# The best analysis of Barry Bonds I've ever read. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 5, 2004, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647 "2004-10-05T14:48:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2004, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/21 "2004-10-06T22:47:34Z")
> [@Trunk](#): > > Also, consider the fact that he started this tear in his late 30’s when most players are diminishing. I’m not going to do the per at bat math, but in pure numbers, Aaron himself hit more home runs in the five year period from ages 35-39 than in any other five year period in his career. ---
**Author:** ![rackensack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@rackensack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rackensack)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2004, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/22 "2004-10-06T23:58:43Z")
> [@This Year's Model](#): > > I’m not going to do the per at bat math, but in pure numbers, Aaron himself hit more home runs in the five year period from ages 35-39 than in any other five year period in his career. So I did it for you – and you’re absolutely right. Only 1957, 1962-3, and 1966 are even close to what Aaron did from 1969 through 1973: ```auto Year Ag HR HR/AB 1954 20 13 0.0278 1955 21 27 0.0449 1956 22 26 0.0427 1957 23 44 0.0715 1958 24 30 0.0499 1959 25 39 0.0620 1960 26 40 0.0678 1961 27 34 0.0564 1962 28 45 0.0760 1963 29 44 0.0697 1964 30 24 0.0421 1965 31 32 0.0561 1966 32 44 0.0730 1967 33 39 0.0650 1968 34 29 0.0479 1969 35 44 0.0804 1970 36 38 0.0736 1971 37 47 0.0949 1972 38 34 0.0757 1973 39 40 0.1020 1974 40 20 0.0588 1975 41 12 0.0258 1976 42 10 0.0369 ``` ---
**Author:** ![rackensack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@rackensack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rackensack)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/23 "2004-10-07T00:08:10Z")
> [@rackensack](#): > > So I did it for you – and you’re absolutely right. Only 1957, 1962-3, and 1966 are even close to what Aaron did from 1969 through 1973 Another interesting tidbit I missed until after I posted that: from 1969 on, Aaron never had more strikeouts than walks in a season (except for 1976, when he was 42 years old and definitely done). Prior to that, he’d only had three seasons out of fifteen when he _didn’t_ have more strikeouts than walks – though he never had more than 100 Ks in a season, he came very close several times. Just to net it out: ```auto BB K Before 1969 866 991 1969 and after 536 392 ``` ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/24 "2004-10-07T00:10:08Z")
> [@rackensack](#): > > So I did it for you – and you’re absolutely right. Only 1957, 1962-3, and 1966 are even close to what Aaron did from 1969 through 1973: Good work. Still, I think Aaron’s increase looks less marked, and was followed by a sharp decline from age 39 to the end of his career. Bonds is sustaining or improving in HR/AB - 2004 was his best year except for '01. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/25 "2004-10-07T00:10:01Z")
> [@rackensack](#): > > So I did it for you… Cool, thanks. I’ve always thought that the comparisons of the numbers of home run hitters to Aaron at various points in their career was nonsense, due to the great finishing kick Aaron had. I never considered that someone would come along with an even greater finishing kick. ---
**Author:** ![rackensack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@rackensack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rackensack)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/26 "2004-10-07T01:47:25Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Still, I think Aaron’s increase looks less marked, and was followed by a sharp decline from age 39 to the end of his career. Bonds is sustaining or improving in HR/AB - 2004 was his best year except for '01. Yes, but players today are in far better shape than those 30 years ago (or at least a lot of them are, Barry in particular), and they have the ability to concentrate on baseball to the exclusion of everything else. Even someone like Hank Aaron had to work in the offseason in those days, whereas Barry has never had to have a job other than playing baseball. He’s able to spend the entire offseason working out, and his workouts are probably better designed for improving/maintaining important baseball skills than whatever jogging or tossing a medicine ball guys did 30 years ago. Anyway, Aaron continued to improve up until he was the age Barry is now – his 1973 season at 39 years old was also the best of his career in terms of HR/AB. And as I pointed out before, his plate discipline from age 35 - 39 was much better than during the earlier part of his career (not that it was bad before). The parallels with Barry are fairly striking when you begin to look closely. Aaron did decline sharply after that – but whether that’ll happen to Barry remains to be seen – I doubt it, for the reasons above. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/27 "2004-10-07T02:33:34Z")
> [@Who\_me?](#): > > But the only stat you mention that could relate to steriods is the Slugging %. As was said before, steriods will make you stronger, but they won’t help you hit the ball. The OBP comes from him being walked so damn much… Thats not true. The stronger you are the quicker a bat you have which means you hit more balls. I am not saying all of Bonds’ improvement is from steriods, its possible that he both took steriods and became a better hitter through practice. The fact still remains is that he got very large very quickly and is connected to a source of steriods in Balco. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/28 "2004-10-07T05:20:42Z")
