# The 2016 Republican candidates **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 9, 2015, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444 "2015-01-09T22:38:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 73
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2015, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1442 "2015-05-07T11:24:07Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > SALT, ABM treaty, INF treaty, START I and II. Even under GWB, there’s the agreement to get Qaddafi to turn over his weapons under Bush. Most of those were Cold War treaties – Republicans dominated the Presidency during the height of the Cold War. > [@](#): > > For Democrats we have the agreement with North Korea(they built nukes at our expense, great deal that was), Syria(still haven’t met their benchmarks for turning over their chem weapons), SALT II(fell apart when the Soviets invaded Afghanistan). Also, New START, various free trade agreements, and most of Syria’s chemical weapons actually have been destroyed. > [@](#): > > But if you can think of any examples of Democrats getting a good deal, you’re welcome to cite it. I’m sure there are some. My argument was simply that despite their warmongering reputation, cultivated by Democrats since Goldwater and about as accurate as Republicans calling Democrats socialists, is just a BIT overstated. Reagan was supposed to start WWIII and he did more to end the Cold War than anyone else. The Reagan ending-the-Cold-War thing is mostly a myth. Shitty systems collapse, and the Soviet Union would have collapsed with or without Reagan. He might have accelerated it by a few months or a few years, but that’s it. And you continue to argue as if “war-mongering” is the same as “strength”. It’s not. In our recent history, it’s made us weaker. We are weaker because of Iraq. Invading Iran would make us weaker. Ground war with ISIS would make us weaker. What you advocate would weaken America. > [@](#): > > That’s because Republicans negotiate from a position of strength. Meaningless bullshit. Faux-punditry. We’re in a much better “position of strength” internationally now than in the mid 2000s during the Iraq debacle. > [@](#): > > Democrats, especially this generation of Democrats, thought that a nuclear freeze was a good way to make the Soviets see our good intentions. The Soviets are long gone. The Cold War is over. Shitty systems collapse. America didn’t defeat the Soviet Union – they defeated themselves. > [@](#): > > Pure nonsense that you can’t even begin to prove. If we compare the crap that today’s Republicans spew re: foreign policy to Bush I and Reagan, it’s pretty clear to me. > [@](#): > > There is nothing pragmatic about negotiating from a position of weakness. Nothing realistic about it either, since last I checked we are still the most powerful nation on Earth by a wide margin. Who is advocating this? Who are you arguing with? Why pull out bullshit nonsense like this? No one advocates “negotiating from a position of weakness”. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2015, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1443 "2015-05-07T11:57:46Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > And you continue to argue as if “war-mongering” is the same as “strength”. It’s not. In our recent history, it’s made us weaker. We are weaker because of Iraq. Invading Iran would make us weaker. Ground war with ISIS would make us weaker. What you advocate would weaken America. Not even “war-mongering” - bullying. That’s what the right-wing consider strength. When I characterized John Bolton’s approach to diplomacy as “We’re America so fuck you”, that’s the position that the current GOP mistake for strength and that the rest of the world sees as just being a bunch of overblown assholes. They still haven’t learned that Bush’s “Axis of Evil” rhetoric weakened moderates in Iran and gave Ahmedinejad and his extremist faction a huge power boost, or that Bush’s public declarations of war against Al-Qaeda gave Osama bin Laden his most effective recruiting tool. Such talk plays well to the domestic audience but weakens the country’s effectiveness as an international geopolitical force. Conversely, Obama’s initial outreach to Muslims internationally hurt Al-Qaeda by explicitly positioning America as pro-Islam while still being anti-terror. Naturally, the Republicans have called this an “apology tour”. Because speaking softly, even while wielding a big stick, just doesn’t get the testosterone pumping. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2015, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1444 "2015-05-07T15:38:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **adaher** : > > For Democrats we have the agreement with North Korea(they built nukes at our expense, great deal that was) North Korea does not yet have any nuclear weapons. They have managed to cobble together a couple of pathetic nuclear bombs, but they have no means of delivering those bombs to anyone but themselves. They are no threat to us, and the one country they are a threat to, it’s because of their conventional artillery, not because of their nukes. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2015, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1445 "2015-05-07T19:12:24Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Along with Belgium, Upper Volta, Chad, and the Duchy of Grand Fenwick. I think the latter’s elite archers would deter even President Bolton. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2015, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1446 "2015-05-07T20:22:34Z")
