# The amazing "Dogma"

**URL:** <https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-dogma/153007>\
**Category:** Cafe Society\
**Created:** [February 5, 2003, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-dogma/153007 "2003-02-05T18:23:09Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 3\
**Page:** 3

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**Author:** ![Casey1505](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@Casey1505](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casey1505)\
**Post date:** [February 6, 2003, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-dogma/153007/41 "2003-02-06T23:22:37Z")

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> [@](#):
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> \*Originally posted by PatrickM \*  
> \*\*He set out at the beginning that the fallen angels were condemned to Wisconsin for all time, but then without adequate explanation he let said fallen angels travel to New Jersey. \*\*

Adequate explanation?? The next hour and a half or so provided the explanation. It was specifically referenced at least 3 or 4 times throughout, I believe. The banned angels wanted to get back into heaven. The only way to do that is to have a pure soul. A church in New Jersey is offering said pure soul thusly:

> [@](#):
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> With a papal sanction, the archway entrance to the century old, Jersey shore house of worship will serve as a passageway of plenary indulgence, which - according to Catholic beliefs - offers all who pass through it’s arches a morally clean slate."

Re-entering heaven after they had been banned would go against the notion that “God is infallible”, and as a result, existance would cease. So they needed to be prevented from entering the archway, and there is the rest of the movie. Very basic, yes, but that’s why they went to New Jersey

[Here is a link to the script.](http://victorian.fortunecity.com/manet/360/movies/scripts/ks-dogma.html) (the script is better)

If you missed this scene at the beginning of the movie, you missed alot.

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**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\
**Post date:** [February 6, 2003, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-dogma/153007/42 "2003-02-06T23:48:14Z")

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> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Barbarian \*  
> \*\*I’ve never had the pleasure of meeting a nun. But every Catholic I’ve ever met has been certifiably kooky and worthy of being locked up in an insane asylum right away because their relationship to reality was non-existent.
> 
> Their mental attitude (and ability) was akin to mere splinters floating downsteam in the great river of life. \*\*

There are a billion Catholics in the world. Try to get out and meet a few more.

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**Author:** ![LifeOnWry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/96bed5/32.png) [@LifeOnWry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LifeOnWry)\
**Post date:** [February 7, 2003, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-dogma/153007/43 "2003-02-07T01:58:13Z")

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> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Casey1505 \*  
> **Adequate explanation?? The next hour and a half or so provided the explanation. It was specifically referenced at least 3 or 4 times throughout, I believe. The banned angels wanted to get back into heaven. The only way to do that is to have a pure soul. \<SNIP\>**

Actually, you’re incorrect here. The rest of the movie explains why they’re not in heaven, it does NOT explain why they never left Wisconsin and then why, now, they are traveling to New Jersey if they were confined to Wisconsin.

Today, however, I re-watched the extra footage on the DVD, and found a deleted scene that does explain this! On the bus, Bartleby asks Loki “Why didn’t we ever have the balls to leave Wisconsin before?”

Loki: “We were afraid He’d send us somewhere even worse.” Bartleby: “Oh, yeah. Where was it we were afraid he would send us, again?”  
Loki: “New Jersey.”

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