# The argument "Republicans dangle Roe in front of their base but don't want to overturn" doesn't make sense **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 3, 2021, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040 "2021-09-03T07:38:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/41 "2021-09-04T12:24:48Z")
**Modding** : To all, this thread includes CRT (critical race theory). It is specifically mentioned in the OP. Please don’t flag the CRT part of this discussion as off-topic. Please note: > [@Velocity](#): > > religious stuff, critical race theory, LGBT, Antifa, illegal immigrants, feminism, etc ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/42 "2021-09-04T15:38:54Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > Will Texas Republicans suffer at the polls now that the people got what they wanted WRT abortion restrictions? My guess is that no, they won’t, and that Texas Republicans will comfortably keep their majority in the state legislature Probably, but is that because of the will of the voters, or because of the anti-voting laws and gerrymandering that they will do to keep themselves in power? ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/43 "2021-09-04T15:43:52Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Probably, but is that because of the will of the voters, or because of the anti-voting laws and gerrymandering that they will do to keep themselves in power? The way to determine that will be to look at the total number of votes for the Republican candidates rather than margins of victory or the vote count for the Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/44 "2021-09-04T17:22:16Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > antifa are more accuratley procom which is just as bad as what they are nominally and farcically fighting against. And you know what CRT means in the context of how Hari used it. And still, you show that you don’t know what CRT is about, you are still propping up the caricature of it. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/45 "2021-09-04T17:25:44Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Doesn’t keep me up at night. But they are problematic illiberal ideologies that are superficially appealing but corrosive to fundamental liberties. If I were a foreign adversary I’d make sure they were well funded. That doesn’t show a lot of imagination. If I was a foreign adversary, I’d attack America by siphoning illegal campaign funds to an incompetent moron to help him get elected President. Admittedly, that plan doesn’t take a lot of imagination either since 2016. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/46 "2021-09-04T17:49:42Z")
OP: you are looking at the wrong group. There are a very substantial number of college-educated, middle or upper class Republican women who are strongly pro-choice. However in the past they didn’t need to take this issue into consideration because of the Supreme Court’s decisions. Now they need to vote Democratic if pro-choice is important to them. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/47 "2021-09-04T17:58:03Z")
Sure, the Republicans are going to lose a lot of votes over this. Not all their voters are pro-life. But I’m just disputing the notion that if Republicans fed prolifers the abortion-ban carrot that they’ve craved, that they would no longer have a reason to support Republicans. They’d still have 99 other reasons to vote Republican. (Well, most of them.) That claim - which I’ve heard a lot before - makes as little sense as saying that if gay people were given gay marriage, they’d no longer need to support Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/48 "2021-09-04T18:33:45Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > But I’m just disputing the notion that if Republicans fed prolifers the abortion-ban carrot that they’ve craved, that they would no longer have a reason to support Republicans. They’d still have 99 other reasons to vote Republican. (Well, most of them.) That claim - which I’ve heard a lot before - makes as little sense as saying that if gay people were given gay marriage, they’d no longer need to support Democrats. Your assumption seems to be that these voters are fundamentally conservative and being pro-life is just an added reason for them voting Republican. I don’t feel this is true. I feel a lot of pro-life voters are fundamentally moderate or liberal and are only voting for Republicans because of the single issue of abortion. They don’t have ninety-nine other reasons to vote Republican; they only have one reason. And the leaders of the Republican party know this and are never going to eliminate that reason. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/49 "2021-09-04T18:47:53Z")
Divide and conquer is ancient and effective. Imaginative is overrated. Exacerbating tribal differences and promoting ideologies such as CRT and groups such as the farcically named antifa that are at their core illiberal yet superficially appealing is good great power strategy. It weakens us and empowers our less clownish strategic rivals. Now, with regards to whether a particular policy will shift large amounts of voters is hard to say now that a large segment of the populace have strong antipathy to each party. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/50 "2021-09-04T18:49:36Z")
That accounts for gerrymandering, but not the effects of anti-voting legislation. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/51 "2021-09-04T18:57:19Z")
The anti-voting legislation shouldn’t increase Republican turnout. If anything, it would snag a few Republican voters in with the Democrats that they’re targeting. If the Republican candidates absolute number of votes doesn’t decrease, that would at least suggest that Republican voters aren’t staying home because they declared victory and got lazy. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/52 "2021-09-04T20:29:18Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > And still, you show that you don’t know what CRT is about, you are still propping up the caricature of it. Or fascism, given his recurring assertion that the only people that hate Nazis are communists. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/53 "2021-09-04T21:02:29Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Exacerbating tribal differences and promoting ideologies such as CRT At its core, CRT points at the tribal differences that white elites used to ensure that the unfair systemic racism that is still there remains, and maintains the unfairness going to this day. (CRT also studies the tribal unfair differences in Africa and Asia too, so once again, the view you depend on CRT is given to you in an incomplete way by the right wing media). The Orwellian thing is to declare that CRT noticing that unfairness and looking for ways to make things fair are **the** evil thing. The right-wingers that fall for that propaganda are in reality defending efforts to erase history and social justice. > **[Right-wing efforts to erase history do not change the facts | Minnesota...](https://spokesman-recorder.com/2021/07/23/right-wing-efforts-to-erase-history-do-not-change-the-facts/)** > > Blotting out history to protect reputations or to prevent perceived criticism of races may be a feel-good exercise for some but it blurs reality and leads to ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2021, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/54 "2021-09-04T21:08:39Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Your assumption seems to be that these voters are fundamentally conservative and being pro-life is just an added reason for them voting Republican. I don’t feel this is true. I feel a lot of pro-life voters are fundamentally moderate or liberal and are only voting for Republicans because of the single issue of abortion. Also, a significant chunk of the country is Catholic. We’re about equally divided between the parties, because the Republicans (at least purportedly) take the Catholic side on abortion, and the Democrats take the Catholic side on almost everything else. Right now, because of that split, the hierarchy of the Church doesn’t take a position on candidates, but take that away, and you’d have the Church officially endorsing the Democrat ever time. There are a lot of voters for whom that would carry a lot of weight. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2021, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/55 "2021-09-05T00:05:22Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > They don’t have ninety-nine other reasons to vote Republican; they only have one reason. My mother was a Republican and despised everything about Trump and the conservative leaders promoting him. I thought she was convinced that Hillary was the right choice. After the election I asked her about it and she said “I just couldn’t do it, Hillary is for abortion.” I imagine millions of others made that same decision in the voting booth. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2021, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/56 "2021-09-05T00:37:02Z")
Yes, but that reason wouldn’t go away if abortion were banned. If abortion were banned, then it’s still a powerful factor for prolifers. “Pro-choicers are trying to _ **bring back** _ abortion.” Even if abortion had been banned nationwide in, say, 2015, your mother would still have as much reason to vote against Hillary as she did in real life. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2021, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/57 "2021-09-05T00:38:44Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Divide and conquer is ancient and effective. Imaginative is overrated. Exacerbating tribal differences and promoting ideologies such as CRT and groups such as the farcically named antifa that are at their core illiberal yet superficially appealing is good great power strategy. It weakens us and empowers our less clownish strategic rivals. > > Now, with regards to whether a particular policy will shift large amounts of voters is hard to say now that a large segment of the populace have strong antipathy to each party. The reality is that CRT and antifa would be non-issues if the conservative media hadn’t need some trivial thing they could blow up into a CRISIS!!! So while it’s possible that foreign governments are involved in these things, the money is going to right wing websites and radio shows. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2021, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/58 "2021-09-05T01:48:04Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > A very small percentage of abortion rights opponents may have “punishing women” as a major objective. The vast majority seem sincerely misguided about protecting fetuses as human beings. Why not accept the divide for what it is, rather than making up sleazy motives to mischaracterize what the other side believes? Some anti-abortion voices do seem to be fairly uninterested in accepting the proposition that women are people: [https://www.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/archives/2019/03/01/florida-house-speaker-jose-oliva-called-pregnant-women-host-bodies-5-times-in-interview-on-anti-abortion-bill](https://www.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/archives/2019/03/01/florida-house-speaker-jose-oliva-called-pregnant-women-host-bodies-5-times-in-interview-on-anti-abortion-bill) Here’s a tweet with the video: > Of course you can argue that ‘not all who oppose abortion’ are using the term “host body” to refer to women…but you’d have trouble making the case that the general attitude this man displays is rare. ---
**Author:** ![SwissMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e79b87/32.png) [@SwissMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SwissMan)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2021, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/59 "2021-09-05T02:03:32Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Of course you can argue that ‘not all who oppose abortion’ are using the term “host body” to refer to women…but you’d have trouble making the case that the general attitude this man displays is rare. My standard go-to description for support by Republicans for any number of execrable positions: “it’s not everybody…but it’s far more than you would be comfortable admitting.” ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2021, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040/60 "2021-09-05T23:42:59Z")
> [@SwissMan](#): > > My standard go-to description for support by Republicans for any number of execrable positions: “it’s not everybody…but it’s far more than you would be comfortable admitting.” - A very safe assumption. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-argument-republicans-dangle-roe-in-front-of-their-base-but-dont-want-to-overturn-doesnt-make-sense/950040.md?page=4)