# The Amazing Race, November 18 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 19, 2012, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470 "2012-11-19T03:41:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/21 "2012-11-19T17:08:00Z")
That bugged me too. According to precedent, teams without passports are not allowed to check in. See Dallas and Toni (?), Zev and Justin who were sent away from the mat and then, after all other teams had checked in, were told that they were eliminated. This being an NEL threw a wrench into it (I hope it lays to rest the consipiracy theory that NEL’s are not determined in advance). Based on precedent, I would have expected the following to happen: - the goat farmers check in after failing to perform the detour - the goat farmers wait out their 4-hour penalty BEFORE checking in - once the goat farmers check in, James and Abba are told they are the last team; however, this is an NEL. What actually happened was that the penalty was assessed at the beginning of the next leg instead. I guess at that point it doesn’t matter, if you follow the rule that the team without a passport cannot check in until all the other teams have. I see the reason for it, too. If you let a team check in without a passport, and therefore eliminate a team behind them, and then the first task of the next leg is to fly to another country, you’ve basically eliminated that team right at the start of the next leg and taken all of the drama out of the episode. ---
**Author:** ![McDeath\_the\_Mad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a3d4f5/32.png) [@McDeath\_the\_Mad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/McDeath_the_Mad)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/22 "2012-11-19T17:24:09Z")
If penalties are assessed the next day, whats to stop a team from skipping a task to guarantee a first place finish for that leg? First of all they win first place and get some kind of a prize. Then they roll the dice for a next day start. If they skip a task they save X minutes by not doing said task. They will probably finish first. The last team will arrive Y minutes after the first team. As long as X+Y is ~ 4 hours (the penalty for not doing a task) that’s not a bad strategy and possibly worth the risk. It’s not the best gamesmanship, but hey this is for $1,000,000. Kind of reminds me of a Boston Rob strategy. MtM ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Doom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Dr\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Doom)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/23 "2012-11-19T17:29:05Z")
I also noted to **Mrs\_Doom** that the start times of each team were not shown on-screen. Seemed a little odd, to me, and I was particularly interested in seeing how far behind the Twinnies Abby and Ryan were, and how far behind the Goat farmers the Rockers were. So it’s not like I wasn’t paying attention; _they didn’t show the times_. Oddities abound. ---
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/24 "2012-11-19T17:56:06Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > They really are. > > And Ryan is really kind of awful. He pales in comparison to some of his competitors (thieves), still kind of awful. > > Second, why do only the farmers know how time zones work? Or what UTC means? Or at the very simplest, a city in the same general longitude as Moscow is going to be about the same time? That task did not speak well for the American educational system. It was mentioned briefly that the ‘goat farmer’ was actually an M.D. before he went into goat farming. So I’m not surprised that he was smart enough to figure it out quickly. But my question is about the rockers. Did they do the road block, detour and other challenges? Why was there a priest in the car with them? ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/25 "2012-11-19T17:58:28Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > That bugged me too. According to precedent, teams without passports are not allowed to check in. See Dallas and Toni (?), Zev and Justin who were sent away from the mat and then, after all other teams had checked in, were told that they were eliminated. > > This being an NEL threw a wrench into it (I hope it lays to rest the consipiracy theory that NEL’s are not determined in advance). Based on precedent, I would have expected the following to happen: > > - the goat farmers check in after failing to perform the detour > - the goat farmers wait out their 4-hour penalty BEFORE checking in > - once the goat farmers check in, James and Abba are told they are the last team; however, this is an NEL. > > What actually happened was that the penalty was assessed at the beginning of the next leg instead. I guess at that point it doesn’t matter, if you follow the rule that the team without a passport cannot check in until all the other teams have. > > I see the reason for it, too. If you let a team check in without a passport, and therefore