Oh, [this is sweet](http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/one-of-jeb-bushs-top-advisers-on-israel-george-w-bush/2015/05/07/920fec8e-f4da-11e4-bcc4-e8141e5eb0c9_story.html): > [@](#): > > When asked this week at an exclusive Manhattan gathering about who advises him on U.S.-Israel policy, Jeb Bush surprised many of the 50-plus attendees by naming his brother, former president George W. Bush, as his most influential counselor. > > “If you want to know who I listen to for advice, it’s him,” Bush said Tuesday, speaking to a crowd of high-powered financiers at the Metropolitan Club, according to four people present. > \ > Participants said the reception at the club was mostly encouraging, but one attendee said he was “stunned” to hear Jeb Bush specifically mention George W. Bush as his go-to adviser. “I started looking around and wondering if people were recording it. It was jarring,” the attendee said. “If video of it got out, it’d be devastating.” > > Others saw it differently. > > “It was a very positive response, just based on faces around the room,” a second attendee said. “There didn’t seem to be any sort of negative reaction.” Oh please, let there be video. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2015, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1447 "2015-05-07T21:04:22Z")
Turns out Ben Carson didn’t have to be very smart [to become a neurosurgeon](http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/god-helped-ben-carson-ace-his-college-chemistry-final-giving-him-all-answers-dream#sthash.f1yoDDxe.dpuf): **God Helped Ben Carson Ace His College Chemistry Final By Giving Him All The Answers In A Dream** > [@](#): > > As Carson explained it, his goal of becoming a doctor was nearly derailed in his first semester at Yale University when he was failing his chemistry class to such an extent that he would not have been able to pass even if managed to get an A on the final exam. Fortunately for him, this particular professor had a policy that anyone who was failing the class could receive double credit on the final and so Carson asked God for a miracle before committing himself to study for the exam the night before. > > But instead of studying, Carson fell asleep and had a dream in which he was alone in an auditorium as some “nebulous figure” wrote out chemistry problems on the blackboard. > > “When I went to take the test the next morning, it was like ‘The Twilight Zone,’” Carson said. “I opened that book and I recognized the first problem as one of the ones I dreamed about. And the next, and the next, and the next, and I aced the exam and got a good mark in chemistry. It worked out okay and I promised the Lord he would never have to do that for me again.” ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2015, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1448 "2015-05-08T13:24:53Z")
[Rick Snyder says no presidential run for him.](http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2015/05/07/snyder-ends-presidential-speculation/70969662/) Looks like the field should be pretty much solid by say July 1. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2015, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1449 "2015-05-08T15:51:51Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > [Rick Snyder says no presidential run for him.](http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2015/05/07/snyder-ends-presidential-speculation/70969662/) Wonder if anyone outside his immediate family and a handful of political junkies will notice? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2015, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1450 "2015-05-08T16:03:12Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Turns out Ben Carson didn’t have to be very smart [to become a neurosurgeon](http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/god-helped-ben-carson-ace-his-college-chemistry-final-giving-him-all-answers-dream#sthash.f1yoDDxe.dpuf): > > **God Helped Ben Carson Ace His College Chemistry Final By Giving Him All The Answers In A Dream** I guess cheating must be OK when Jesus hands you the crib sheet. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2015, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1451 "2015-05-08T17:34:28Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Oh, [this is sweet](http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/one-of-jeb-bushs-top-advisers-on-israel-george-w-bush/2015/05/07/920fec8e-f4da-11e4-bcc4-e8141e5eb0c9_story.html): > > > [@](#): > > > > When asked this week at an exclusive Manhattan gathering about who advises him on U.S.-Israel policy, Jeb Bush surprised many of the 50-plus attendees by naming his brother, former president George W. Bush, as his most influential counselor. > > > > “If you want to know who I listen to for advice, it’s him,” Bush said Tuesday, speaking to a crowd of high-powered financiers at the Metropolitan Club, according to four people present. > > \ > > Participants said the reception at the club was mostly encouraging, but one attendee said he was “stunned” to hear Jeb Bush specifically mention George W. Bush as his go-to adviser. “I started looking around and wondering if people were recording it. It was jarring,” the attendee said. “If video of it got out, it’d be devastating.” > > > > Others saw it differently. > > > > “It was a very positive response, just based on faces around the room,” a second attendee said. “There didn’t seem to be any sort of negative reaction.” > > Oh please, let there be video. Even Republicans seem to accept the George W. Bush presidency was a failure. The only mistake Jeb made was mentioning his brother by name. He could repeat all of George’s policies and speeches verbatim and get the nomination easily, just don’t mention the name! ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2015, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1452 "2015-05-09T16:23:07Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > That’s a lot of ifs. No one wants a bad deal to be signed, including me. Though I sincerely doubt that Lindsay Graham, John Bolton, or even Bush and Paul are constitutionally capable of recognizing a good deal. I’ll be very impressed if a good deal is signed and _any_ significant Republican leader agrees that it’s a good deal. Speaking of [Lindsey Graham](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/05/08/sources-graham-to-announce-2016-white-house-bid-on-june-1/), it appears he will announce his candidacy for PotUS on June 1. Should make the last few months of Jon Stewart on _The Daily Show_ enjoyable. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2015, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1453 "2015-05-09T17:05:16Z")
