# The Anti-Virus is worse than the damn Virus!! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 11, 2004, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233 "2004-12-11T00:56:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/21 "2004-12-11T06:41:19Z")
What is this “anti-virus software” you all are speaking of? ---
**Author:** ![Talon\_Karrde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Talon\_Karrde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Talon_Karrde)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/22 "2004-12-11T06:57:03Z")
> [@Eve](#): > > See, now I’m picturing Jackie Gleason saying this . . . 😃 I usually don’t laugh out loud from what I read online, but that did it. ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/23 "2004-12-11T11:24:28Z")
> [@](#): > > Apparently, I’m the only person on the earth who uses McAfee w/o major problems. I’m running the Security Center for virus protection, but I don’t use the firewall. I have Zone Alarm for that. No, you’re not the only one. Like you, I don’t use the firewall; I also use Zone Alarm. I haven’t had any problems with McAfee, or at least none that I know about. ---
**Author:** ![look\_ninjas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b2d939/32.png) [@look\_ninjas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/look_ninjas)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/24 "2004-12-11T13:59:23Z")
> [@minor7flat5](#): > > I have another free one installed on a different machine: [Avast](http://www.avast.com/) > It’s just as competent as AVG and it updates automatically. The only slightly unsettling thing is all of the pirate lingo that they scatter throughout their product. (Wouldn’t you be suspicious of anything calling home to “[jollyroger.blablah.com](http://jollyroger.blablah.com)”?) Yarr! I love Avast! The weird pirate nonsense just adds to the charm. My only gripe is that it only wants to update when I’m in the middle of something. Bad timing, good software. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Surb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ce73a5/32.png) [@The\_Surb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Surb)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/25 "2004-12-11T14:10:12Z")
McAfee sucks and Norton sucks. I vote for Grisoft AVG too. It won’t try to take over your computer AND you can get rid of it if you have to. Try, jusy TRY, to get rid of Norton or McAfee. AVG runs in the background and I have had no problems, even on my 433 mhz comp. The shitheads at McAfee and Norton can just fucking rot. ---
**Author:** ![Razishlyat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a183cd/32.png) [@Razishlyat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razishlyat)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/26 "2004-12-11T14:12:14Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Or better yet, drop that monstrosity and get [AVG](http://www.grisoft.com/us/us_index.php) . > The new free version just came out and it works great for me. AVG is awesome. It is so awesome it is one of the few products I’ve actually bought the “professional” version of (it has nice e-mail scanning, both incoming and outgoing). I also took their advice and coupled it with Kerio Personal Firewall, which can also work for free, and provides pretty good protection (in fact, the protection is so good, the first few weeks with it are pretty annoying, as you have to approve programs requesting net connections or launching other programs - at least, if you have those settings on). Plus, neither is a resource-hog like Norton products are. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/27 "2004-12-11T14:45:52Z")
> [@The Surb](#): > > McAfee sucks and Norton sucks. I vote for Grisoft AVG too. It won’t try to take over your computer AND you can get rid of it if you have to. > Try, jusy TRY, to get rid of Norton or McAfee. Uh-oh. So, if I have Norton (which I don’t even know if I do or not!!) and try to install AVG, will the two of them battle to the death, reduding my laptop to a lump of smoldering plastic? ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/28 "2004-12-11T15:00:20Z")
On the other hand, as I reported in GQ a while ago, you can have too much of a good thing: whenever MS Word, Word Perfect, or Excel tried to open a file on my boss’s computer, Symantec HellWare insisted on doing a three-minute virus scan of the file created and stored and revised on his hard drive . Every. single. time. Their helpful Help file told you new and better ways to protect yourself against viruses, but not how to eliminate this bit of silliness. Being cheap, I didn’t want to pay significant money to ask SlimeAntics Customized Serpents how to make their program work like any reasonable person would expect it to work on installation (it came OEM) – protect against files sent from elsewhere, not against your own locally stored files. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/29 "2004-12-11T15:54:19Z")
> [@Eve](#): > > Uh-oh. So, if I have Norton (which I don’t even know if I do or not!!) and try to install AVG, will the two of them battle to the death, reduding my laptop to a lump of smoldering plastic? Possibly. [Here’s](http://www.cit.cornell.edu/helpdesk/win/nav/uninstallnav.html) the uninstall instructions for removing Norton. Backup the registry and set a Restore point (I’m assuming you’re on a Windows system) BEFORE you do this. That way, if things go horribly awry, you’ll be able to try again. ---
