# The Americans Season 4 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 28, 2016, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496 "2016-01-28T15:34:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 29
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2016, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/561 "2016-06-13T07:51:13Z")
> [@btcg](#): > > Last post: neither P & E or Stan lives in a building attached to 3 other residences. > > But P & E live in a 3 level home… hence a tri. In real life, those homes are triplexes. On the show, at least in beginning, they made no attempt to hide the fact that they are triplexes. In fact, there is a scene where Elizabeth picks up her mail from a set of 3 identical mail boxes. As the show went on, they made attempts to obscure the fact that the house is a triplex (probably, I’m guessing, because people keep asking where are the neighbors), but every now and again, it’s plainly obvious that the houses are indeed triplexes. So, as I said before (a little sarcastically so maybe that threw you off), even though the houses are triplexes, after 4 seasons of not seeing any neighbors, we should just assume they all live in very big houses with multiple front doors and too many garages. What don’t you agree with in that statement? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2016, 8:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/562 "2016-06-13T08:51:25Z")
Clicking the dictionary link provided upthread, I see that ‘triplex’ has MULTIPLE distinct meanings, including - - a single-family residence that happens to have three stories. - - three separate family residences that happen to be part of a single building. Complicating the issue is that the Jennings home appears to be part of a triplex of triplexes. :eek: I respectfully urge that the word ‘triplex’ be banned from the thread and replaced with either ‘three-story residence’ or ‘three-family building’ as appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2016, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/563 "2016-06-13T12:16:18Z")
Little did I realize I was hitting upon the topic that would spawn true debate about this series! 😉 Actually, I never noticed that they put up a false front to disguise the other garage. What always struck me was that whenever they drive/walk into the U-shaped driveway/entryway, there are clearly 2 entry doors on either side of the base side of the U. The Jennings ALWAYS go to the door on the left, and always pull into the garage on the left. I guess what really confused me was that, as spies, I’d think they’d want some degree of privacy/anonymity more than you’d have if you shared a wall and driveway with your immediate neighbor. Just struck me as an odd choice by whomever selected that neighborhood for filming the exteriors. It also seems as though they have a homeowner’s association and maintenance contract. Have we ever seen Stan or any of the Jennings perform any yard work? Yeah, we’ve got a family of sleeper spies living across the street from an FBI agent, and THESE are the type of details I’m focusing on… :smack: ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2016, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/564 "2016-06-13T14:33:05Z")
OK, “triplex” is an extension from “duplex”, meaning three dwellings in one structure. A three story home, either free standing or adjoined to other units, could be referred to as a “tri-level”, but I generally associate that term with a house where the bedrooms are above the “basement”, with a half flight of stairs leading from either to the living room/dining room floor. [![](https://activerain-store.s3.amazonaws.com/image_store/uploads/9/4/7/7/4/ar121997446247749.jpg) ](https://activerain-store.s3.amazonaws.com/image_store/uploads/9/4/7/7/4/ar121997446247749.jpg) This has been a public service announcement. We now return you to our regularly scheduled discussion of “The Americans”. (Sorry for that last little bit, I couldn’t help myself.) ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2016, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/565 "2016-06-13T14:39:40Z")
For what it’s worth, it’s pretty obvious that the Jennings and the Beemans have the same floorplan. Damn cookie cutter neighborhoods! Do you think they production actually has two sets, or do they just redress it? ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2016, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/566 "2016-06-13T15:17:28Z")
I think you know the answer to that one. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2016, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/567 "2016-06-13T22:56:14Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Little did I realize I was hitting upon the topic that would spawn true debate about this series! 😉 Yeah, I place the blame squarely at your feet.😛 ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/568 "2016-06-14T08:10:12Z")
