# The Amazing Race (TAR) 10/24/14: Morocc’ And Roll **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 25, 2014, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446 "2014-10-25T11:48:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/21 "2014-10-28T01:41:14Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > I guess my point is who cares if that one team doesn’t like you. Because that increases your odds of being U-Turned later in the race. I really don’t understand how this is confusing, especially since we just saw, in this very episode, one team get U-Turned for no other reason than that another team didn’t like them. > [@](#): > > And even if you believe teams liking you does help, forcing them to burn their save gets all the other teams to like you more. Other teams liking you is much less important than other teams not disliking you. When other teams like you, they might team up with you to do a particularly difficult task together. That can be a big help, but it’s still dwarfed by the downside of another team disliking you: They are much more likely to U-Turn you. > [@](#): > > I would also argue the Dentists aren’t a strong team. If that’s true, then you have strong incentive to keep their save intact. The longer a bad team stays in the race the better your chances to go further. ---
**Author:** ![Dag\_Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dag\_Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dag_Otto)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/22 "2014-10-28T05:27:49Z")
> [@The\_Controvert](#): > > In fact, I wonder if the Dentists come in last again and burn their save, can they still tell everyone it was another NEL (a lie) and they still have their Save? That would be cunning play; I wonder if the other racers would even think to ask to see their Save. The lack of a Speed Bump on the next leg would expose the lie. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/23 "2014-10-28T07:19:19Z")
Jim’s mocking of the teams who are enjoying their time on the race shows just how much of a douche he is. ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/24 "2014-10-28T11:12:41Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > The Dentists are a moderately strong team. Bumping off the Save could possibly shorten their time in the game (because they have a tendency to make the same really stupid mistake over and over again) and competing against weaker teams is always better than competing against stronger ones. > > I would have done it, is all I’m saying. There may actually be another practical reason _not_ to force the Dentists to use the Save: Remember that the goal through most of the legs is _not to get eliminated_, or to put it another way, to make sure it’s alway _some other team_ that gets eliminated. Forcing the Dentists to use the Save just means that some _other_ team is _not_ eliminated. If you have a choice, it would be better to narrow the field and eliminate _someone_, so long as you can be sure that someone is not you. Or, to be more clear: come leg nine (when the Save is no longer in play anyway), would you rather be in a Race with four teams and a NEL coming up, or a Race with five teams and no NEL? Because forcing the use of a Save makes the latter more likely. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/25 "2014-10-28T13:36:24Z")
> [@zut](#): > > Or, to be more clear: come leg nine (when the Save is no longer in play anyway), would you rather be in a Race with four teams and a NEL coming up, or a Race with five teams and no NEL? Because forcing the use of a Save makes the latter more likely. In the early going, before you’ve got your bearings, you want to keep more teams around because it gives you more chances to screw up… because someone else could screw up even worse. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/26 "2014-10-28T13:38:32Z")
Agreed, zut. I thought of that one as I was brushing my teeth this morning. If the save really does take the place of a NEL, you don’t want the save used because it can’t be used on you, only on the dentists. A NEL can be used on you. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/27 "2014-10-28T15:17:08Z")
> [@zut](#): > > There may actually be another practical reason _not_ to force the Dentists to use the Save: > > Remember that the goal through most of the legs is _not to get eliminated_, or to put it another way, to make sure it’s alway _some other team_ that gets eliminated. Forcing the Dentists to use the Save just means that some _other_ team is _not_ eliminated. If you have a choice, it would be better to narrow the field and eliminate _someone_, so long as you can be sure that someone is not you. > > Or, to be more clear: come leg nine (when the Save is no longer in play anyway), would you rather be in a Race with four teams and a NEL coming up, or a Race with five teams and no NEL? Because forcing the use of a Save makes the latter more likely. But does the Save mean that no one is eliminated that leg _or_ does the Save mean that the next-to-last team gets eliminated instead of the holders of the Save? In other words, had last week not been an NEL, would Bethany & Adam have gone home because the Dentists had the Save? I’ve been thinking it’s the latter, that teams now had to make sure to come in at least 2 from the bottom rather than just not last in order to not get eliminated. If I was correct, you want them to burn it on a leg where you’re near the top, so that in a leg where you’re near the bottom, you don’t have to worry about beating two other teams. If I was wrong and the Save just turns a leg into an NEL for the team holding it, then there’s no reason to try to get them to burn it. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/28 "2014-10-28T15:33:54Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > does the Save mean that the next-to-last team gets eliminated instead of the holders of the Save? In other words, had last week not been an NEL, would Bethany & Adam have gone home because the Dentists had the Save? I’ve been thinking it’s the latter, that teams now had to make sure to come in at least 2 from the bottom rather than just not last in order to not get eliminated. No, I don’t think that’s the case at all. Once you check in at the mat and Phil says “You are team #–”, you’re checked in and safe. If the Dentists come in two hours behind everyone, and use their Save, there is no way Phil is going to find the second-to-last team resting at the Pit Stop and tell them, “Oh by the way, haha nevermind, you are now eliminated!” ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/29 "2014-10-28T17:25:54Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > But does the Save mean that no one is eliminated that leg _or_ does the Save mean that the next-to-last team gets eliminated instead of the holders of the Save? In other words, had last week not been an NEL, would Bethany & Adam have gone home because the Dentists had the Save? I’ve been thinking it’s the latter, that teams now had to make sure to come in at least 2 from the bottom rather than just not last in order to not get eliminated. I’m not actually _sure_ how the Save works, but I’m reasonably sure the _teams themselves_ know what happens when the Save is used. Based on the fact that Bethany & Adam weren’t particularly worried about landing in next-to-last place, and that the Dentists had to explain that they didn’t use the Save (when clearly there were no eliminations), I’d conclude that the Save means no one is eliminated on that leg. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2014, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446/30 "2014-10-29T00:29:52Z")
I can’t imagine the Save would eliminate a team that wasn’t last. I would guess it creates a “floating NEL” and if never used the next leg after it expires will be a NEL (but won’t be if the Save gets used before that). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-amazing-race-tar-10-24-14-morocc-and-roll/702446.md?page=1)