# The Amazing Race 10/23/11: "I Feel Like I'm In The Circus" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 23, 2011, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585 "2011-10-23T23:17:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/41 "2011-10-24T12:48:23Z")
> [@StGermain](#): > > I guess I’m the first to say it - I thought feeding fish was a lame task. It made m wonder if the producers had planned something a little more awesome that fell through, so they had to pick something else. > > StG I’ve heard vague whispers that that’s exactly what happened. No details, though I’ve been Googling for the last half-hour to see if I could find any. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/42 "2011-10-24T13:05:16Z")
I wonder also if there was a detour that got edited out. Maybe not, since they obviously planned two roadblocks, but it’s unusual not to have one. Also somehow I missed it; where did they get the clue and the food to feed the fish? As far as I remember the clue from the elphant task told them to go to Bangkok but didn’t say anything about feeding fish when you got there - how did they know where to go? Unless I spaced out for a minute. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/43 "2011-10-24T13:12:36Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > _ **Liz and Marie** _\* (Team 8 of 8)\* - …it must be said that their enjoyment of their extra elephant task was one of the highlights of the leg. Hell, yes! I’ve never seen anyone enjoy shoveling manure until this episode. And their squeals of delight on washing the elephant were positively orgasmic. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/44 "2011-10-24T13:21:49Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > I wonder also if there was a detour that got edited out. Maybe not, since they obviously planned two roadblocks, but it’s unusual not to have one. Also somehow I missed it; where did they get the clue and the food to feed the fish? As far as I remember the clue from the elphant task told them to go to Bangkok but didn’t say anything about feeding fish when you got there - how did they know where to go? Unless I spaced out for a minute. There was a kid holding a tray full of clues and fish food, behind the pagoda where they rebuilt the little shrine. The clue said to go a particular place and feed the fish. It seems that would have been the place to put the Detour, but maybe there wasn’t one this leg. Given the rule about partners needing to complete the same number of Roadblocks, some future leg may have two Detours and no Roadblock. As I recall, the rule is that partners are supposed to stay with each other at all times except during Roadblocks. Usually the partner doing the Roadblock does some awesome thing like bungee jumping or paragliding which necessitates their separation. In this case, the task was not so awesome, but they could still separate from their partner anyway. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/45 "2011-10-24T13:24:52Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > I wonder also if there was a detour that got edited out. Maybe not, since they obviously planned two roadblocks, but it’s unusual not to have one. Also somehow I missed it; where did they get the clue and the food to feed the fish? As far as I remember the clue from the elphant task told them to go to Bangkok but didn’t say anything about feeding fish when you got there - how did they know where to go? Unless I spaced out for a minute. They picked up the clue and the bag of fish food after they completed the Spirit House Roadblock, off of the tray that the child monk was holding. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/46 "2011-10-24T13:25:46Z")
Aha, thanks, I did miss that. ---
**Author:** ![randwill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a3d4f5/32.png) [@randwill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/randwill)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/47 "2011-10-24T13:48:18Z")
I still say producer shenanigans. Why else would a bus driver stop his bus and sit there and wait for two passengers to be brought to his bus? ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/48 "2011-10-24T13:48:20Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > Oh man. Team Dude are fucking churchies?? Getting all self-righteous while at the temple? > [@jayjay](#): > > Yeah, Team Dude lost a lot of points from me tonight. And you know they didn’t JUST start this on this leg…their kind of churchy self-righteousness doesn’t come and go like that. So the editors have been giving them a sweetheart edit (because there’s no way they don’t know how people feel about that…remember the f’ing Weavers?), probably because the snowboarders haven’t had any reason to pull that stuff out during a task until now. I dunno; that assessment of the snowboarders seems unduly harsh. They haven’t, as far as I remember, called upon the Lord to help them win the Race, which was the really grating part of the Weaver’s brand of Christianity. And I don’t think the little speech at the temple was meant self-righteously (although it was admittedly a bit garbled). I think the intention was more along the line of, “we’re secure enough in our Christian faith that we don’t feel threatened by displays of other religions. We respect other people’s religious choices, but we’re certainly not going to convert any time soon.” Also, it’s pretty obvious that the boys were answering questions about their Christianity, rather than spontaneously bringing God into the Race. That’s an important distinction: I see no problem with a faith that’s strong, but quiet and respectful (there have been at least a couple ministers on past Races that I think fit that description). ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/49 "2011-10-24T13:56:14Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Yeah, Team Dude lost a lot of points from me tonight. And you know they didn’t JUST start this on this leg…their kind of churchy self-righteousness doesn’t come and go like that. So the editors have been giving them a sweetheart edit (because there’s no way they don’t know how people feel about that…remember the f’ing Weavers?), probably because the snowboarders haven’t had any reason to pull that stuff out during a task until now. > [@Fenris](#): > > I agree with JayJay about the sweetheart edit the snowboarders have been getting: that crap doesn’t come from nowhere. Every freakin’ other word out of their mouths was “Gawd’s will”, etc. And the “Huh. I didn’t feel any freaky vibrations from the shrine. I kinda thought I would” crack is right up there with Blake and Paige praying for the “heathens” (in their own shrine) in…China? Korea? or whichever team was worried about “voodoo spirits” from the Hawaiian priestess or the Weavers who were scared to go into Utah because Mormons live there. Total douchebaggery. I’m betting the producers asked them leading questions about what they thought about the Buddhist temples, how it affected their own faith, etc. If you listen to the second guy especially, and his “I don’t get any vibes” quote, it sounds like he was answering a direct question, not just volunteering info out of thin air. Some seasons back there was a guy in the race who had just returned from a tour in Iraq. He spent the entire race comparing where he currently was to Iraq. He got a lot of crap for it, until he revealed in an interview that the producers asked him “How does this place compare to Iraq” every single day. > [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > Which makes me wonder, what do people think they mean when they blame things on “producer shenanigans”? It’s just the team & two crew members. Just how are the producers supposed to get involved at that very moment right in the nick of time in order to stop a bus or make some cabbie take a team for free? Cash? I wouldn’t put it past the producers to spread some money around to stop a bus for 10 minutes or get a pissed off cabbie to let people proceed. > [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Considering the strict game show laws that expressly forbid those kinds of producer shenanigans, you really have to wonder why people constantly think it’s going on. Why would CBS threaten one of their cash cows to maybe, possibly, push along a team that was already pretty well doomed. Why do you think it’s a cash cow? It gets steady but not spectacular ratings (came in 3rd of the 4 big networks last week), and has to be pretty expensive to produce. ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/50 "2011-10-24T14:41:18Z")
When it comes to calls of shenanigans that involve claims of the producers altering the game mid-stream to change the outcomes (changing a speed bump to something extremely easy, calling a non-elimination leg to avoid dumping a potentially likable team, somehow getting a plane to return to a gate) what would be the legal implications? Is not The Amazing Race controlled by the laws around game shows? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/51 "2011-10-24T14:57:30Z")
> [@obfusciatrist](#): > > Is not The Amazing Race controlled by the laws around game shows? There’s some ambiguity in there. Some people think it falls under game show laws and some people think it falls under reality show laws (which aren’t strictly the same). Same with Survivor and Big Brother…although Big Brother hasn’t been able to hide producer manipulation as well as the shows that are time-shifted (run all the way through and THEN edited into a narrative and broadcast). Big Brother is broadcast concurrently with the actual running of the game, plus viewers can subscribe to a live feed of the cameras in the house, so that you can watch close to 24/7 of the currently live season (“close to” because they do cut the feeds for various reasons…copyright concerns (if houseguests start singing), privacy concerns (if people in the hg’s lives are mentioned who didn’t sign releases), competitions (they always cut for comps) and live show). It’s a lot harder to catch producer manipulation when you can actually see (or read about) the actual relationships and personalities in the house instead of relying solely on the story the producers tell in the broadcast show. ---
**Author:** ![Sally\_Mander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e56c9b/32.png) [@Sally\_Mander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sally_Mander)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/52 "2011-10-24T15:08:10Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > I’m betting the producers asked them leading questions about what they thought about the Buddhist temples, how it affected their own faith, etc. If you listen to the second guy especially, and his “I don’t get any vibes” quote, it sounds like he was answering a direct question, not just volunteering info out of thin air. Most of the time, I take what they say with a grain of salt. I always assume when people are making comments that come off as preachy or snide, that the producer (or whoever) is asking leading questions. I bet someone noticed they had something written on their straps, and asked what it meant and why they did it. ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/53 "2011-10-24T15:16:26Z")
Perhaps, but having once applied for the Amazing Race I can tell you the application asks you all kinds of personal questions so odds are the producers knew they were very religious before they were interviewed the first time. Plus, they were already at least somewhat public figures as professional athletes and Andy, at least, has apparently never been shy about his beliefs at all, having appears in a [Christian snowboarding movie](http://www.sierrasun.com/article/20081218/SPORTS/812189979). Interesting biographical note from that article (that I suspect won’t come up in the show, or at least not with details) is that in 2007 Andy’s father engaged in a shootout with police and was shot three times in the head, and survived. ---
**Author:** ![Death\_of\_Rats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a6a055/32.png) [@Death\_of\_Rats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Death_of_Rats)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/54 "2011-10-24T15:20:53Z")
IS it a game show or is it a ‘reality’ show based around a competition? That distinction could affect how the laws apply. As for producer involvement, considering the shear logistics involved behind the scenes on a show like this is would almost be mandatory for the production team to keep the teams as close as possible. You can’t let the teams get too spread out or you would have to bunch the front runners for hours or days while you waited for every team to make it to the mat. The logistics involved in getting Phil where he needs to be, alone, would necessitate this. Not to mention that you would have an advance team, an production team and a clean up team who would all be on tight schedules as most of the locations where the events happen are in public areas that they would not have unlimited access to. ---