> [@zbuzz](#): > > I get what you’re saying about Stan, but another way to look at it is that the Jennings are now Stan’s entire life, for the most part, outside of work. He isn’t seeing anyone (right? he broke up with whomever he was seeing, I think?), he’s closer to Henry than Matthew, he invites himself over for dinner, he does manly stuff like drink beer and play racquetball with Philip. So coming home from a blown operation and 3 days of watching a KGB agent ooze his guts out to find your real family and your surrogate family getting closer must’ve been a shot in the arm to him, like hey, after a really bad day, it’s nice to see something go right for a change. Plus, Stan kind of has to have that overjoyed reaction to contrast and give more weight to Philip’s own “this ends now” reaction. > > I don’t think he’s giving them a weird look when they are leaving, though. I think he’s just watching them leave. > > The composite sketches alone they have of Philip and Elizabeth should have almost done it. I agree with you about Stan in that scene. I don’t think he suspects anything, and I would be very surprised if there’s a reveal next season that William told them anything more. I disagree with you, however, about the sketches. I think they are almost comically unhelpful–and I’m pretty sure that’s intentional on the showrunners’ part. ETA: After asserting the above opinion, I [did some quick research,](http://www.tvguide.com/news/american-finale-season2-spoilers-1064831/) and…yup: > [@](#): > > **There’s only so long that Stan Beeman can be unaware that his neighbors are KGB agents. Is there any part of him that suspects that his neighbors could be this couple?** > **Weisberg:** We think he’s really over that. That it was something he suspected in the pilot and he got over it and dismissed it as him being paranoid based on his undercover days. He really let that go. Until there is really more evidence that appears, there’s no real reason for him to suspect again. Those things do have to come up, but it’s up to us to dole them out as we see fit. For example, those sketches came up, but those sketches don’t really look like them. > **Fields:** We spent hours seeing different sketches to make sure that they felt believable, but they would also never tip Stan off. > **Weisberg:** Lucky it’s the 1980s because those were the days before sketch artists used computers and get these much more realistic sketches. We talked a lot about what people see when they’re victimized and how those ideas are fused with their different fears. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/569 "2016-06-14T08:42:24Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I disagree with you, however, about the sketches. I think they are almost comically unhelpful–and I’m pretty sure that’s intentional on the showrunners’ part. I guess the Jennings are lucky I’m not an FBI agent then. Do you remember the ones of Philip? I think there are at least 2 we’ve seen and, imho, they both capture his eyes and lips pretty well, as I recall. It’s funny though that Stan can look at the 2 very dissimilar sketches of Elizabeth and instantly realize they are of the same person, yet they aren’t even supposed to look like Elizabeth. I don’t really think that computes, maybe they were thinking more of the sketches from Gaad and the other guy because those really didn’t look like her. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/570 "2016-06-14T08:46:36Z")
No, that interview is from after Season 1. ETA: I found more sketches though, and I still don’t think they look enough like him to tip Stan off: [The one from S1](http://img2.tvtome.com/i/u/b113b84097874915c9459e3bc341d9ba.jpg) [Much more recent](https://tvatemywardrobe.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/img_2843.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/571 "2016-06-14T09:23:33Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > No, that interview is from after Season 1. > > ETA: I found more sketches though, and I still don’t think they look enough like him to tip Stan off: > > [The one from S1](http://img2.tvtome.com/i/u/b113b84097874915c9459e3bc341d9ba.jpg) > > [Much more recent](https://tvatemywardrobe.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/img_2843.jpeg) Alright so up through season 2 they don’t think they are good sketches, are there any comments more recent than that? Looking at the 2nd link, I think thats the sketch from Martha’s landlord, but I’m not certain. To me, that looks a lot like him, with the sort of (I don’t really know how to describe it) the sad type eyes. His lips, too. And the first link also shows the sad type eyes and again I would say similar accurate lips. So you think even the 2nd link with Philip in glasses looks comically unhelpful? I mean, I can understand someone not making a connection, but comically unhelpful? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/572 "2016-06-14T10:39:42Z")
