# The Americans Season 4 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 28, 2016, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496 "2016-01-28T15:34:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/141 "2016-04-08T15:19:12Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > No, you’re right. It was an annoying distraction from the main story line and was going nowhere. The only possible outcome I see from it is that perhaps her death will cause Oleg to either defect or become a double agent. If that happens, it’s deep shit for our heroes. Does Oleg know anything that could identify P&E? Or are you suggesting he could find it out going forward? ---
**Author:** ![Sefton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@Sefton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sefton)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/142 "2016-04-08T15:28:07Z")
Now I wonder what’s going to happen with Pastor Tim. If Phillip and Elizabeth aren’t willing to take forceful measures, I wonder if Paige will. ---
**Author:** ![Orwell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/dfb087/32.png) [@Orwell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orwell)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/143 "2016-04-08T15:35:29Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > Does Oleg know anything that could identify P&E? Or are you suggesting he could find it out going forward? I don’t remember if he has been shown to know P&E, but I’m betting he could find out that plus a lot of other stuff while working at the rezidentura. I think Oleg could possibly be flipped if he finds out about Nina. Working as a double agent is very tricky, though, as Nina discovered too late (twice if you count her sneaking the note). ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/144 "2016-04-08T16:19:44Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > Does Oleg know anything that could identify P&E? Or are you suggesting he could find it out going forward? Even if he doesn’t know them, he could pass information on the movement of rezidentura agents, and possibly identify senior agents like Gabriel and Claudia, who would lead them directly to Philip, et al. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/145 "2016-04-08T16:30:15Z")
> [@Sefton](#): > > Now I wonder what’s going to happen with Pastor Tim. If Phillip and Elizabeth aren’t willing to take forceful measures, I wonder if Paige will. You actually think Paige will turn into a stone killer? Hardly. She wouldn’t even know how. If she does anything it will be to warn them to run away. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/146 "2016-04-08T16:30:42Z")
He might know code names or such, but the actual ID info is probably very compartmentalized. His boss does know as there was that meeting between him and Phillip, where Phillip registered his reluctance to recruit Paige into the cause. ---
**Author:** ![Frosted\_Glass](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frosted_glass/32/3926_2.png) [@Frosted\_Glass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frosted_Glass)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/147 "2016-04-08T16:36:24Z")
> [@SaharaTea](#): > > Damn, the Soviets really mean it when they say the sentence will be carried out “shortly.” I suppose it was inevitable, but I am still shocked. She was a great character. That scene was really well done. I knew she was on her way to be executed when they talked about her “transfer” and her trial cinched it for me. I just expected them to walk her into another room or a courtyard and then shoot her instead of just putting a bullet in the back of her head in the hallway. That definitely caught me off-guard. I will definitely miss the overall character of Nina but her story this season didn’t do much for me. I spent the rest of the episode wondering about the safety of Pastor Tim and his wife. The scene with Elizabeth calling off the hit made me think that the message wouldn’t get their in time or that maybe the Center would just ignore it. I was surprised that the episode ended with Pastor Tim (presumably) alive and well. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/148 "2016-04-08T18:47:36Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > I… Stan had him half recruited last year when he “outed” the fake defector. Add losing a brother and a lover to the Soviet system, Oleg is primed to “cross over”. This show is too sophisticated to make any character a mere symbol for historical events, but at the same time: in the year this show is set, the Soviet Union hasn’t many years of life left. And members of the Soviet system like Oleg were becoming increasingly unhappy with the results of embracing authoritarianism; Oleg’s story dramatizes this. By the way, I’m not clear on this: Oleg’s father, while promising to ‘do something’ to help Nina, _did_ order her death, right? Was that the implication (even if not spelled out)? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/149 "2016-04-08T18:57:08Z")
