# The black guy dies first? (Potential Spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 1, 2004, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443 "2004-12-01T03:32:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![paulberserker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@paulberserker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/paulberserker)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/21 "2004-12-01T11:42:17Z")
Theres also LL Cool J in Deep Blue Sea - he makes it, but when the sharks start to ruin everyones shit he mentions to himself: “Ooh, I’m done! Brothers never make it out of situations like this! Not ever!” ---
**Author:** ![Scissorjack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c67d28/32.png) [@Scissorjack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scissorjack)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/22 "2004-12-01T11:46:55Z")
> [@paulberserker](#): > > Theres also LL Cool J in Deep Blue Sea - he makes it, but when the sharks start to ruin everyones shit he mentions to himself: > “Ooh, I’m done! Brothers never make it out of situations like this! Not ever!” See previous link/thread. ---
**Author:** ![paulberserker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@paulberserker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/paulberserker)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/23 "2004-12-01T12:16:32Z")
Sorry Dad. I got the quote in anyways. I looked for that I did. My post is my cite. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/24 "2004-12-01T13:30:28Z")
> [@blowero](#): > > Actually, I had heard that not about movies, but about Star Trek. IIRC, Eddie Murphy (or maybe Richard Pryor) used to do a routine about how there’s always a black guy that beams down in the landing party and gets killed right away. The aliens turn him into a cube, then Kirk says, “Analysis, Mr. Spock”, and Spock says, “The nigger’s a cube, sir.” Ironically, in that particular episode (“By Any Other Name”), the aliens demonstrate their power by turning _two_ crew members into cubes; a black guy and a white woman. The alien leader crushes one of the cubes and restores the other, and the black guy has survived. The two black cast members of _Predator_, Carl Weathers and Bill Duke, die within a few minutes of each other quite late in the film, and well after numerous generic South American bad guys get wasted, as well as Jesse Ventura. There are, at most, three characters of the original commando squad left when they buy it. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/25 "2004-12-01T13:47:43Z")
Actually, the first member of the Dirty Dozen to die was Trini Lopez, who was killed in the initial parachute drop. Jim Brown dies, but not until AFTER he’s killed Telly Savalas (the psychotic Maggot) himself. Charles Bronson was the only convict on the team to survive. ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/26 "2004-12-01T13:48:49Z")
> [@Askia](#): > > The characters portrayed by Omar Epps(?) and Jada Pinkett-Smith at the start of _Scream 2_. Wes Craven was almost certainly playing with the cliche we’re presently discussing, though. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/27 "2004-12-01T14:40:23Z")
I think the quote refers to the [sarcasm]good ol’ days[/sarcasm], like the 40s and 50s, where blacks commonly only had bit-parts. One of the bit-parts, of course, was being the team members who die. The comment doesn’t really mean the black guy dies first, it means the black characters are more expendable than the white characters. So, if you’re quoting movies from after the Civil Rights Act, and after the growing awareness and move towards racial equality, you’re not going to find meaningful examples. The STAR TREK episode quoted above was, IMHO, a clear and deliberate exception. Two crew members, a cute white girl and an average-looking black guy, and one of them dies. Killing off the white girl was, IMHO, a deliberate reversal of audience expectations. So, by the late 60s, we’re already moving past that concept that the black characters are expendable. ---
**Author:** ![vd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b19c9b/32.png) [@vd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vd)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/28 "2004-12-01T15:36:13Z")
> [@Nurobath](#): > > In Predator there were two black guys (Carl Weathers… Come to think of it, he didn’t even make it through _Happy Gilmore_ alive. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/29 "2004-12-01T15:40:50Z")
In _Predator_, it’s the two nerdy white guys who get it first. I think even the Predator realized that they were hardly trophy material, and dispatched them first just to get them out of the way. ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/30 "2004-12-01T16:07:39Z")
> [@vd](#): > > Come to think of it, he didn’t even make it through _Happy Gilmore_ alive. Come to think of it, he didn’t even make it through _Rocky IV_ alive. How many ways can he be killed? ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/31 "2004-12-01T16:47:20Z")
