# The Banning of Starving Artist **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [October 1, 2018, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291 "2018-10-01T23:18:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Missy2U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@Missy2U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Missy2U)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/21 "2018-10-02T02:13:41Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > While he’s received relatively few warnings (just one in the last three years, and six total),[the latest one](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21236376&postcount=124) was particularly bad and indicative of a long history that we should have addressed long ago. > > Sometimes one is all it takes. Thank you, and thank you to the rest of the mods! ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/22 "2018-10-02T02:26:49Z")
If there’s anything to take away from the #metoo movement it’s not about the individual cases that make the news. It’s not about Les Moonvees or Jian Gomeshi or Bill O’Reilly or Harvey Weinstein or whomever is face-front this week. No, the main takeaway should be just how universal the experience in sexual assault, harassment and other types of intrusive experience appear to be. There’s been a real break in the wall of silence women participated in over the decades. It’s KellyAnne Conway admitted she’s been assaulted. It’s Sharon Stone just laughing long and loud when someone asks if she’d ever faced it when she was a star. It’s the basic assumption - apparently - among women that of course they’ve been subject to it. That’s the real indication that it’s real, it’s pervasive and that it needs to be respected. We elected to do so. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/23 "2018-10-02T02:29:16Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > While he’s received relatively few warnings (just one in the last three years, and six total),[the latest one](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21236376&postcount=124) was particularly bad and indicative of a long history that we should have addressed long ago. > > Sometimes one is all it takes. Good to know. Good call, FWIW coming from me. Think you guys made a tough call, but think it was the right one based on that. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/24 "2018-10-02T02:32:20Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > If there’s anything to take away from the #metoo movement it’s not about the individual cases that make the news. It’s not about Les Moonvees or Jian Gomeshi or Bill O’Reilly or Harvey Weinstein or whomever is face-front this week. > > No, the main takeaway should be just how universal the experience in sexual assault, harassment and other types of intrusive experience appear to be. There’s been a real break in the wall of silence women participated in over the decades. It’s KellyAnne Conway admitted she’s been assaulted. It’s Sharon Stone just laughing long and loud when someone asks if she’d ever faced it when she was a star. It’s the basic assumption - apparently - among women that of course they’ve been subject to it. > > That’s the real indication that it’s real, it’s pervasive and that it needs to be respected. We elected to do so. Agreed. Thanks for keeping us in the loop as to the why of the decision. Sometimes, we just want to know what you guys are thinking. Again, good call guys. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/25 "2018-10-02T02:37:46Z")
Thinking? Don’t give us too much credit. We’re a hive mind. Like ants. Individually? Don’t hope for much. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/26 "2018-10-02T02:38:52Z")
> [@Lucas\_Jackson](#): > > Some things you might want to consider… > > 1. This is not a democracy. > 2. This is a community. > 3. He was banned for breaking the first rule - don’t be a jerk. > > Thank you mods. Should have happened looong ago, imho. Many people have been jerks. I have been a jerk. Most long term posters here have been. If we banned everyone the first time they were jerk, we’d have no board. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/27 "2018-10-02T02:40:22Z")
Thank you for the explanation. I know these decisions aren’t taken lightly. I, for one, appreciate the thought given to the overall experience of the members of the board. **SA** seemed unwilling or unable to rein himself in of late. His investment in spreading hatred made this board a less welcoming place to be. **Mods** you made the right call. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/28 "2018-10-02T02:40:40Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > There are some other warnings that are interesting. Warnings given out to people who lost their cool when interacting with the jerk. I have one, and I’m sure other people could show theirs off as well. In many of his posts he was clearly playing “I’m not touching you!” provocation games, seeking an outcome where _the other side_ would either come unbalanced and drw the foul, or else walk away because it’s hopeless, to then claim the last word as having “won”. But as **Little Nemo** observes there was a spike in obnoxiousness in this final period, as if he had decided he would either help drive out the maximum people through offense or else immolate in martyrdom by Mod. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/29 "2018-10-02T02:41:36Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/30 "2018-10-02T02:43:02Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > While he’s received relatively few warnings (just one in the last three years, and six total),[the latest one](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21236376&postcount=124) was particularly bad and indicative of a long history that we should have addressed long ago. > > Sometimes one is all it takes. See, that’s all I asked- for there to have been warnings first. There was, and that’s fine, and good bye SA. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/31 "2018-10-02T02:43:33Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Many people have been jerks. I have been a jerk. > > Most long term posters here have been. > > If we banned everyone the first time they were jerk, we’d have no board. You think this was the first time? ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/32 "2018-10-02T02:45:10Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![expectopatronum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/expectopatronum/32/173_2.png) [@expectopatronum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/expectopatronum)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/33 "2018-10-02T02:47:24Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Many people have been jerks. I have been a jerk. > > Most long term posters here have been. > > If we banned everyone the first time they were jerk, we’d have no board. Seriously, why are you doing this? This was an outstanding set of decisions by the powers that be to resolve what has been a very ugly period of the board’s history. As I said above, don’t be a jerk is obviously going to be open to interpretation. We’ve all acted like jerks before. I certainly have, the way I shoot my mouth off sometimes, but being a jerk is not always a bannable offense. Why would you attempt to rules lawyer to death a decision which actively sends the message that the SDMB wants nothing to do with fostering or promoting rape culture, and wants no part of the sexist/misogynistic implications that comes along with all that? Can you possibly argue that this is not a good thing? Or, you know, you can get all butthurt about popularity contests blah blah cliques blah blah and go off and sulk in a corner. Look dude, I get it, I wasn’t part of the popular crowd in high school, but get therapy and deal with it and get over it already, jesus christ. on preview: I’m going to have to call BS on the fact that “all you wanted” was to see a list of his warnings. You were searching for ammo to further make your arguments, and have now made a tactical retreat seeing that the ammo is not forthcoming. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/34 "2018-10-02T02:56:38Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > Seriously, why are you doing this? > on preview: I’m going to have to call BS on the fact that “all you wanted” was to see a list of his warnings. You were searching for ammo to further make your arguments, and have now made a tactical retreat seeing that the ammo is not forthcoming. From my first post: _“However, maybe he does have a list of warnings, in which case- good riddance.”_ Then Bone gave us a link to a warning as said there were others, wereupon I said \*"See, that’s all I asked- for there to have been warnings first. There was, and that’s fine, and good bye SA."\* I have no idea of what you mean by “always do this” or why you are making this forum into a sounding board for personal attacks on me. I only wanted there to have been warnings first- there was, so that’s fine. **Done**. You have _never_ added anything to this board. ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/35 "2018-10-02T03:00:52Z")
**Moderator Note** DrDeth, expectopatronum, you have made your points. Stop the bickering now, please. ---
**Author:** ![expectopatronum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/expectopatronum/32/173_2.png) [@expectopatronum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/expectopatronum)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/36 "2018-10-02T03:05:58Z")
Sorry. Will do. May take further comments to the Pit at a later time. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/37 "2018-10-02T03:11:35Z")
Glad to see him gone. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/38 "2018-10-02T03:15:45Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Many people have been jerks. I have been a jerk. > > Most long term posters here have been. > > If we banned everyone the first time they were jerk, we’d have no board. Speak for yourself, pal. As far as I know, I’ve never been a jerk, nor have many other regular posters here. And **SA** was an aggressive, name-calling, impervious to others’ views, nasty jerk repeatedly, for years. I’m just surprised it took this long; he should have been deepsixed for his revolting conduct in the Paterno/Sandusky thread. Well done, mods. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/39 "2018-10-02T03:50:23Z")