Martha’s cover story was brilliant. It totally explains everything. She is not to be underestimated. > [@Frosted\_Glass](#): > > I was surprised that the episode ended with Pastor Tim (presumably) alive and well. I completely missed that somehow. What happened. ---
**Author:** ![Orwell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/dfb087/32.png) [@Orwell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orwell)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/150 "2016-04-08T19:25:16Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > This show is too sophisticated to make any character a mere symbol for historical events, but at the same time: in the year this show is set, the Soviet Union hasn’t many years of life left. And members of the Soviet system like Oleg were becoming increasingly unhappy with the results of embracing authoritarianism; Oleg’s story dramatizes this. > > By the way, I’m not clear on this: Oleg’s father, while promising to ‘do something’ to help Nina, _did_ order her death, right? Was that the implication (even if not spelled out)? Agree on the first. Oleg is clearly not in the party’s pocket. On the second, I didn’t get that implication. I thought perhaps her fate was sealed and Oleg’s father either didn’t intervene or didn’t accomplish anything. But I can see your point, perhaps, that his father didn’t want Oleg to start making a fuss or step on the wrong toes, so he eliminated the problem, so to speak. Not sure. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_Draper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Don\_Draper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_Draper)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/151 "2016-04-08T20:47:49Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > I can see that happening. Stan had him half recruited last year when he “outed” the fake defector. Add losing a brother and a lover to the Soviet system, Oleg is primed to “cross over”. I wouldn’t count on Oleg jumping ship just yet. I think it’s likely he will think Stan responsible (at least in part) for what happened to Nina. Recall that at the end of season 2, Nina was working Stan to hand over intel to Rezidentura agents and he refused. That’s why she got sent back. I can imagine that Oleg just might think “if only Agent Beeman had turned over the intel, Nina would still be alive!!!” That’s not an entirely rational viewpoint, but Oleg will likely not be entirely rational himself once he finds out what happened to Nina. For that matter, Stan himself will likely feel some emotional fallout when word reaches him (and it will.) ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/152 "2016-04-08T20:54:54Z")
> [@Don\_Draper](#): > > I wouldn’t count on Oleg jumping ship just yet. I think it’s likely he will think Stan responsible (at least in part) for what happened to Nina. Recall that at the end of season 2, Nina was working Stan to hand over intel to Rezidentura agents and he refused. That’s why she got sent back. I can imagine that Oleg just might think “if only Agent Beeman had turned over the intel, Nina would still be alive!!!” > > That’s not an entirely rational viewpoint, but Oleg will likely not be entirely rational himself once he finds out what happened to Nina. > > For that matter, Stan himself will likely feel some emotional fallout when word reaches him (and it will.) Perhaps instead of the Oleg flipping scenario, Oleg will take out a personal vendetta against Stan, and he pops Stan just when he is about to blow the whistle on Martha, thus ensuring their safety and another season. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/153 "2016-04-08T20:59:52Z")
It could play out that way too. This is why I love this show. ---
**Author:** ![btcg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@btcg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/btcg)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/154 "2016-04-08T21:08:32Z")
> [@twuest](#): > > Actually, I think it is quite clear cut. > > Martha should have said no from the start. If she had done that she would have avoided the entire situation. Clark/Phillip used her weakness and her desire for a long lasting relationship to get her to plant the bug and also to pass along classified information. > > If someone–regardless of their relationship with you—asks you to commit a serious crime (particularly one along the lines of espionage) you say “No, I can’t do that.” > > That’s what most would do. > > Martha is weak, and she is solely responsible for the predicament she finds herself in. Martha wan’t asked; she volunteered. Clark acted perplexed,and she offered her help. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/155 "2016-04-08T21:58:22Z")