eliminate a team behind them, and then the first task of the next leg is to fly to another country, you’ve basically eliminated that team right at the start of the next leg and taken all of the drama out of the episode. I was confused by all of this as well. I can’t imagine what would have happened if the Rockers had found their passports within 4 hours of the Goat Farmers checking in. I guess what I mean is, when was it decided that the 4 hour penalty would be the next day? Lots of inconsistencies and I hope we get a more detailed story once the season is finished. That said, when Phil was telling James and Abba that it was an NEL, they looked exhausted to the point of not being able to comprehend a word he was saying. I can imagine there was a bit of relief in getting eliminated at last. When Ja(y?)mes—whichever one has the injured ankle—was sweating so profusely at the dancing challenge, it was kind of fraeking me out. No one else seemed to be sweating, so I assumed it was from being in pain, and the idea that someone was in that much pain gives me the heebie jeebies. ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/26 "2012-11-19T17:58:49Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > Why was there a priest in the car with them? Speed Bump task, I’m pretty sure. ETA: Which makes me a little sad, because it looks like it might have been an interesting task, but we got treated to fruitless wandering instead. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/27 "2012-11-19T18:20:12Z")
> [@zut](#): > > Speed Bump task, I’m pretty sure. > > ETA: Which makes me a little sad, because it looks like it might have been an interesting task, but we got treated to fruitless wandering instead. I know! That really piqued my interest: what kind of task involves riding in a taxi with a priest? We’ll never know, alas. I got the time zone thing immediately, but I frequently use software that requires time zone selection, which is expressed as UTC+ (and also by name). Loved the Russian soldier’s dance. I always thought that looked physically nigh-impossible, but everyone seemed to pick it up fairly quickly. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/28 "2012-11-19T19:29:15Z")
These past two episodes have been a clusterfuck of rules manipulation by the producers. Not a fan. Trey and Lexi have become my favorite team. Abby is great, but Ryan is kind of a douche. The chipmunks are very hard not to like. Hate the incompetence of the goat farmers, and this one leg of credibility doesn’t wash away a whole season of ineptitude. And I loathe the TWINNIES!!! That makes my ideal top three Trey and Lexi, James and Jaymes, and Abby and Ryan, finishing in that order. ---
**Author:** ![magnusblitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@magnusblitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magnusblitz)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/29 "2012-11-19T20:22:36Z")
I think the producers really had no idea what to do with the “no passport on a NEL” scenario and bungled it horribly. The goat farmers got to check in ahead and take their 4 hour penalty the next morning instead (maybe the cameramen and Phil just wanted to go to bed?) So the rockers are allowed to check in, but check in last (huh?) They make it sound like the rockers contacted the consulate, but then spend the next day trying to find a police station and talk to people - why weren’t they doing any of this from their room or before they were allowed to do the race aspect? Why couldn’t they check in again since they were still in Russia? Very weird. I greatly enjoyed seeing Ryan suffer at the task, especially after he was going on about how smart he was with his UC Davis education. Yet it took him 25 tries when the little blonde from Texas figured it out after 11 and the goat farmer only took 1… he just really seems like the sort of person who can’t handle cognitive dissonance at all. “What do you mean wrong, this can’t be MY fault!” Maybe not as douchey as Major Dave, but I definitely get the same feel from him and Abby. Too bad we didn’t get to see the Twinnies suffer on it either. Can’t stand them. Somewhat surprised my favorite team at this point is the Chipmunks, but there ya go. ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/30 "2012-11-19T20:36:53Z")
> [@magnusblitz](#): > > I think the producers really had no idea what to do with the “no passport on a NEL” scenario and bungled it horribly. That’s what it seemed like to me too; but that’s really odd since this is like the third or fourth time a team has lost a passport, so it’s not like the “no passport on a NEL” scenario is a mind-blowingly unforeseeable turn of events. > [@magnusblitz](#): > > I greatly enjoyed seeing Ryan suffer at the task, especially after he was going on about how smart he was with his UC Davis education. On the one hand, the comedy of Ryan’s suffering was too delicious to not enjoy. On the other hand, I’ve had the experience of being so keyed into my first assumption on how to do a complex task that I overlook a glaring error in my initial assumptions, so I can be somewhat sympathetic. On the third hand, the time-zone thing was more akin to a sixth-grade math story problem than a hardcore puzzle, so I’m a bit at a loss to see why it was so hard for almost everyone. ---