**Author:** ![Bren\_Cameron\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@Bren\_Cameron\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bren_Cameron_1)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/30 "2004-12-11T16:06:57Z")
> [@look!ninjas](#): > > Yarr! I love Avast! The weird pirate nonsense just adds to the charm. My only gripe is that it only wants to update when I’m in the middle of something. Bad timing, good software. Another happy Avast user here. It scans email as it comes in, it runs in the background, it doesn’t seem to take a really, really long time to open files. I did try AVG on the recommendation of folks here, and found it made my startup take about three days, and opening files seemed to take an hour or two. It’s probably something about my system, because lots of other people like it a lot, but if you try AVG and it gives you a headache, Avast is very nice too, and just as free. Sometimes the update is annoying while I’m trying to search the web, or doing something else, but that’s pretty minor and doesn’t last long. And for some reason, my kids love that “Virus Database has been updated!” announcement. ---
**Author:** ![Daizy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@Daizy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Daizy)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/31 "2004-12-11T16:33:12Z")
Norton has a nasty habit of throwing it’s software all over your computer. So, after an uninstall, you’ve still got bits and pieces left. It’s a good idea to run [the rnav removal tool](http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/nav.nsf/df0a595864594c86852567ac0063608c/33497f6e8a319ece88256ace0076cc02?OpenDocument&src=bar_sch_nam) and/or the [rnisupg tool](http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/nip.nsf/docid/2001090510510636?Open&src=bar_sch_nam&docid=2001040517150948&nsf=ent-security.nsf&view=d4c5e22498a8619f88256b6c000ba435&dtype=&prod=&ver=&osv=&osv_lvl=), once you’ve used add/remove in the control panel to uninstall. **Eve** , I too, would highly recommend AVG. It’s a tiny little program, that does exactly what it is supposed to do. It’s as simple as downloading it to a folder, such as My Documents, double clicking to install it, then clicking on the update button to make sure you’ve got the current definitions installed. Easy Squeasy. Drop me a line if you want more detailed instructions. I’ve got a copy of the email I send out when people ask how to install it. ---
**Author:** ![Lynne\_kilii](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lynne\_kilii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynne_kilii)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/32 "2004-12-11T22:04:43Z")
I have received nothing but frustration from Norton and McAfee. While good programs which do a passable job of protecting against viruses, they are poorly compiled and a general headache. I, as well, recommend AVG Antivirus. Get the file for the free version [here](http://free.grisoft.com/softw/70free/setup/avg70free_296a409.exe). [Virus Bulletin](http://www.virusbtn.com/vb100/archives/products.xml) is a service that rates and periodically tests the miscellaneous virus programs. AVG scored low, which means that it has a higher possibility of generating “False Positives” (it looks like theres a virus when there isn’t) or missing a virus. My machine contracted a particularly nasty virus that AVG couldn’t catch. Once. I still use AVG. It is unobtrusive and has a feature called Resident Shield that actively protects. Best of all, it is well compiled, so once you install it, you don’t even have to look at it. And it’s free. The highest rated software out there is Eset’s Nod32. My roommate uses it (and I actually used it to clear out that one nasty virus), and has had no complaints. Apparently it is as unobtrusive as AVG, while being substantially more effective. The major con for Nod32 is price: $39 first time then $27.30 per year after that. Still paying for Norton? Consider switching to Nod32. I saw Avast! listed in the thread. It got nearly the same rating AVG did by the Virus Bulletin. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/33 "2004-12-11T23:14:14Z")
> [@Lynne\_kilii](#): > > The highest rated software out there is Eset’s Nod32. My roommate uses it (and I actually used it to clear out that one nasty virus), and has had no complaints. Apparently it is as unobtrusive as AVG, while being substantially more effective. The major con for Nod32 is price: $39 first time then $27.30 per year after that. OK, any opinions on that? I am going to print out this thread to show to Steve, our IT Boy at work, and ask for his input, too . . . ---
**Author:** ![Kuizelemartz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e19b73/32.png) [@Kuizelemartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kuizelemartz)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/34 "2004-12-12T01:51:46Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Or better yet, drop that monstrosity and get [AVG](http://www.grisoft.com/us/us_index.php) . > The new free version just came out and it works great for me. Thank you kind sir. I downloaded that last night and the program downloaded quickly and did a great job. It found 18 files that were infected. Cleaned them up like a charm. So far, my computer has quick locking up its normal 5 times a day. ---
**Author:** ![omni-not](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8dc957/32.png) [@omni-not](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/omni-not)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/35 "2004-12-12T02:39:37Z")
**Eve** , the following article will probably go a long ways in assuaging your fears with regard to viruses and such other evil concoctions, and to the software (in this case your beloved Norton) which is supposed to protect you from them. Enjoy. Munir Kotadia, ZDNet Australia November 15, 2004 URL: [http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/security/0,2000061744,39166688,00.htm](http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/security/0,2000061744,39166688,00.htm) commentary Has anybody had a good experience with Symantec’s Norton Antivirus? Whenever I have written about Symantec’s flagship consumer antivirus application, the response from readers is always the same. Hordes of Symantec’s customers write in complaining that Norton AntiVirus (NAV) sucks up their system resources, doesn’t clean their computer thoroughly and when they finally decide to ditch the program altogether, they