# The Americans Season 3 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 28, 2015, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097 "2015-01-28T09:03:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![BOOM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c4cdca/32.png) [@BOOM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BOOM)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/181 "2015-02-14T18:09:46Z")
Well, we’ve had these series recap blogs for sometime on The Guardian - sometimes entertaining, very occasionally insightful. Usually the comments below are more helpful (in correcting the original blog post). Not exactly top calibre freelancers, and obviously online only. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/182 "2015-02-14T18:13:30Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > The scene where Elizabeth wants to try Martha’s submissive rough sex, and Phillip knows she will hate it, was the same sort of intimate scene emotionally, and far more jarring. Phillip deeply cares for Elizabeth, and she wants to care for him that much (and their children too), but just comes short of actually caring that much. Yes. Sometimes, the writers like to answer questions that the audience has, in show. The Martha simulation scene was since many people wondered how the illegals could partake in sexual relationships with targets and not develop feelings for the mark. The scene showed that for them the sex is just part of the job and not something they enjoy. The problem is that the tooth scene was meant to showcase the absolute trust they now have. But, the setup was unrealistic. ---
**Author:** ![blackbolt\_1987](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@blackbolt\_1987](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blackbolt_1987)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/183 "2015-02-14T18:17:16Z")
The Americans is such a work of art ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/184 "2015-02-14T18:27:53Z")
> [@JohnGalt](#): > > That new oil painting of Andropov got painted and sent to the embassy pretty quickly! Not surprising. Everyone at the top knew for months that Brezhnev was dying and that Andropov would succeed him. They had everything ready by November '92, which is why the transition went so smoothly. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/185 "2015-02-14T18:35:04Z")
> [@](#): > > Stan will have to recognize her when that sketch circulates, won’t he? How many sketches has he seen already and failed utterly to make the connection? Duh! _“Hey, wait a minute … damned if that doesn’t look a lot like … naaaaaaaaah, couldn’t be!”_ :smack: It would be interesting if he finally did and reported it to his superiors: _“ **How** many years did you live next door to these people and didn’t suspect a thing?!?”_ :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/186 "2015-02-14T18:36:26Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Not surprising. Everyone at the top knew for months that Brezhnev was dying and that Andropov would succeed him. They had everything ready by November '92, which is why the transition went so smoothly. Do you mean November '82? that’s the year and month Brezhnev died ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/187 "2015-02-14T18:52:18Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > Do you mean November '82? that’s the year and month Brezhnev died Typo; thanks. Of course it was '82. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/188 "2015-02-14T20:54:16Z")
> [@Shalmanese](#): > > Keep in mind the second generation illegals program is explicitly not doing the kind of work that Phillip and Elizabeth are doing. The goal of the 2nd generation is to get legitimate jobs in places of trust in the government since they now have covers deep enough to pass thorough background vetting. > Most of the work required of them is basically doing well in school and schmoozing the right people. But at some point, the 2nd-Gen is going to be asked to do something that will compromise the security of the United States. That’s the whole point. And will Paige be willing to do that? We’ve seen that Philip and Elizabeth have carefully refrained from trying to turn their kids into socialists from the get-go. They (apparently) haven’t talked politics much in the household. They’re not encouraging Paige and Henry to refuse to pledge allegiance to the American flag, either literally or metaphorically. They haven’t, so far as we can see, suggested to Paige or to Henry that the USSR is a more highly moral and admirable nation than is the USA. Sure, Paige is interested in social justice. She already accepts that it’s okay to criticize the US government for its failures in that regard. But to actually take action to subvert that government, and/or to take action to promote the USSR…that’s a far cry from merely _protesting_ US government policies. In short: I’m not seeing how a proposed 2nd Generation program could even work in the case of our fictional Jennings family. I don’t see how Paige could be brought to believe that the USSR is more deserving of her allegiance than is the USA–not in the 1980s, certainly, when Soviet aggression in Afghanistan was seen as being anything but good for the Afghans (by the Western world, at least). ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/189 "2015-02-14T21:29:21Z")
Yeah, basically it’s a Catch-22. You can raise someone to be dedicated communist or you can raise someone who’s going to fit into American society. It’s hard to see how you can do both. I mean Jared was pretty messed up. Assuming, for the sake of argument, that it’s possible though one role such a person could play would be that of “talent scout”. Getting info on possible recruits, like Gregory, and funneling that info to Moscow. ---
**Author:** ![BOOM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c4cdca/32.png) [@BOOM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BOOM)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/190 "2015-02-14T21:34:51Z")
I don’t get what you’re saying, there were plenty of KGB spies working in the US, some born in the US some not? > **[List of Eastern Bloc agents in the United States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Soviet_agents_in_the_United_States)** > > This is a list of people who have been accused of, or confirmed as working for intelligence organizations of the Soviet Union and Soviet-aligned countries against the United States. In some cases accusations are considered well-supported or were otherwise confirmed or admitted, but other cases are controversial or contested. > For more information, see: ---