Yeah, I think the stuff you are keying on (eyes and lips) has to be there to satisfy the first part of this sentence: > [@](#): > > We spent hours seeing different sketches to make sure that they felt believable, but they would also never tip Stan off. But it’s still just not nearly close enough to spark recognition in Stan. Compare the one of “Clark” with [this shot of Phil](http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/BN-NZ069_sweaty_J_20160511115510.jpg) (with Stan, so we know it’s what he looks like in front of him). Just not that similar IMO, except for the minimal amount to make it plausible that those sketches could be produced by someone who saw him as “Clark”. I also think BTW that it would be hard for him to imagine that Phil could pull off being married to Martha while having a family of his own. ETA: I think you may be illustrating the old truism “hindsight is 20/20”. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/573 "2016-06-14T11:12:50Z")
> [@zbuzz](#): > > Alright so up through season 2 they don’t think they are good sketches, are there any comments more recent than that? Okay, the one I shared earlier was from 2013. [Here’s one from 2015:](http://www.ew.com/article/2015/02/04/americans-bosses-could-second-generation-illegals-tear-philip-and-elizabeth-apart) > [@](#): > > **At what point does Stan (Noah Emmerich) look foolish for not being able to figure out his neighbors are Russian spies?** > **WEISBERG** : Well, there is no real reason for him to figure it out. And it is really not foolish at all for him to not figure it out. There is no reason at all he should think that his friends across the street are anything but what they say. I mean, if you think about it from his point of view or their point of view, they haven’t done anything really to tip him off at all. The closest I can find from this year (this month) is this comment from a \*Vox \*reviewer, who may or may not have interviewed the showrunners at some point (but I’ve got to think someone at Vox has): > [@](#): > > **Caroline** : I love the Joe Weisberg and Joel Fields style of showrunning. They’re brilliant, period. But sometimes I do feel like their strict adherence to the logic of this situation outside of a television show — like the fact that Stan wouldn’t suddenly suspect his neighbors just because William mentions a couple with two kids — makes them far less likely to care about pacing ​inside of a television show, and, I’m not going to lie, it can be disappointing! (As a side note, it’s interesting that the three of them debate whether or not the finale was “Wait, that was _it?_” or not–with Caroline counting herself in that camp as I do, and the other two insisting it was awesomesauce–albeit Libby sharing that reaction initially.) ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/574 "2016-06-14T13:39:58Z")
Stan also doesn’t know that the illegals that William was talking about were the same ones that he’s got sketches of and Stan’s smart enough not to assume that without additional facts. He might wonder if that’s the case, but he’s also aware that William gave them pretty inconsequential info about one couple while he’s on the trail of a different one. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/575 "2016-06-14T19:39:40Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Yeah, I think the stuff you are keying on (eyes and lips) has to be there to satisfy the first part of this sentence: > > But it’s still just not nearly close enough to spark recognition in Stan. Compare the one of “Clark” with [this shot of Phil](http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/BN-NZ069_sweaty_J_20160511115510.jpg) (with Stan, so we know it’s what he looks like in front of him). Just not that similar IMO, except for the minimal amount to make it plausible that those sketches could be produced by someone who saw him as “Clark”. > > I also think BTW that it would be hard for him to imagine that Phil could pull off being married to Martha while having a family of his own. > > ETA: I think you may be illustrating the old truism “hindsight is 20/20”. Well, hindsight can’t be the reason for me because I actually did think when we first saw them, “Gee, those sketches are pretty close, I wonder how they’ll work around that.” But obviously that hasn’t become an issue. But I am glad you’ve moved on from the sketches are “comically unhelpful” to accepting that they are minimally “plausible.” That’s a start. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/576 "2016-06-14T19:53:32Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Okay, the one I shared earlier was from 2013. [Here’s one from 2015:](http://www.ew.com/article/2015/02/04/americans-bosses-could-second-generation-illegals-tear-philip-and-elizabeth-apart) > > The closest I can find from this year (this month) is this comment from a \*Vox \*reviewer, who may or may not have interviewed the showrunners at some point (but I’ve got to think someone at Vox has): > > (As a side note, it’s interesting that the three of them debate whether or not the finale was “Wait, that was _it?_” or not–with Caroline counting herself in that camp as I do, and the other two insisting it was awesomesauce–albeit Libby sharing that reaction initially.) Sorry I wasn’t clear enough, I meant are there any more recent comments about the sketches, not about does Stan suspect the Jennings. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/577 "2016-06-15T01:35:41Z")
