# The American "R" (Pronunciation) **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 6, 2012, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138 "2012-11-06T20:53:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2012, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/41 "2012-11-12T22:07:21Z")
And for grins, I just made the r sound with the tip of my tongue touching the soft tissue under the tongue. It was a proper r sound. I can flap the tip around and make an r sound as long as it doesn’t touch the teeth or roof of the mouth. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2012, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/42 "2012-11-12T22:19:43Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > I don’t understand either. Once you’ve begun saying “laaaa” how can it possibly change into a “raaaa”? The ‘l’ is done with, all you’re saying now is “aaaaaa”. I forget the phonological terminology, but /l/ and /r/ can be thought of as forming the ends of a gradient of sounds, as it were. IIRC this is why native speakers of some East Asian languages seem to confuse /l/ and /r/ when speaking English, due to the fact that /l/ and /r/ are not phonemically distinct in those languages. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2012, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/43 "2012-11-13T21:30:29Z")
He’s misunderstanding. Once you’re in the “aaa” part, moving the tongue around can’t possibly change the /r/ or /l/. The actual statement was attempting to get the movement while making the /l/. It was just poorly written to express the concept, using the syllable “laaaa”. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2012, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/44 "2012-11-13T22:59:27Z")
I was listening to a British podcast the other day, and the guest had either an accent or a speech impediment, I’m not sure which. In my experience, the difference between typical British and American pronunciation of the /r/ sound is when that sound is at the _end_ of a syllable, but I thought everyone pronounced a beginning /r/ the same. For example, the word “room.” The radio show is the _Unbelievable?_ show, and the guest was philosopher Tim Mawson. Tim had written a paper which deals with the idea of God as a man in a dark room, and if someone wants to know if someone is in there, that person has to actively try to find him by talking to him (praying). Anyway, the phrase “dark room” gets used over and over again, and Mawson pronounces all his /r/ sounds as what sounds exactly to this American as a /w/. So to me, he keeps talking about a “dark womb,” which is kind of distracting. You can listen to him at this link: [http://www.premierradio.org.uk/listen/ondemand.aspx?mediaid={6E86BF1C-9429-4064-A97F-E02C4F07DA50}](http://www.premierradio.org.uk/listen/ondemand.aspx?mediaid=%7B6E86BF1C-9429-4064-A97F-E02C4F07DA50%7D) Start listening at the 5:45 mark. He doesn’t just say it with that word, every word with an /r/ sound he replaces with a /w/. Is that an accent, or a speech impediment? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2012, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/45 "2012-11-13T23:45:19Z")
I think it’s a not uncommon feature of highly plummy accents. Frank Muir, for example. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/46 "2012-11-14T02:09:32Z")
I don’t know if it’s been mentioned yet, but there is an extra-dimensional pipeline that siphons off “r"s from New England and drops them in the proximity of the Texas Panhandle: In Boston they"Wash the Caaa.” and in Tulsa they “Warsh the car.” ---
**Author:** ![sweat209](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc348/32.png) [@sweat209](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sweat209)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/47 "2012-11-14T03:55:59Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > Intermingling descriptions from different people. **Jragon** said > > Those links are interesting. I went and looked in the mirror, my tongue is mostly bunched, not really pointed at all. It turns out the tip does appear to go slightly up toward the alveolar ridge, but it is so bunched it is not like I really have a tip of the tongue, and it feels like it is pointed more downward. Pointing the tip upward makes an l sound. > > This video is interesting. > > [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wEIsyqu\_Jo&NR=1&feature=endscreen](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wEIsyqu_Jo&NR=1&feature=endscreen) > > I can’t imagine making an r by curling upward and rolling out that coiled tool. Most people in UK do not say the sound R . Not to say that even some people in the US if you a kid it is very hard to say the R sound has it sounds like W sound . There is also Rhotic and non-Rhotic accents in the US from what people say it just how you say the R sound. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/48 "2012-11-14T20:40:42Z")
Could you try that again, but this time in English? Yes, I’m aware that many British and some US dialects are non-rhotic, and that their trailing r sounds (i.e. r’s following vowels) are not pronounced the way rhotic r’s are. I am also aware that people who have trouble pronouncing the r sound may make it as a w sound. (See Elmer Fudd.) I can’t see how that relates to my post you cited. ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/49 "2012-11-14T21:05:10Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > And for grins, I just made the r sound with the tip of my tongue touching the soft tissue under the tongue. It was a proper r sound. I can flap the tip around and make an r sound as long as it doesn’t touch the teeth or roof of the mouth. Fun experiments. I can make a proper ‘r’ most anywhere, except when the base of my tongue is withdrawn to a near-gag point. However, ‘d’ gives me some trouble. I can only do a ‘d’ with the tip of my tongue bent upward on my soft palate. I can’t make anything close to a ‘d’ with tooth contact. That people involve their teeth when making ‘d’ or ‘l’ is crazy to me. I have rather wonky teeth and have never had braces, so I’m sure that I’ve adapted positions to make sounds that aren’t typical. I’ve also been told by lip readers that I am pretty much impossible to read or understand. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/50 "2012-11-14T23:05:26Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > I am also aware that people who have trouble pronouncing the r sound may make it as a w sound. (See Elmer Fudd.) Back to my question - Elmer Fudd had a speech impediment. Are there British accents that replace the /r/ sound with a /w/ sound, that aren’t considered impediments? ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2012, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138/51 "2012-11-15T20:18:26Z")
**CurtC** , I do not know the answer to your question. I did just realize that two posts before my comment about Elmer Fudd was a post by **Elmer J. Fudd**. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-american-r-pronunciation/640138.md?page=2)