# The Bells & Canons in the 1812 Overture **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 27, 2011, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454 "2011-05-27T17:53:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![HeyHomie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heyhomie/32/207_2.png) [@HeyHomie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HeyHomie)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2011, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/1 "2011-05-27T17:53:25Z")
Does the score call for a certain _sequence_ of bells (in the sense that a score would call for a sequence of piano notes, rather than the pianist banging on the keys randomly), or is the bell-ist just supposed to go nuts? Further - is it up to the guy manning the cannon to decide more or less when to hit it? Or does the score call for the cannon fire at specific points, in the same way it would call for any other notes on any other instruments? ---
**Author:** ![Greg\_Charles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/839c29/32.png) [@Greg\_Charles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greg_Charles)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2011, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/2 "2011-05-27T18:03:54Z")
Bells – yes, I’m pretty sure the bell part is written into the score Cannon – sadly when my jr. high band played it, they didn’t let us have a cannon. We had a bass drum instead, and again I think the booms must have been written into the score. I remember the guy who played it, and if it had been left solely to his discretion, there would have been booms from the first note to the last, or until someone wrestled the drumstick out of his hands. ---
**Author:** ![howye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9adbd/32.png) [@howye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/howye)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2011, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/3 "2011-05-27T18:31:33Z")
Bells - When but not what. In high school our director’s instructions to the band geek were that he could hit anything during those measures so long as it was not off key. Cannon - Same story as the bells, I believe. I think it was marked in the score when cannons were to go off. We also did not have cannons, but we did have an orchestra pit that concealed some friends of the orchestra and a chemistry teacher… and gas filled balloons. Made a very satisfying boom. ---
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2011, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/4 "2011-05-27T18:51:05Z")
You can download a PDF of the [full score](http://cantorion.org/music/708/1812_Overture_Full_score), if you like; it shows a staff for _canon_ and _cloches_ (cannon and bells). There are some instructions in Russian on that staff on the first page, but I don’t know what they say–possibly reading instructions, as the cannon and bell are separated later in the score. The bells are represented by a long series of whole notes, each followed by what I take as a flutter notation. I gather this signifies pealing the bells (swinging the whole bell to ring it), and was supposed to tell the hunchbacks to go nuts for the duration. This may be seen on page 59 of the PDF. The cannons are represented by half notes, as may be seen on page 67 of the PDF. That indicates pretty precise timing for artillery fire, and I understand that the cannons were originally supposed to be fired from a single electrical panel in order to get it right, but that planned performance didn’t go off (so to speak). I once observed a high school orchestra performing the piece. I don’t recall what they did for the bells, but for the cannons, they had kids firing shotguns into barrels of sand. ---
**Author:** ![Jumpbass](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jumpbass/32/147_2.png) [@Jumpbass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jumpbass)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2011, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/5 "2011-05-27T22:03:17Z")
When I was playing with the local community college wind ensemble, we passed out paper bags to the audience and let them blow up and pop them on cue from the director. Not exactly canons, but a hell of a lot of fun and noise. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2011, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/6 "2011-05-28T00:05:11Z")
[quote=“Balance, post:4, topic:583454”] YThe cannons are represented by half notes, as may be seen on page 67 of the PDF. That indicates pretty precise timing for artillery fire, and I understand that the cannons were originally supposed to be fired from a single electrical panel in order to get it right, but that planned performance didn’t go off (so to speak)./QUOTE]I heard the Philadelphia Orchestra perform it twice, with live canon (it was an outdoor concert). The first time, the cannon came on exactly the right point; it was impressive as hell. The second time, it was a little late, and didn’t have the same effect. To me, this means the score is designed so that the cannon has to be set off at a certain beat. ---
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2011, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/7 "2011-05-28T01:21:23Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > To me, this means the score is designed so that the cannon has to be set off at a certain beat. Yes, hence the half notes–sometimes they come in the first half of the measure, and in some measures, they come after a half rest. If my interpretation of the tempo is correct, that’s very tight timing; the entire measure may only last a couple of seconds. Being one second off would put the cannon shot at exactly the wrong point, and even being a half second off could have you several notes early or late in relation to the other instruments. In fact, looking at the score, it appears that many of the cannon shots are supposed to be fired at points that correspond to specific eighth notes or eighth rests. Being as little as a quarter second off might well be noticeable, especially when the shot is supposed to correspond to a rest for other instruments. ---
**Author:** ![Rocketeer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocketeer/32/4437_2.png) [@Rocketeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rocketeer)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2011, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/8 "2011-05-28T01:59:47Z")
> [@Balance](#): > > … I gather this signifies pealing the bells (swinging the whole bell to ring it), and was supposed to tell the hunchbacks to go nuts for the duration. This may be seen on page 59 of the PDF… Are the hunchbacks traditional too? Or can it be performed by a normal person if he stoops a bit? ---
**Author:** ![K364](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k364/32/5_2.png) [@K364](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/K364)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2011, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/9 "2011-05-28T03:44:38Z")
I’ve been at outdoor performances with real artillery… they weren’t even close to being on cue. It didn’t matter though - it was still exhilarating. ---
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2011, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/10 "2011-05-28T05:10:34Z")
> [@Balance](#): > > I once observed a high school orchestra performing the piece. I don’t recall what they did for the bells, but for the cannons, they had kids firing shotguns into barrels of sand. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2011, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-bells-canons-in-the-1812-overture/583454/11 "2011-05-28T11:39:00Z")
> [@Rocketeer](#): > > Are the hunchbacks traditional too? Only in Paris, I think.