> [@zbuzz](#): > > Well, hindsight can’t be the reason for me because I actually did think when we first saw them, “Gee, those sketches are pretty close, I wonder how they’ll work around that.” But obviously that hasn’t become an issue. > > But I am glad you’ve moved on from the sketches are “comically unhelpful” to accepting that they are minimally “plausible.” That’s a start. They are both plausible _and_ comically unhelpful. Plausible that eyewitnesses describing what they saw to a 1980s sketch artist could produce such sketches, but comically unhelpful since we know what they actually look like. And I think you may have misunderstood somehow what I meant by 20/20 hindsight. I mean that you were not presented a bunch of different sketches in a lineup and asked to identify which ones were of Philip and Elizabeth. You knew who they were sketches of from the moment you first saw them on screen. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/578 "2016-06-15T03:17:05Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > And I think you may have misunderstood somehow what I meant by 20/20 hindsight. I mean that you were not presented a bunch of different sketches in a lineup and asked to identify which ones were of Philip and Elizabeth. You knew who they were sketches of from the moment you first saw them on screen. Nor the converse - unlike Stan, you have a target. Do those sketches look like Keri Russell/Matthew Rhys? Yes. I can see them in those drawings. But that’s not the question what Stan’s up against. If I were shown 10 or so people with not-dissimilar features and I was supposed to match a sketch of that quality with the right person, I doubt I’d do better than random chance. They don’t have any particularly distinguishing characteristics. They could be hundreds/thousands of people. The sketches aren’t going to lead him to the Jennings, but if he starts to figure out that the they’re his illegals, the sketches could help confirm the hunch. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/579 "2016-06-15T04:11:02Z")
Today’s methods do produce better sketches. I remember reading an article where the process was to show a person 10 pictures and say: “Which one looks most like him.”. Repeat three times or so, then the computer starts feeding pics based on your earlier choices. Ultimately, by the time you make your “final selection” the picture will look pretty much exactly how you remember the person, accurate that may be or not. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/580 "2016-06-15T05:35:49Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > They are both plausible _and_ comically unhelpful. Plausible that eyewitnesses describing what they saw to a 1980s sketch artist could produce such sketches, but comically unhelpful since we know what they actually look like. You said they aren’t similar _except for the minimal amount_ that makes it plausible that the person is describing Clark. That minimal amount to make it plausible necessarily keeps it from being comically unhelpful. > [@SlackerInc](#): > > And I think you may have misunderstood somehow what I meant by 20/20 hindsight. I mean that you were not presented a bunch of different sketches in a lineup and asked to identify which ones were of Philip and Elizabeth. You knew who they were sketches of from the moment you first saw them on screen. So it’s not really a 20/20 hindsight thing you were talking about, what you’re saying is there was no control group of sketches? Well, I can’t really help that since we haven’t seen any random sketches of unknowns mixed in with heretofore unseen sketches of the Jennings, so the best answer I can give you is that I don’t think the sketches done by Gaad and the other guy of Elizabeth would ever lead Stan to Elizabeth, yet I know they were of Elizabeth. I also don’t think the sketch on the right of the other 2 side-by-sides of Elizabeth would ever lead Stan to Elizabeth, yet I know they were of Elizabeth. But it all could just be as simple as you don’t think it looks like them at all and I do. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496.md?page=28) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496.md?page=30)