Just breezing through to say how proud I am of this show that it didn’t wuss out on Nina. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2016, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/156 "2016-04-08T23:53:01Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > I don’t remember if he has been shown to know P&E, but I’m betting he could find out that plus a lot of other stuff while working at the rezidentura. I think Oleg could possibly be flipped if he finds out about Nina. Working as a double agent is very tricky, though, as Nina discovered too late (twice if you count her sneaking the note). Nina’s mistake was feeling guilty after she was sworn into the KGB and confessing to Arkady. > [@Sherrerd](#): > > …By the way, I’m not clear on this: Oleg’s father, while promising to ‘do something’ to help Nina, _did_ order her death, right? Was that the implication (even if not spelled out)? IIRC Oleg’s father is the Minister of Railways; he’s very high up in the nomenklatura, but I doubt he has enough power to either get Nina off or order her death even if he wanted too. She’s already been tried, convicted, & sentenced to death. I think the most he could would be to use his contacts to find out exactly what happened to her. Him promising to do something to help Nina was just an empty promise. > [@Chefguy](#): > > Perhaps instead of the Oleg flipping scenario, Oleg will take out a personal vendetta against Stan, and he pops Stan just when he is about to blow the whistle on Martha, thus ensuring their safety and another season. He’d probably get the Order of Lenin for that. ---
**Author:** ![Drum\_God](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drum_god/32/44_2.png) [@Drum\_God](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drum_God)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/157 "2016-04-09T02:56:22Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > Agree on the first. Oleg is clearly not in the party’s pocket. > > On the second, I didn’t get that implication. I thought perhaps her fate was sealed and Oleg’s father either didn’t intervene or didn’t accomplish anything. But I can see your point, perhaps, that his father didn’t want Oleg to start making a fuss or step on the wrong toes, so he eliminated the problem, so to speak. Not sure. I thought Oleg’s dad was an asshole for making that kind of deal. Help Nina or don’t help her, but extracting an agreement from his son is asshole territory. So, now Oleg stays with his grieving parents, but everyone involved knows he doesn’t want to be there and is coerced. No point in that. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/158 "2016-04-09T04:08:32Z")
> [@Don\_Draper](#): > > I was thinking something different. I thought it was actually a little cruel and sadistic to go through the whole spiel and say “denied! Your execution will take place shortly.” Why did they bother doing that and give her the moment to panic and become afraid, rather than just simply shoot her in the back of the head when she was still confused and didn’t know what was going on? > > Nina’s death was inevitable. This is simply NOT the show that would allow for a last-minute startling reprieve and let her escape. There was just no other way out for her character, but yeah…I was still shocked and stunned by that final scene. > > Right up until that scene, I was thinking Martha’s monologue on her ‘date’ was the saddest thing this show had ever done. Poor, poor Martha. “He’s married” (which is closer to the truth than she even knows) “there are no illusions…it’s not like I’m putting on a wig and sneaking into a hotel room…” > > If any character can make it out of this alive, I’d like it to be Martha – but after this episode, I am not counting on that. (Yeah, I’d like to see Philip & Elizabeth and their kids get away…but I’ve never imagined that happening.) I had thought of the same thing, that it would spare her even more grief to just shoot her without telling her she would be executed. But I think there’s an idea that it’s wrong, dishonorable, to execute someone without delivering the verdict to them. Think of how in our system we make the defendant rise to hear the verdict, for instance. Alan Sepinwall said he assumes the show will end badly for the Jennings family. But that doesn’t seem so obvious to me. > [@Sherrerd](#): > > By the way, I’m not clear on this: Oleg’s father, while promising to ‘do something’ to help Nina, _did_ order her death, right? Was that the implication (even if not spelled out)? I didn’t take it that way, but you could be right. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/159 "2016-04-09T04:16:34Z")
No. Oleg’s dad is a big shot, but he’s something like the Soviet equivalent of Sec’y of Transportation. He could have made some calls or something on Nina’s behalf, but I think it would be with no certainty of success and might have gotten _him_ called on the carpet. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496/160 "2016-04-15T02:32:24Z")
No comments yet. Looks like Martha is going away, dead or alive. Perhaps she’ll OD on her valium? Oleg looks like he may cross the line, as he’s becoming disillusioned with the Soviet government. The death of his brother may have tipped him over. Oh, and very hot scene between real-life lovers Phillip and Liz. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-americans-season-4/744496.md?page=9)