# The 2025 Israel vs Iran and geopolitical implications thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [June 19, 2025, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829 "2025-06-19T01:21:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2025, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/103 "2025-06-20T22:17:37Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > I couldn’t find the sources this Youtuber was referring to so take it with a grain of salt: I stopped the video as soon as he said “according to Seymour Hersh…” ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2025, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/104 "2025-06-20T23:21:42Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > I stopped the video as soon as he said “according to Seymour Hersh…”. Correction: he said, “the _LEGENDARY JOURNALIST_ Seymour Hersh”. Kyle Kulinski has had an appropriate level of pushback and vitriol towards certain things that the Trump Admin was doing. That’s just about the only nice thing I can say about him. And of all of his flaws, his shitty foreign policy takes are the worst. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2025, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/105 "2025-06-20T23:25:25Z")
Well for what it’s worth, I’d be happy if he’s wrong. Trump deciding this is an ideal time to pop off a nuke would be a nightmare. Absolutely no good could come of it. By all means, destroy Fordow. Just don’t use a nuke to do it. ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2025, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/106 "2025-06-21T00:35:14Z")
Yes, the Marshall Plan was as much about securing the US’s position as the pre-eminent economic and political power as it was about “restoring” Europe. The US is unable to do that today for a host of reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2025, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/107 "2025-06-21T02:10:56Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > But that’s the weird part. The expensive and difficult part is the military part, destroying the old regime. But we (by which I mean “the elected officials we elected”) were just fine with doing that in Iraq and Afghanistan: We did go in and completely militarily defeat the enemy. And then, we said that of course we weren’t going to do the rebuilding part, because that would be reprehensible. That is the Republican mindset in a nutshell, and it makes sense on a simplistic (i.e. incorrect) level. It is easy to understand that if someone is doing bad things, that you might need to punish them, and that it is worthwhile to spend the effort and resources to do it. But when it comes to helping people who have been doing bad things, the question gets raised, why are we helping these bad people, when we could spend the money helping ourselves who are much more worthy? So you end up spending billions more on defense to bomb civilians unstable rogue regimes while cutting USAID which for a fraction of the cost could prevent those regimes from being unstable in the first place. See also spending on law enforcement vs fighting poverty. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2025, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/108 "2025-06-21T02:20:44Z")
> [@Kropotkin](#): > > Yes, the Marshall Plan was as much about securing the US’s position as the pre-eminent economic and political power as it was about “restoring” Europe. The US is unable to do that today for a host of reasons. Minor (very) disagreement, I could see the _current_ administration figure they could gain economic and political power by stepping in and taking over Iran (something nearly unthinkable in prior years) and running it as a protectorate petro state. Because, well, someone could convince Trump that he’d make money off the deal, like some of his “plans” for the Gaza Strip. Yes, it would be even more selfish and self-serving than the worst elements of the Marshall Plan, and would be naked neo-colonialism, but it’s well within Trump’s personality type. And it could be _combined_ (to double down on the evil) with Chronos/Buck\_Godot’s point about claiming to manage the oil to repay America’s costs in bringing “peace”, and meanwhile letting everything else rot into violence and reprisals. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2025, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/109 "2025-06-21T05:43:53Z")
I don’t think this is related but wow with the timing: > **[Unusually powerful M5.1 Earthquake hit near Semnan in Iran on Friday Evening.](https://earthquakelist.org/news/2025/06/20/m5-1-earthquake-iran-1121812/)** > > Read all details on the unusually powerful MAG-5.1 earthquake that hit under land 37 kilometer from Semnan in Iran in the evening of Friday June 20th, 2025. ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2025, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/110 "2025-06-21T12:15:32Z")
I don’t disagree, but this would be very different from the nature and aims of the Marshall Plan. It wouldn’t be “nation-building so they can buy our stuff and be a bulwark against the USSR as we expand our economic system around the world,” but a naked grab, as you note. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2025, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/111 "2025-06-22T00:29:07Z")
Well, it seems the US is involved now although it is still vaguely possible Trump is just talking out of his ass: [https://news.yahoo.com/diplomatic-breakthrough-elusive-israel-iran-041120123.html](https://news.yahoo.com/diplomatic-breakthrough-elusive-israel-iran-041120123.html) ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2025, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/112 "2025-06-22T01:06:10Z")
Well, at least Trump fired all of the generals and admirals and Intelligence officials who knew anything about defending the United States. That’s something, right? ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2025, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/113 "2025-06-22T16:41:46Z")
As much as I detest most military action, a part of me feels bad that the bombing of Iran is likely the one action Trump has taken that I hate the least. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2025, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/114 "2025-06-22T16:45:05Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > a part of me feels bad that the bombing of Iran is likely the one action Trump has taken that I hate the least. Rare Trump W ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2025, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/115 "2025-06-22T23:23:10Z")
I’m not sure I’d qualify it as a W. Just not an obvious L as just about every other step he has taken. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2025, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/116 "2025-06-22T23:26:58Z")
There’s no way to know right now. We may not even have destroyed the facility. We may have done nothing significant more than tying ourselves to a new ongoing war. And one we have no idea of the medium and long term ramifications. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2025, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/117 "2025-06-23T00:57:10Z")
For those cheering on these attacks, what if they failed? What if Iran already moved everything important, and now knows the only guarantee to avoid further attacks is to get those nukes? If that’s the case, are you in favor of boots on the ground invasion to change their leadership? Or dropping nukes on Iran? Because if this attack failed, probably no conventional air attack could be successful. If these attacks failed, all they might have accomplished is to supercharge Iran’s race to get nukes. ---
**Author:** ![Zoobi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/13edae/32.png) [@Zoobi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoobi)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2025, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/118 "2025-06-23T01:11:13Z")
Of course it’s a Trump W from a domestic politics POV. He’s won a ton of MAGA converts with this, all of the enlightened centrists who wage a never ending war on “woke”, they’ve just been waiting for the excuse to jump on the MAGA train. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2025, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/119 "2025-06-23T01:15:13Z")
It’s from Buzzfeed via Yahoo News but not all the MAGA reaction has been positive: [https://www.yahoo.com/news/fully-regret-voting-donald-trump-151839672.html](https://www.yahoo.com/news/fully-regret-voting-donald-trump-151839672.html) ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2025, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/120 "2025-06-23T01:16:23Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > It’s from Buzzfeed via Yahoo News but not all the MAGA reaction has been positive: He’s definitely losing the Groyper vote over this. ---
**Author:** ![Zoobi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/13edae/32.png) [@Zoobi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoobi)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2025, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/121 "2025-06-23T01:16:48Z")
Lol, come on. They will all fall in line. Every one. And now there’s a large new group that’s been begging for a reason to come in. ---
**Author:** ![Zoobi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/13edae/32.png) [@Zoobi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoobi)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2025, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829/122 "2025-06-23T01:18:42Z")
No he isn’t. The groyper vote will remain 95%+ Republican/MAGA. They’re bitching now but they’ll remain deep deep red. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-2025-israel-vs-iran-and-geopolitical-implications-thread/1019829.md?page=7)