**Author:** ![Moonlitherial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4bbf92/32.png) [@Moonlitherial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moonlitherial)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/55 "2011-10-24T15:31:14Z")
The twins went way up in my estimation in this leg due to both their enjoyment of the roadblock task and their refusal to beg for money when they were out of the running. For some reason asking a taxi driver for free ride didn’t strike the same “ugly tourist” vibe that begging does. Glad they got to go out on a high point. Cindy and Ernie were pretty nasty during that interaction with their cab driver though. Not cool. I have to agree with those who think the snowboarders were just responding to questions. They seem pretty respectful and focused overall, I wish there was a way to find out what questions they’re responding to in these clips - it would make it a lot easier to see who they are rather than who the producers want us to see. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/56 "2011-10-24T16:01:52Z")
I’m seeing a lot of criticism of Bill on other boards for doing the “Forward Hooo!” thing in the taxi, because they feel like it was some sort of mockery of a Native American chant or something. Is the idea of the old frontiersmen getting their wagon train moving with a cry of “Forward Ho!” something that’s so incredibly obscure already? I mean, I’m too young for Westerns (I’m 40…the only real Western that was still on when I was a kid was Gunsmoke), but I recognize that. ---
**Author:** ![Meltdown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Meltdown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meltdown)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/57 "2011-10-24T16:03:13Z")
Did anyone wonder why at the temple, when the players couldn’t figure out how to rebuild their models, they didn’t just go look at the other team’s entries, rather than go all the way back to the original location? I’m guessing it was against the rules to do this, because surely it would have occurred to someone. Or else the other team’s models were immediately disassembled after they won, which we didn’t see. I’m pretty sure in similar tasks in the past, where something had to be constructed to certain specifications, there was a fair amount of spying on other teams to see what they were doing. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/58 "2011-10-24T16:15:12Z")
I forgot to mention that I loved the speed bump this leg. It felt well thought out and organic to the culture and that particular leg of the race. Way better than sitting on a block of ice for 5 minutes, sitting on a sauna bus for 5 minutes, or assembling a weird wicker thing in a WWI trench. Plus, the twins were just so darned cute doing it. As for the god botherers, their self righteous claims of how much better their god is than the temple they were at were offputting no matter how leading the producer questions were. Previously my favorites, I now hate them. > [@obfusciatrist](#): > > When it comes to calls of shenanigans […] what would be the legal implications? > > Is not The Amazing Race controlled by the laws around game shows? None, and nope. If you send an email to the FCC they’ll probably confirm this for you personally. A quick google turns up [this](http://public.getlegal.com/articles/survivor-reality-show): > [@](#): > > Furthermore, in a development that raised eyebrows among some viewers, the FCC apparently responded to some complaints in the summer of 2007 claiming that producers were overlooking “cheating” on Big Brother 8 by stating that it appeared not to be a “game show” but a “for entertainment only” show, in which outcomes are at least partially predetermined. There are reports that the FCC has said something similar about American Idol. I can dig up a transcript of that FCC email if you like. It’s posted on hamstertime every Big Brother season. Also in the linked cite: _Whether those laws, found in the U.S. Code under the heading, “Prohibited practices in contests of knowledge, skill, or chance,” even apply to Survivor at all is a question that’s never been answered. They refer repeatedly to a “contest of intellectual knowledge” (which Survivor certainly is not) or a “contest of chance” (which Survivor certainly is not) or a “contest of intellectual skill.”_ TAR is not a contest of intellectual knowledge, contest of chance, or a contest of intellectual skill. Those are the only contests for which there are laws. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/59 "2011-10-24T17:03:29Z")
> [@zut](#): > > I dunno; that assessment of the snowboarders seems unduly harsh. They haven’t, as far as I remember, called upon the Lord to help them win the Race, which was the really grating part of the Weaver’s brand of Christianity. And I don’t think the little speech at the temple was meant self-righteously (although it was admittedly a bit garbled). I think the intention was more along the line of, “we’re secure enough in our Christian faith that we don’t feel threatened by displays of other religions. We respect other people’s religious choices, but we’re certainly not going to convert any time soon.” > . Well there was the “WE know who the one true god is” remark. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2011, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585/60 "2011-10-24T17:13:44Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > Why do you think it’s a cash cow? It gets steady but not spectacular ratings (came in 3rd of the 4 big networks last week), and has to be pretty expensive to produce. It’s a reality show, while the international logistics might be complicated at times, I can’t imagine it’s even half as expensive as the two shows that follow it (The Good Wife, CSI Miami). > [@zut](#): > > I think the intention was more along the line of, “we’re secure enough in our Christian faith that we don’t feel threatened by displays of other religions. We respect other people’s religious choices, but we’re certainly not going to convert any time soon.” I get that, but I’m of the opinion that someone truly secure in their Christian faith wouldn’t say anything about the weird vibes they get from another faith’s holy place. For example, see the sister of the Siblings. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-10-23-11-i-feel-like-im-in-the-circus/600585.md?page=2)