first need to download a special un-installation tool from Symantec’s Web site. Readers have also said that Live Update is difficult to configure when not in administrator mode, which is rather ironic because when the user is logged in as an administrator the application’s script blocker is vulnerable to attack. The least Symantec’s customers should expect is real protection. Unfortunately, even that very basic requirement seems beyond the company’s development teams – and so the spin doctors and marketers are brought in to try and soften the blow. In October, when a researcher discovered a security vulnerability in NAV, Symantec initially denied the problem existed, then admitted that there was a problem but played down its severity. Finally the company admitted that NAV was vulnerable to attack and retracted its earlier statements – which the company admitted were factually incorrect. So the situation right now is that Norton AntiVirus 2005 – which costs more than AU$90 from Symantec’s Web site and is labelled “The world’s most trusted antivirus solution” – can be fooled by a simple script into turning off its auto-protect functionality and leaving the computer at a malicious user’s mercy. Last week, high-level executives from Symantec’s US headquarters said that the company was working on strengthening the product’s internal defence mechanisms to make it more resilient to such attacks. However, these improvements are unlikely to be seen until the next version, which will be Norton AntiVirus 2006 and released in six months time. Meanwhile, Symantec is hoping that a script kiddie will not find the exploit codes – which have already started circulating around the Web – and use them to launch an attack. Mark Kennedy, architect, product delivery and response, said last week that if a virus writer was to use the exploit code and create a worm, the company would have a signature written to protect customers “within hours”. “Anybody that had not been hit by it and had updated their signatures before the worm infected their machine would be fully protected from it,” said Kennedy. What Kennedy failed to point out is that worms can travel around the world in minutes, which doesn’t leave much time for Symantec to create the signature or NAV customers to download and install the update. Vincent Weafer, the senior director of Symantec’s Security Response team, said the reason why so many people complain about its product is that the company has such a large user base. “We are on far more machines than most other people so you are going to get a lot of feedback,” said Weafer. Unless Symantec brings its NAV product up to date, Weafer is unlikely to be able to make the same claim two years from now. There are already a number of antivirus applications on the market, such as Grisoft’s AVG, that are free to use and far less demanding of a computer’s resources. If Symantec really wants to reduce the number of people complaining about Norton AntiVirus, it should be improving the product rather than hiring spin doctors to try and cover up its flaws. Copyright © 2004 CNET Networks, Inc. All Rights Reserved. ZDNET is a registered service mark of CNET Networks, Inc. ZDNET Logo is a service mark of CNET NETWORKS, Inc. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/36 "2004-12-15T16:12:20Z")
Neither my techie brother-in-law nor our IT Boy at work has ever heard of AVG, which makes me a little nervous: how well-established are they? I’m going to forward the AVG link to our IT Boy, he’s curious. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/37 "2004-12-15T16:22:09Z")
If I follow **Mr. Blue Sky** and **Daizy** ’s advice and uninstall Norton, how do I up- (down-?) load AVG? Do they send me a disc, or do they do it from their end after I hit “I want this stuff,” or what? ---
**Author:** ![Daizy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@Daizy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Daizy)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/38 "2004-12-15T16:33:47Z")
Hi **Eve** Go here: [http://free.grisoft.com/doc/Get+AVG+FREE/lng/us/tpl/v5](http://free.grisoft.com/doc/Get+AVG+FREE/lng/us/tpl/v5) Scroll to the bottom of the page. Click on the download. (avg70free\_296a409.exe) When the dialogue box comes up…click save. (Put it in My Documents) Click save. (Let it download) Once it’s done downloading… Go back to My Documents, and find avg70free. Double click it. Click: Run Next Accept Accept Custom Next Next Next A dialogue may pop up asking if you want to make a directory. (Click yes) A dialogue box will come up. (This part you can choose to ignore. I do it, because I’ve found it to be a pain in the arse. Others just leave it set to the default settings) REMOVE the check marks beside: Email scanner Plug in for Microsoft Office Click next Click Finish Click Ok. Another dialogue box… Click next Click Check for updates (it probably will update…so click ok when it’s done) Click Next a bunch of times… until you get to the Continue button. Click Continue Click the X up in the top right hand corner to exit. The icon down by the clock should be red yellow black and green. Not a dull grey colour. Did it work??? ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/39 "2004-12-15T16:44:57Z")
I can’t do any of that till I get home tonight—and should I not do it at all till I am Norton-free? ---
**Author:** ![Daizy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@Daizy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Daizy)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233/40 "2004-12-15T16:49:35Z")
I’ve had second thoughts: Where I said: > [@](#): > > A dialogue box will come up. > (This part you can choose to ignore. I do it, because I’ve found it to be a pain in the arse. Others just leave it set to the default settings) > REMOVE the check marks beside: > Email scanner > Plug in for Microsoft Office Don’t remove the check marks. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-anti-virus-is-worse-than-the-damn-virus/279233.md?page=3)