> [@Trunk](#): > > Come to think of it, he didn’t even make it through _Rocky IV_ alive. How many ways can he be killed? He did survive Action Jackson, but that may have killed his career. ---
**Author:** ![RogueRacer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7ab992/32.png) [@RogueRacer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RogueRacer)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/32 "2004-12-01T16:52:29Z")
Star Trek deaths weren’t about being white or black. They were about not having a name or wearing a red shirt on an away team. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/33 "2004-12-01T18:27:04Z")
IIRC Jim Brown is the first to get greased in “Ice Station Zebra”. Then there’s “South Park: Bigger, Longer, Uncut” in the Army’s Operation Get Behind the Darkies. ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/34 "2004-12-01T19:26:02Z")
> [@C K Dexter Haven](#): > > The STAR TREK episode quoted above was, IMHO, a clear and deliberate exception. Two crew members, a cute white girl and an average-looking black guy, and one of them dies. Killing off the white girl was, IMHO, a deliberate reversal of audience expectations. So, by the late 60s, we’re already moving past that concept that the black characters are expendable. The cultural enlightenment was somewhat spoiled when, after the guy is restored from cube form, Kirk kneels down sifting the powder of the girl with unrestrained anguish, the most ever seen by him when mourning the passing of an away team member. He usually just shrugs off the death of a red-shirt. So the implication here is that Dead Miniskirted Hottie == Grevious Irreconcilable Loss, while Dead Male Redshirt == Noble Sacrifice. ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/35 "2004-12-01T20:42:18Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > In _Aliens_ the first character we see die is Frost (Ricco Ross), who happens to be black. He’s set on fire by Dietrich’s flamethrower, falls down a stairwell and then is blown to pieces when the flames reach the bag of ammunition he was carrying. > > Yes, that brother sure is dead. To nitpick, he dropped the bag of ammunition before he fell over the railing. When it exploded, it killed Crowe, and moments later, we got to hear Wierzbowski get nibbled upon. Sgt. Apone, the other black guy, was then captured and we can safely presume he was killed in the thermonuclear explosion. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2004, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/36 "2004-12-01T22:28:45Z")
In one of the best episodes of original Trek, _The Galileo Seven_, there’s two white guys that get killed off with maybe one line of dialog between the two of them. The black guy has a much larger and more interesting role, and survives. ---
**Author:** ![edwino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@edwino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/edwino)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2004, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/37 "2004-12-02T03:10:49Z")
The example I always think about is Scatman Caruthers in \*The ---
**Author:** ![edwino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@edwino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/edwino)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2004, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/38 "2004-12-02T03:17:33Z")
Bastard. What key did I push to submit that automatically? Here’s the rest of the post. Shining. It is often the very interesting but small parts that get killed off. He is a perfect example of a really cool character who gets axed (literally). Also, in Night of the Living Dead, the black guy is the last guy killed. Here is a list: [http://www.feoamante.com/Movies/racial.html](http://www.feoamante.com/Movies/racial.html) ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2004, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/39 "2004-12-02T05:19:14Z")
I was going to cite the Scatman Crothers murder scene too, and man oh man did Pauline Kael rip into Kubrick for that one. She compared it to a dialogue in _Huckleberry Finn_ where Huck is telling the old lady about a steamboat disaster. “The boiler blowed up.” “Oh, my. Was anyone hurt?” “No, 'm. Killed a n\*\*\*\*r.” ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2004, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443/40 "2004-12-02T08:36:35Z")
> [@threeorange](#): > > I’m pretty sure the comedian in question was Franklin Ajaye. Figures. I guess I have a tendency to attribute any funny line to Pryor or Murphy. > [@](#): > > Bryan Ekers: > Ironically, in that particular episode (“By Any Other Name”), the aliens demonstrate their power by turning two crew members into cubes; a black guy and a white woman. The alien leader crushes one of the cubes and restores the other, and the black guy has survived. Yeah, I think he was using comedic license and sort of conflating several episodes. It wasn’t actually a cube, either. It was a dodecahedron or something. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-black-guy-dies-first-potential-spoilers/277443.md?page=3)