# The Beacons of Minas Tirith **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 13, 2009, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950 "2009-09-13T20:51:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/61 "2009-09-17T22:54:39Z")
> [@Oy](#): > > Apollyon, apologies for seeming to put down NZ, if so I seemed to be doing. No, no, not at all… no offence taken nor apology needed. Just like everywhere else we sure have warts and flaws. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2009, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/62 "2009-09-18T00:52:37Z")
Since no one else has actually provided the relevant text: The first page of ROTK opens with Pippin waking up on Shadowfax during the long ride with Gandalf to Minas Tirith after he looked into the Orthanc Palantir. > [@](#): > > ‘What is that?’ cried Pippin suddenly, clutching at Gandalf’s cloak. ‘Look! Fire, red fire! Are there dragons in this land? Look, there is another!’ > > For answer, Gandalf cried aloud to his horse. ‘On, Shadowfax! We must hasten. Time is short. See! The beacons of Gondor are alight, calling for aid. War is kindled. See, there is the fire on Amon Din, and flame on Eilenach; and there they go speeding west: Nardol, Erelas, Min-Rimmon, Calenhad, and the Halifirien on the borders of Rohan.’ > > [paragraph omitted] > > Pippin became drowsy again and paid little attention to Gandalf telling him of the customs of Gondor, and how the Lord of the City had beacons built on the tops of outlying hills along both borders of the great range, and maintained posts at these points where fresh horses were always in readiness to bear his errand-riders to Rohan in the North, or to Belfalas in the South. ‘It is long since the beacons of the North were lit,’ he said; ‘and in the ancient days of Gondor they were not needed, for they had the Seven Stones.’ The frontispiece map in ROTK (the larger scale on showing just Gondor, the southeastern bit of Rohan, and the western portion of Mordor shows the named posts, and they are clearly on the edges of the White Mountains, not on any peaks. As they were also remount points for message riders, they would not be inconveniently placed. There’s a bit in _Unfinished Tales_ elaborating on Halifirien, which was in the days of the Kings a hallowed place established by Isildur after the War of the Last Alliance as a memorial to his father Elendil. Later it becomes the site at which the Oath of Eorl is sworn, marking the birth of Rohan. Its role as a beacon hill is only mentioned at the end, where it is said that even then the hilltop was a place of reverence. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2009, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/63 "2009-09-18T01:09:14Z")
Nicely done! ---
**Author:** ![Airk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de053/32.png) [@Airk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airk)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2009, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/64 "2009-09-18T13:57:46Z")
Huzzah! Thank you! Sorry. I just haven’t been thinking about this post when I had access to the book and vice versa. Sounds like: A) The beacons sure were _fast_. B) The reason we don’t get a better explanation of how they worked is because PIPPIN DOZED OFF. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2009, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/65 "2009-09-18T14:14:19Z")
> [@Airk](#): > > Sounds like: A) The beacons sure were _fast_. Technically, beacon information travels at the speed of light, after all. At least between any two beacon stations. You have to add in the time for seeing the last light and lighting the next to that, but that’s still negligible. ---
**Author:** ![Airk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de053/32.png) [@Airk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airk)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2009, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/66 "2009-09-18T14:38:59Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Technically, beacon information travels at the speed of light, after all. At least between any two beacon stations. You have to add in the time for seeing the last light and lighting the next to that, but that’s still negligible. Well, yes. Those were, rather, the factors I was considering, since earlier I was in a discussion about how quickly the beacons seemed to blaze up after being lit in the film. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2009, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/67 "2009-09-18T14:58:37Z")
> [@Airk](#): > > Well, yes. Those were, rather, the factors I was considering, since earlier I was in a discussion about how quickly the beacons seemed to blaze up after being lit in the film. 😛 :smack: Okay. ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2009, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/68 "2009-09-18T16:17:38Z")
> [@Apollyon](#): > > No, no, not at all… no offence taken nor apology needed. Just like everywhere else we sure have warts and flaws. But why did you appear to assume he was comparing NZ unfavaorably to everywhere else when it’s clear he wanted to avoid glossing over the poosibility that some racial tensions still exist in the one and only country we’re focusing on? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/69 "2009-10-19T16:07:52Z")
This guy, over Elendil’s right shoulder in the opening battle scene from FOTR, looks like he might be Maori, no?: [http://www.herr-der-ringe-film.de/v2/media/galerie/bilder05/elendil\_gondor.jpg](http://www.herr-der-ringe-film.de/v2/media/galerie/bilder05/elendil_gondor.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/70 "2009-10-20T03:53:23Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Technically, beacon information travels at the speed of light, after all. At least between any two beacon stations. You have to add in the time for seeing the last light and lighting the next to that, … Rapid data packet transmission, but poor router latency overhead. Gondor should have gone with a complete Cisco infrastructure, but Denethor must have been swayed by the Novell consultant in his grief. ---
**Author:** ![si\_blakely](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@si\_blakely](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/si_blakely)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950/71 "2009-10-20T10:03:21Z")
> [@Oy](#): > > It appears from half a world away that New Zealand now treasures its Maori heritage, but it wasn’t so long ago that there was a White New Zealand policy in force, controlling emigration. I seriously doubt that the New Zealand of today is _entirely_ devoid of racial tensions. I think Jackson was wise to overlook that particular Tolkien detail. Indeed, and Peter Jackson was as concerned to integrate elements of maori culture into the film, where they would fit. The initial battle scene vs Sauron where the Elves draw their weapons was consciously inspired by the maori taiaha (a wooden sword/spear/club) with a fluid movement style (it was absolutely obvious to this kiwi). Other fighting styles (other than the specifically medieval fighting styles also used) were also inspired to some degree by maori martial arts. Si [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-beacons-of-minas-tirith/509950.md?page=3)