You raise some good points there, **rackensack**. Still, Aaron was a big-time home run hitter for his whole career. Bonds wasn’t. Something changed dramatically beteen 2000 and 2001 for Bonds, and it reflects in his stats and his body. ---
**Author:** ![tim314](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim314/32/3468_2.png) [@tim314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim314)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/29 "2004-10-07T05:30:28Z")
Bonds may well be on steroids, but I don’t think there’s anyone else on earth who could put up the numbers he’s putting up, no matter what drugs they took. Heck, for all we know, it’s quite possible that most of the other superstar sluggers _are_ taking the same drugs as Bonds, and not coming close to his level of performance. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/30 "2004-10-07T07:33:58Z")
> [@tim314](#): > > Bonds may well be on steroids, but I don’t think there’s anyone else on earth who could put up the numbers he’s putting up, no matter what drugs they took. Heck, for all we know, it’s quite possible that most of the other superstar sluggers _are_ taking the same drugs as Bonds, and not coming close to his level of performance. That’s all true also, but I don’t see how it affects the issue… if everyone is cheating, it doesn’t make him less of a cheat. It’s very likely he IS naturally as good as, or better than, everybody else. If he’s using steroids to augment that, he remains a cheater. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2004, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/31 "2004-10-16T19:50:34Z")
[Report: Trainer says Bonds used steroids in '03](http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/baseball/mlb/10/16/bc.bbn.lgns.bondssteroids.r/index.html?cnn=yes) > [@](#): > > According to a report in the San Francisco Chronicle, Bonds’ personal weight trainer, Greg Anderson, claimed in a recorded conversation last year that the slugger used an undetectable performance-enhancing drug during the 2003 season. > > “The whole thing is, everything that I’ve been doing at this point, it’s all undetectable,” Anderson said in a recording provided to the newspaper. “See, the stuff I have, we created it, and you can’t buy it anywhere else but you can take it the day of [the test], pee, and it comes up perfect.” ---
**Author:** ![colour\_wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/edb3f5/32.png) [@colour\_wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colour_wolf)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2004, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/32 "2004-10-17T03:02:52Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > You raise some good points there, **rackensack**. Still, Aaron was a big-time home run hitter for his whole career. Bonds wasn’t. Something changed dramatically beteen 2000 and 2001 for Bonds, and it reflects in his stats and his body. Bonds has been in the top 5 in HR every year since 1990, with the exception of 1991, 1998, 1999. He was 9th in 1998 (1 more would have put him in a tie for 6th), hurt in 1998 (still only 2 HR out of the top ten), and just missed the top 10 by 1 in 1991. Bonds has clearly been a ‘big-time HR hitter’ his whole career. Granted, his numbers did jump from 2000 to 2001, but I tend to agree with what **rackensack** and **Suburban Plankton** have already said. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2004, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647/33 "2004-10-17T19:50:21Z")
To anyone who wonders why Barry Bonds isn’t loved, the answer lies as much in the things he DOES say as in the things he doesn’t say. It’s not just that he refuses to speak to the press- it’s that he says a lot of stupid, offensive things on the rare occasions when he DOES! Barry Bonds is not just a surly introvert who’d prefer not to deal with the public- he’s a bitter, angry black man who views EVERYTHING through a racial lens. Read over the Skip Bayless column the OP cites. Bonds obviously HATES Babe RUth (a man he never met) and speaks gleefully about erasing him from the record books. Now, IF Bonds had said similar things about Henry Aaron, I’d respect him. It would sound arrogant, but I respect ANYBODY who says “I want to be the best of all time. I want to hold every record. I want everyone to know I’m the best who ever played.” But Barry DOESN’T want to be the best ever- he just wants to be better than the most famous WHITE player! This is typical of how Barry thinks. Not long ago, when he was asked what kind of monument he envisioned be raised for him, he snapped back “There ain’t gonna be any monument for me. I’m black. They don’t put up monuments for black guys.” This idiot drives past a huge monument to Willie Mays on his way to work every day, but he STILL has the nerve (or sheer ignorance) to say that! He also rails frequently against the “white media” who he claims have treated him in an “un-Christian manner.” Now, fans and reporters have never loved Bonds, but neither have they ever failed to give him his due. He’s gotten all the MVP awards he deserved, and the fans have always voted him onto the All-Star team. So, Bonds CAN’T complain about the way the press or the fans have dealt with him. Even people who don’t like him have always given him the credit he’s earned for his accomplishments on the field. But there’s no law anybody has to like him. Indeed, he’s gone out of his way to make sure almost nobody does. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-best-analysis-of-barry-bonds-ive-ever-read/267647.md?page=1)