# The American Coup: 11.9.2020 - **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 9, 2020, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182 "2020-11-09T23:29:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 28
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/542 "2020-11-19T17:10:55Z")
I stupidly thought the internet would make society more liberal because they would interact with different sorts of people and lower the sort of insular fear that builds conservatism. Really miscalled that one. Also, a typewriter would be very satisfying to throw into a quarry. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/543 "2020-11-19T17:17:21Z")
Me too. It seems the internet just made it easier for like-minded nuts to gather and reinforce their version of crazy. We all supposed that better access to information would help people. Turns out most people don’t want info that goes against their beliefs and instead glom on to anything, not matter how spurious, to be their truth. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/544 "2020-11-19T17:19:40Z")
There was a time that wanting to have sex with a cartoon horse was a deep-seated shame you’d share with no one. Now they have conventions with merch. So, silver linings, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/545 "2020-11-19T17:23:35Z")
So you don’t think the people who own that lawn are “the civilian population, or any segment thereof”? Or you don’t think it was done in furtherance of political or social objectives? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/546 "2020-11-19T17:31:13Z")
In _Earth_ by David Brin, set another 20 years from now, but published in 1990, he “predicted” the internet. Specifically the easy access to whatever knowledge you wanted at your fingertips(or voice command). One of the things that it did have though, was you could set your preferences, but it would still deliver some percentage, at least 10%, outside of your preferences. It’s been nearly 30 years since I read it, so I don’t really remember most of the details, but I think it was actually mentioned that that was specifically to prevent exactly the sort of information bubbles that we see today. ---
**Author:** ![Skypist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skypist/32/169_2.png) [@Skypist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skypist)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/547 "2020-11-19T17:39:13Z")
Haven’t any of these people ever seen or experienced other professions going the way of the dodo bird? My current profession has been going that way for years, and I have a feeling these same coal miners screaming about keeping their own jobs forever would tell me to suck it up and “find something new” a la Princess Ivanka. Things do change sometimes. Yeah it would be easier if it didn’t affect my own livelihood like it does. I’d be lying if I didn’t admit that. But things do change. If they didn’t, we’d still have buggy drivers and what not. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/548 "2020-11-19T17:42:19Z")
It’s always easiest to lie to yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/549 "2020-11-19T17:57:23Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > …but it would still deliver some percentage, at least 10%, outside of your preferences. That seems intriguing as a solution to the current state of things. Demand that a given platform delivers 10% contrary news to what you want and delivers it in the same fashion it delivers all of its news. The devil is in the details and I am not sure it could be made to work (how do you divide content) but still, a place to start. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/550 "2020-11-19T17:57:47Z")
> [@Kron](#): > > > [@Lavender\_Pebble](#): > > > > She doesn’t have a lot in the way of solutions other than “people on different sides need to hang out with one another to learn that they have common goals,” but I’m not sure how possible that is for communities that are geographically separated from others. > > Some decades ago, I thought this burgeoning “internet” would cause just that to happen, and that people would finally pull themselves up out of the dark ages because they could discuss things with people of different cultures and with different viewpoints, and we would end up with a GLOBAL melting pot, and the humanity would finally work together for the greater good (_the greater good_). > > Yes, I was in my late teens/early twenties, and naive as HELL. > [@Lobohan](#): > > I stupidly thought the internet would make society more liberal because they would interact with different sorts of people and lower the sort of insular fear that builds conservatism. Really miscalled that one. You guys aren’t alone in that naivete. In 2012 or '13 I attended a talk by a top Google exec where he asserted that the free flow of ideas via the Internet would “make bad ideas fail faster.” Not exactly working out that way, is it? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/551 "2020-11-19T17:59:02Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > That seems intriguing as a solution to the current state of things. Demand that a given platform delivers 10% contrary news to what you want and delivers it in the same fashion it delivers all of its news. > > The devil is in the details and I am not sure it could be made to work (how do you divide content) but still, a place to start. For example: lies shouldn’t count as “contrary news.” How do you work that? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/552 "2020-11-19T18:01:03Z")
Here’s another [FBI definition](https://www.fbi.gov/investigate/terrorism): > Violent, criminal acts committed by individuals and/or groups to further ideological goals stemming from domestic influences, such as those of a political, religious, social, racial, or environmental nature. I think the same argument could be made if you stole a Biden/Harris lawn sign and replaced it with a Trump/Pence lawn sign. I think a similar argument could be made if you set a Biden/Harris lawn sign on fire. Or removed the “Trump 2020” bumper sticker from your neighbor’s car. But I think it would tough to characterize any of those actions as domestic terrorism. Wherever the line is … IMHO … they don’t cross [NPI] it. Maybe the first time the Klan set a cross ablaze on somebody’s lawn, _it_ didn’t clear the bar either. But with time, repetition, and an abundance of context, mainly provided _by_ the Klan … their motives and tactics became clear, and were probably used as evidence in trials. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/553 "2020-11-19T18:08:03Z")