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/31 "2012-11-19T20:46:39Z")
I wonder how the rockers did at the time zone puzzle. ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/32 "2012-11-19T21:22:54Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > That’s not universal. Which is what I was saying. Coordinated Universal Time isn’t universal? ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/33 "2012-11-19T21:28:29Z")
> [@Spud](#): > > Coordinated Universal Time isn’t universal? No, many US-based depictions of time zones give the time in one part of the US and then list the other time zones in relation to it. For example… Watching The Amazing Race on CBS at 8 PM Eastern Time (7 PM Central)! ---
**Author:** ![Motorgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e36b37/32.png) [@Motorgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Motorgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/34 "2012-11-19T21:38:14Z")
> [@HeyHomie](#): > > If you lose your USA passport in a first-world nation, how long until the State Department can hook you up with a new one so you can go home? When my mom lost hers in Dublin, the embassy had a new one printed for her in about 45 minutes. That doesn’t include the time it took us to get a new photo taken at a drugstore, and there was no line that day at the embassy that day. She had other ID, though, and a photocopy of her passport, which helped speed things along. I don’t know if the rocker had those things, though, or even if they’re allowed under the Amazing Rules to obtain a replacement passport. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/35 "2012-11-19T21:51:47Z")
I seem to remember when Toni and Dallas lost their passports, also in Moscow, it took a few days to get a new one according to post-race interviews. ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/36 "2012-11-19T23:15:42Z")
> [@Motorgirl](#): > > When my mom lost hers in Dublin, the embassy had a new one printed for her in about 45 minutes. That doesn’t include the time it took us to get a new photo taken at a drugstore, and there was no line that day at the embassy that day. She had other ID, though, and a photocopy of her passport, which helped speed things along. > > I don’t know if the rocker had those things, though, or even if they’re allowed under the Amazing Rules to obtain a replacement passport. Some countries (like, for example, Russia) require a visa to enter the country, and also (if I recall correctly) to _leave_ the country. So it’s not just the passport - it’s also, at a minimum, a Russian visa, and perhaps a few more depending on where the Race is headed to next. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2012, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/37 "2012-11-19T23:40:28Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > I know! That really piqued my interest: what kind of task involves riding in a taxi with a priest? We’ll never know, alas. We don’t know it was the Speed Bump. Since everyone in Moscow is a potential taxi driver, maybe they just flagged down a funeral that was headed in their direction. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/38 "2012-11-20T01:29:33Z")
> [@zut](#): > > That’s what it seemed like to me too; but that’s really odd since this is like the third or fourth time a team has lost a passport, so it’s not like the “no passport on a NEL” scenario is a mind-blowingly unforeseeable turn of events. I think it was the combination of NEL plus staying in the same country for the next leg that made it so unusual. Had the next leg been a typical one that started by flying to another country, the scenario might have been entirely different. ---
**Author:** ![Motorgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e36b37/32.png) [@Motorgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Motorgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/39 "2012-11-20T01:36:17Z")
> [@zut](#): > > Some countries (like, for example, Russia) require a visa to enter the country, and also (if I recall correctly) to _leave_ the country. So it’s not just the passport - it’s also, at a minimum, a Russian visa, and perhaps a few more depending on where the Race is headed to next. Good point! ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470/40 "2012-11-20T06:03:05Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Everybody knows that LA is three hours ahead of NY. Behind. LA is three hours _behind_ NY. A map of US time zones with UTC -5 (EST) and UTC -8 (PST) might have thrown the contestants for an even bigger loop. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-november-18/641470.md?page=3)