from VICE: [Republicans Have Finally Turned on Chris Christie > [@](#): > > Eighteen months ago, New Jersey Governor Chris Christie made the jump from rising Republican star to a national figure. He had just won re-electionin deep-blue New Jersey by a landslide, beating Democratic state senator Barbara Buono by 22 points. He was already squaring off against libertarian-minded Republicans like Senator Rand Paul for the soul of theparty, and his win—juxtaposed with the defeat of right-wing Virginia gubernatorial candidate Ken Cuccinelli on the same night—staked his position as the earliest of frontrunners for the 2016 Republican nomination. > > Just a year and a half later, Christie’s chances of winning the presidency have evaporated. An April NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll of Republican presidential contenders showed Christie with just 5 percent support, behind most of the other potential candidates.And although Christie seems to spend moretime in New Hampshire than in New Jersey these days, a recent PPP survey of New Hampshire voters showed that Christie is by far the least popular Republican presidential contender there. ]([http://www.vice.com/read/republicans-have-finally-turned-on-chris-christie-508](http://www.vice.com/read/republicans-have-finally-turned-on-chris-christie-508)) ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2015, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1454 "2015-05-10T02:50:29Z")
When you’re a moderate, things have to be perfect for you to win. Given an excuse to not back a moderate, we’ll take it. Christie’s given us too many excuses. Lindsey Graham and John Bolton also occupy some moderate space, with Graham being a McCain conservative and John Bolton being more of a Joe Lieberman Democrat than an actual Republican. But many will like his harsh rhetoric, which causes many people to think you’re more conservative than you are. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2015, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1455 "2015-05-10T03:02:30Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Lindsey Graham and John Bolton also occupy some moderate space, with Graham being a McCain conservative and John Bolton being more of a Joe Lieberman Democrat than an actual Republican. But many will like his harsh rhetoric, which causes many people to think you’re more conservative than you are. In one paragraph, you demonstrate everything that is wrong about the modern GOP. As I’ve posted before, just because half the party wants to criminalize miscarriages doesn’t mean the ones who only want to ban abortion with no exceptions are moderates. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2015, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1456 "2015-05-10T03:05:51Z")
So a pro-life Democrat is just a hard right conservative? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2015, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1457 "2015-05-10T04:10:40Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > When you’re a moderate, things have to be perfect for you to win. Given an excuse to not back a moderate, we’ll take it. Christie’s given us too many excuses. Yeah, you’d love to nominate a moderate conservative, but gosh darn it, something always comes up. Now pull the other one. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2015, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1458 "2015-05-10T04:55:20Z")
Fucking love for them to nominate a moderate, maybe means they’re back taking their meds. Maybe stop having those Mad Max nightmares where Ted Cruz is The Humongous. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2015, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1459 "2015-05-10T06:14:04Z")
Actually, they have been nominating moderates, for the presidency, anyway. They just don’t seem to want to. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2015, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1460 "2015-05-10T06:17:35Z")
Sort of. McCain wasn’t a moderate so much as a heterodox with a bipartisan reputation. Romney was a moderate who ran as a conservative. But it’s true that we don’t nominate hardcore conservatives, and the only time we did was Reagan and before him, Goldwater. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2015, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444/1461 "2015-05-10T06:27:33Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Sort of. McCain wasn’t a moderate so much as a heterodox with a bipartisan reputation. Romney was a moderate who ran as a conservative. But it’s true that we don’t nominate hardcore conservatives, and the only time we did was Reagan and before him, Goldwater. Neither of which would be able to earn a Republican nomination in the last decade, for president or dog catcher. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444.md?page=72) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2016-republican-candidates/709444.md?page=74)