Define “lies”. Seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/554 "2020-11-19T18:35:01Z")
> [@Skypist](#): > > Haven’t any of these people ever seen or experienced other professions going the way of the dodo bird? You’re correct of course, but these folks think that OTHER people should change. Not themselves. OTHER people need to suck it up. Not themselves. DigitalC is absolutely right that they prefer a comfortable lie rather than the truth, and the will cherry-pick the one lie out of 100 truths to make themselves feel better, and assure themselves that THEY don’t have to change anything or learn anything new. Once they use this technique to deny reality, there is nothing, NOTHING that will shake them out of this comfortable delusion. They are unreachable. They are cult members. Cult members will literally kill themselves rather than admit to reality. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/555 "2020-11-19T19:11:47Z")
I’m not saying it’s easy - it’s not. We’re dealing with years of misinformation that predates the Trump era, which is not easy to undo. I think it’ll take a special kind of personality to do what I’m referring to - someone who comes across as relatable and has broad appeal. I don’t see anyone in the Democratic party or even moderate centrists who can do what I’m talking about. On a different subject, I really think it is time for principled republicans to drop the god damn republican party. I don’t understand never Trumpers and other conservatives who somehow foolishly hope that the GOP can recover and become the party of Lincoln again. It can’t. It is hopelessly corrupt. The Republican party has to be killed off and remade into something else, and what that means is that this ideas that “good” Republicans have to understand that they can’t just quietly take their tax cuts and not leave their fingerprints on the death of American democracy. That will not work. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/556 "2020-11-19T19:31:22Z")
To you and all the others echoing this thought above and below this quoted snip. > [@Lobohan](#): > > I stupidly thought the internet would make society more liberal because they would interact with different sorts of people and lower the sort of insular fear that builds conservatism. Really miscalled that one. > … I thought the same thing too. As did the EFF and many others both young and idealistic or old enough to have known better. What we all forgot to consider was the commercial side of things. The internet created a vast new audience that could be monetized. So of course, it was monetized. Fox News and Limbaugh’s radio show were not created for political reasons. They were created to make money. Which had political consequences. The internet started as an unregulated medium and it will end as an unregulated medium. But the currency of the realm is not good ideas such we often share here. The currency of the realm is plain old filthy money and the power it can buy. To the degree ideas _are_ a currency here, Gresham’s law applies in spades: “Bad money drives out good.” ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/557 "2020-11-19T19:31:37Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > On a different subject, I really think it is time for principled republicans to drop the god damn republican party. I don’t understand never Trumpers and other conservatives who somehow foolishly hope that the GOP can recover and become the party of Lincoln again. It can’t. It is hopelessly corrupt. > > The Republican party has to be killed off and remade into something else, and what that means is that this ideas that “good” Republicans have to understand that they can’t just quietly take their tax cuts and not leave their fingerprints on the death of American democracy. That will not work. I’m betting the Republicans who voted for Biden but went GOP down-ticket think of themselves as “good, principled Republicans.” These Red Biden VotersTM may believe once Trump is out of office, their party can return to responsible leadership. IOW, they now think they’ve done all that needs doing. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/558 "2020-11-19T19:38:47Z")
> _It’s comforting to call Trump, Giuliani, and the rest clowns, but clowns with power are not funny at all. They won’t overturn the election, but they are doing tremendous damage, which was always the goal_. – Garry Kasparov I think Kasparov’s tweet sums it up nice. They _may_ not overturn the election, but they are casting serious doubt on the entire process, and they are making it ripe for a right wing authoritarian takeover in the coming years. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/559 "2020-11-19T19:50:01Z")
A republican congressman on NPR pointed out that many Latinos identify socialism with the commie countries they fled. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/560 "2020-11-19T20:28:04Z")
Which is their mistake and stupidity. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182/561 "2020-11-19T20:34:45Z")
As a Hispanic that fled the civil war in El Salvador… I sadly agree with you [Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole). (The sad part being how they usually also ignore that outfits like United Fruit -with American government help- propped up the right wing military dictatorships in Central and South America that then gave fuel to the revolutions there) Fortunately, many other Hispanics like in California and Arizona do not make that mistake. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182.md?page=27) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-coup-11-9-2020/925182.md?page=29)