I also think **Starving Artist** got a very generous pass for a very long time on what he acknowledged was his deliberately inflammatory posting style, which he tried to pitch as simple retaliation for what he claimed were gratuitous attacks on him. > [@Starving Artist](#): > > [I’m](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21228189&postcount=84) doing nothing more than what most of the posters to the board’s political threads do, only coming from the other end of the spectrum. I attack and complain about liberals in almost the exact same way that most of the board’s liberal posters attack and complain about conservatives and Republicans. […] > > [During](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20900309&postcount=308) phase 3, I finally became utterly and completely fed up with the tactics I’d been encountering for as long as I’d been here. It had long been nearly impossible to discuss any particular point or issue due to the endless amount of obfuscatory attempts at derailment. Bogus cite demands (demands for cites which could not possibly exist), squabbles over minor or secondary issues, etc., anything that could divert attention from the main point had long been the order of the day and I became fed up with it. So began phase 4. > > In phase 4, I’ve adopted the philosophy that I’ll simply state what I have to say forcefully and directly, without sugar-coating or attempts at tact, and in that way get my message out and make it clear to one and all just what the point is. This approach has been remarkably effective at cutting out all the dishonest obfuscatory bullshit that I had had to contend with here for years. And naturally it has angered a good many of its targets and made me a lot of enemies here on the board. To that I say, so what? It didn’t profit me in the slightest to be a nice and respectful guy or to attempt to discuss things in good faith then, so how am I any worse off now? > > As I’ve said before, assholism breeds assholsim. You guys don’t see it but I’m just a mirror image of you, and what you get from me is me going after liberals and liberalism in the same way you go after conservatives and conservatism.[…] > > [Once](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20899072&postcount=271) upon a time I earnestly tried to be polite here and I tried to have honest, sincere and reasoned discussions with people. The responses and the nature of them are the reason I post the way I do now. […] > > [Dishonest,](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20895989&postcount=188) lying sacks of shit like you are precisely the reason I post here the way I do. […] > > [As](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20881729&postcount=485) for my behavior here, it’s 50% because of the way the board’s [political] posters have treated me from my very first day here (when I was much less, shall we say, forthcoming, about my thoughts and foolishly tried to be polite and discussional), and 50% because of the ire it raises when I see the nonsense people here post about conservatives so I point out the harm they’ve done just so they know there’s a counterpoint and they’re not so wonderful after all. And also because it’s a lively way to pass the time when I don’t have anything else going on. 😃 And that’s just in his last few months of posting. If there is such a thing as “Dunning-Kruger troll syndrome”, I think that’s what **Starving Artist** had. He didn’t think of himself as a troll because he wasn’t actually **faking** his opinions to get a rise out of people. But he was such a substandard debater, in terms of logical consistency and coherence and so forth, that he embraced an argument style that was often effectively indistinguishable from trolling. That is, he’d make some sloppily extravagant claim that was either way too sweeping a generalization or directly contradicted by facts, or some combination of the two. And then when people challenged him on his sloppiness, he’d nitpick that their argument was invalid since he didn’t use the exact words they ascribed to him, or he was demonstrably correct about some individual detail of the big sloppy claim, and so forth. His _modus operandi_ was to get other posters so exasperated with him that they’d start making big sloppy claims and hurling angry insults themselves, which is the sort of discourse he was comfortable with. Where he was out of his depth was in fact-based analysis of an argument, so when he found himself in that sort of dispute he tried to goad the disputants back into big sloppy anger again. He kept insisting that he only fought that way because his opponents started it, but I think basically he was just covering up the fact that he didn’t really understand any other way to fight. I get how it could be argued that if **SA** was sincere in his opinions, and not cussing or insulting people in the wrong forum, then he shouldn’t be banned just for essentially being a shit debater, and certainly not just based on the content of his sincere opinions. After all, we’ve had many posters over the years who weren’t exactly rapier (no pun intended) wits. But I think there’s an argument to be made that if somebody is constantly blundering into fencing matches and punching the combatants until they get angry enough to start punching him back, you don’t give him a pass for that just because he’s no good at handling a sword. Someone who’s perpetually trying to turn a fencing match into a fistfight because he feels better equipped to handle fistfights is, effectively, trolling the fencers, no matter how sincere his feelings of antagonism may be. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2018, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291/40 "2018-10-02T03:59:55Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > … Not naming names but there’s another poster here I’m getting the same feeling from. Could you PM the person so that I’ll know if it’s me you’re thinking of? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-banning-of-starving-artist/822291.md?page=3)