**Author:** ![Shalmanese](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shalmanese](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shalmanese)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/191 "2015-02-14T21:44:41Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > Yeah, basically it’s a Catch-22. You can raise someone to be dedicated communist or you can raise someone who’s going to fit into American society. It’s hard to see how you can do both. I mean Jared was pretty messed up. We’ve seen plenty of examples of agents that Philip and Elizabeth have managed to turn for a variety of reasons who have still managed to fit in. If anyone were capable of doing it, presumably it would be these guys. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/192 "2015-02-14T22:41:05Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > But at some point, the 2nd-Gen is going to be asked to do something that will compromise the security of the United States. That’s the whole point. > > And will Paige be willing to do that? > > We’ve seen that Philip and Elizabeth have carefully refrained from trying to turn their kids into socialists from the get-go. They (apparently) haven’t talked politics much in the household. They’re not encouraging Paige and Henry to refuse to pledge allegiance to the American flag, either literally or metaphorically. They haven’t, so far as we can see, suggested to Paige or to Henry that the USSR is a more highly moral and admirable nation than is the USA. It’s a lot worse than that. We’re now 25 years removed from the Cold War, so some may not remember it, but back then, “Communist” was a dirty word, many of the villains in movies were commies, there were TV shows like “The FBI” that kids grew up watching where the commies were painted as despicable, etc. And there was the omnipresent threat of the USSR nuking us. Telling a kid raised in that environment that you secretly work for the Soviets would be like telling a kid raised today that you work for al-Qaeda. 999 out of a thousand would absolutely freak out. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/193 "2015-02-14T22:47:21Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > In short: I’m not seeing how a proposed 2nd Generation program could even work in the case of our fictional Jennings family. I don’t think in _this_ case it is terribly plausible either ( nor do I believe the Center would risk losing their two most valuable assets over it ). But apparently it has been [tried under other circumstances](http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10000872396390444097904577537044185191340). ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/194 "2015-02-14T23:07:20Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > I don’t think in _this_ case it is terribly plausible either ( nor do I believe the Center would risk losing their two most valuable assets over it ). But apparently it has been [tried under other circumstances](http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10000872396390444097904577537044185191340). Interesting; no doubt the showrunners have taken note of that WSJ article. (From 2012–so, a year before the show’s debut.) I’m no expert, but I’d think that the American kids most likely to agree to spy for another nation (the USSR in the 1980s or Russia now) would be either kids who’d been brought up to despise “American values,” or kids who were in rebellion against their parents’ knee-jerk promotion of a claimed primacy of “American values.” And in _The Americans_, neither condition applies. For obvious reasons Philip and Elizabeth have plainly steered a moderate course with their kids: they haven’t taught the kids to despise the US, nor have they asserted a ‘USA right or wrong’ attitude. So the kids would have nothing either to rebel against or to embrace. ---
**Author:** ![BOOM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c4cdca/32.png) [@BOOM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BOOM)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/195 "2015-02-15T00:13:24Z")
It’ll be interesting to see how they work that. Fwiw, I was a few years older than Paige. Reagan in general and the US’ central American policy in particular both politicised and sickened many people I knew. I can really see a way into that through her church stuff because of the en-masse murdering of priests by the CIA/Contras. Her pastor guy seems very politicaly aware and you can see Paige could pick up his rage. Fwiw, it’s also now two years after Sandinista by The Clash came out. Something from that album is my early bet for the first musical montage of this season. Probably not going to be REO Speedwagon… ---
**Author:** ![BOOM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c4cdca/32.png) [@BOOM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BOOM)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/196 "2015-02-15T00:25:22Z")
I guess what I’m saying is it won’t be a ‘well, I’m pro-Soviet now: rah, rah, rah’. It’ll probably be a growing political awareness sparked by something like central America. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/197 "2015-02-15T01:04:33Z")
Phillip and Elizabeth have recruited assets using time-honored techniques of Money (the gambling debt guy), Ideology (Gregory), Compromise (the gay contra trainer) and Ego (the screw-the-CIA woman), usually abbreviated as MICE. We’ve seen examples of all four as well as false-flag recruiting (Analise and, arguably, Martha.) All play on human weakness. That’s not what they would want to do with Paige. They’d want her to be strong, but committed, by conviction, to their viewpoint. That’s another kettle of fish. The KGB was able to train Phillip and Elizabeth to _pass_ as Americans, but Paige, for all intents and purposes, _is_ an American. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/198 "2015-02-15T01:36:54Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Interesting; no doubt the showrunners have taken note of that WSJ article. (From 2012–so, a year before the show’s debut.) The show was directly inspired by the 2010 [Illegals Program](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegals_Program) incident, which of course involved the above recruitment of the 20-yr old son that came out in public in 2012. So not only were they aware, I wouldn’t be surprised if it was an eventual planned plot point from day one of the show ;). The Americans was created by a former CIA agent turned [script writer](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Americans_(2013_TV_series)#Conception), who had apparently been disappointed to find out how boring being a CIA agent was in real life. He’s certainly livened up this version :D. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4bbf92/32.png) [@Charlie\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/199 "2015-02-15T03:13:00Z")
I have so many things to do this weekend … and yet … my mind keeps on going back to hearing Elizabeth saying that she was injured carrying groceries. **Injured carrying groceries? This tough Russian girl was injured carrying groceries?** And yet, Stan’s ex-wife can heft two bags full with no problem? My oh my! Once again, the bold addition was all mine. But, I just can’t get over this. I think my mind may be broken. Aye Aye Aye!!! (spoken with my best Desi Arnaz impersonation). **Hey Lucy?** ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097/200 "2015-02-15T21:29:26Z")
I’m only slightly older than Paige is supposed to be. The Soviets were somewhere between morally bankrupt and completely evil. Stalin was only better than Hitler because he protected his people from Hitler, after being much worse to them than Hitler was to his people. Afghanistan was an invasion of moral turpitude of stunning proportions, and the soon to be putting down of Polish labor equally cynical. The USSR was a totalitarian imperial empire. Only someone who had grown up there and fighting the nazis or someone mentally ill or damaged goods, like Jared or all the spies, could fail to see the USSR as a _system_ that was contrary to social justice. Yes, they may have helped some third world rebels against worse tyrants, but the big picture was impossible for any mentally well American to comprehend. Paige is very well adjusted. The best that “her handlers” can expect is that she keeps quiet. More likely she will take her time and do far more damage than Jared. She might sit on it for a week and then go to Beeman and then the FBI rolls up Walker and Ames while she is a double agent. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-3/711097.md?page=11)