lot older than a year. [ Fourteen Defining Characteristics Of Fascism](http://www.rense.com/general37/char.htm) Your fascism link was notable, but nowhere does it reference the first 2 salvos lobbed from Mr. Reich’s pen. Both of which seem custom-tailored from the patterns of Trump behavior. I’m not supporting Trump; I’m just poo-poo-ing the shock and awe of Reich’s dribble in that article. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/37 "2017-01-12T16:35:28Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > And clearly he “adapted” it to more precisely describe Trump. Kind of weak. > > **Anyway, I haven’t noticed that Trump has attempted to "eliminate or reduce the influence of competing centers of power, such as labor unions and opposition parties.**"(#10) We have no evidence that he’s made “personal alliances with foreign dictators”(#14) AFAIK, the only family member he’s giving a job to is his son in law as an advisor, not exactly “high positions of authority and power”(#11). Saying Trump has “Blame[d] economic stresses on immigrants or racial or religious minorities”(#7) is kind of a stretch. His wall building talk is more law and order stuff. He’s mostly blamed free trade and China for economic woes. During the campaign, Trump had lots of press conferences(#5) so we’ll see but regardless, number of press conferences has got to be the lamest warning sign of tyranny I’ve ever heard. Not yet. His Las Vegas hotel lost a case before the National Labor Relations Board for refusing to recognize a union the employees voted in. Guess who will be appointing new members to the NLRB? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/38 "2017-01-12T18:04:31Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > You don’t know anything about me. My liberal credentials go back before you were born and I’ve never changed what I believe in. It’s the so called progressives who turned into Wall St. shills and war mongers who abandoned the principles they claimed. He wasn’t my boy Dubya, he was yours and everyone else who sat on their hands while we attacked a country for no reason. I was on the streets protesting, just as I’ve done with every war we’ve been suckered into by the bipartisan coalition of profiteers since Vietnam. Where were you? > > Your so called ‘facts’ turned the country over to the GOP and Trump. Accept the blame and admit the mistakes so we have some chance of fixing this mess some day. Wait, wait…your _liberal_ credentials? Really? Would those be short- or long-form? Sorry, but your invocation to authority doesn’t work. I don’t care if you were out there protesting the Korean conflict, your _opinions_ have no more weight than anyone else on this board, and certainly not with me. I am not impressed. Protesting doesn’t make you the be-all, end-all of political thought. (And while we’re at it, show some evidence that my beliefs have ‘changed’ as you imply.) Accept what blame? My position has never changed WRT Trump. He disgusted me 30 years ago, and absolutely nothing about that has changed. I’ve been here warning people about the possibility of a Trump presidency from my first day here, and supporting Hillary. Even then, the only mistake I made was, like hundreds of millions of others, underestimating the gullibility of certain parts of the electorate. Nor have I ever approved of the Unholy Trinity of Rove, Cheney, and Bush, as might be inferred from my constantly negative references to them. Seriously, you’re laying the mortgage bubble at the feet of Clinton? How much regulation did the Bush administration put Wall Street under? (Speaking of sitting on hands…) Is the avowed noninterference-in-business party to bear any of the responsibility for what happened under their watch? According to you, apparently not. It was all those ‘weak-minded’ liberals. Give me a break. What, exactly, do you define as being ‘strong-minded?’ Gerrymandering? Passing voter ID laws? Attempting to enforce religious beliefs on others? The end justifying the means? ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/39 "2017-01-12T18:07:28Z")
1. Exaggerate their mandate. When the house republicans went to negotiate the stimulus package with Obama he told them “I won” 2. Claim voter fraud. Obama accused North Carolina legislatures of voter suppression for trying to require an ID to vote. 3. Calls opponents enemies. Obama said we gonna punish our enemies in an interview with Univision. 4. Turn the public against journalists. Obama has repeatedly criticized Fox News. 5. Hold few press conferences. Obama held 50 fewer press conferences than his predecessor. 6. Tell the people big lies. Obama promised if you like your health insurance you can keep it. 7. Blame racial or religious minorities. Obama blamed people clinging bitterly to guns and religion for not voting for him. 8. Attribute domestic violence to enemies within. Obama blamed black people being shot by cops on a set of racial disparities. 9. Threaten mass deportations. Obama bragged about having deported more immigrants than any other president. 10. Seek to eliminate other centers of power. Obama fought the Catholic church and sought to force nuns to buy contraception against their conscience. 11. Appoint family members to power. Obama let his wife run a program to change how the school system cafeterias work. 12. Surround themselves with personal security. Obama goes everywhere with a secret service bodyguard. 13. Appoint military offices to high civilian jobs. Obama appointed General Jim Jones as national security advisor, General Shinsheki to head the VA and Admiral Dennis Blair to director of national intelligence. 14. Make personal alliance with foreign dicatator. Obama told the prime minister of Russia to tell Putin he would be flexible after the election. 15. Profiteer from public office. Obama has made millions from book sales and is likely to make more once he leaves office and he has plans to move into a six million dollar mansion once he leaves office. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928/40 "2017-01-12T18:13:47Z")
Gotta love Reich. He just draws the target circles around a bullet hole and claims that he scored a bullseye. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-15-warnings-signs-of-tyranny/776928.md?page=3)