# The body armor in Troy sure did suck **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 11, 2006, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513 "2006-01-11T17:08:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Spiff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiff/32/9852_2.png) [@Spiff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiff)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/1 "2006-01-11T17:08:08Z")
Was it just me, or did anyone else notice that 100% of the pointy things (swords, spears, arrows, knives) directed toward some poor guy’s body armor in the film Troy always, always penetrated said armor? (Yeah, I know it’s last summer’s blockbuster, but I just finished watching the DVD last night.) Sure, a glancing blow from a sword was sometimes deflected, but EVERY arrow and spear pierced the armor as if it were not there. And usually, the swords and spears pierced the armor **twice** , when they came out the back of the poor guy. Both the Trojans and the Greeks had metal helmets, and most of the body armor looked like it had metal on it, perhaps on top of a leather base. But some of the warriors looked like they had full metal body armor, like a medieval knight might wear, and still it was ineffective. Does anyone know the composition of Greek/Trojan body armor? Was it really that bad? Or is Hollywood promoting historical inaccuracies? :eek: ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/2 "2006-01-11T18:40:14Z")
Well, first off, the “Greeks” who may or may not have attacked Troy in real life were actually Achaeans—barbarians by the standards of the time. Their armor likely consisted of mostly boiled leather, reenforced by boar’s teeth and such; royalty/nobility probably could afford bronze scales sewed to the leather. So the bronze breastplates rampant in the movie were likely unhistorical. However, a thing to remember about the Trojan War was that it was also fought with bronze weapons (assuming it was fought as in the legend). Bronze and leather armor was likely a lot more effective against bronze weapons than it would have been against later, iron and steel weapons. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/3 "2006-01-11T18:48:10Z")
Nobody would wear armor if it was completely ineffective – it’s _heavy_, it’s a major capital investment, it makes you sweat, it’s too hot in hot weather and too cold in cold weather. So you have to assume it did some good. But spear points penetrating armor loks cool, so onscreen Trojan armor is as effective as Star Wars Stormtrooper armor, which won’t even stop cute Ewoks’ weapons. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/4 "2006-01-11T18:52:53Z")
I thought you were going to say the armor in the movie Troy sucked because it all looked like rubber. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/5 "2006-01-11T18:54:23Z")
I blame Bush. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/6 "2006-01-11T18:54:58Z")
This is why I loved The Two Towers. Theoden takes a spear to the chest and his armor stops it. ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/7 "2006-01-11T18:59:12Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > This is why I loved The Two Towers. Theoden takes a spear to the chest and his armor stops it. Frodo takes one to the gut. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/8 "2006-01-11T19:32:15Z")
> [@Trunk](#): > > Frodo takes one to the gut. Yet he acts like he just got a mortal wound and lies motionless on the ground… then waits until the battle is over and Strider turns him over before he lets anyone know he is allright… Man either Frodo is an asshole coward… or Peter Jackson has some hack-ish tendencies. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/9 "2006-01-11T19:36:15Z")
Since I actually did a class and wrote my term paper on this very subject, I’ll happily go on at length. I won’t actually do so, but I’d be happy to. Most armor from that period didn’t survive, because it was biodegradable. Plus, most of the people who got nice graves that we could dig up were wealthy and had metal goods. Their metal armor was pretyt good. It was very thick and extremely sturdy. It was also primarily chariot gear. Some of this stuff was so thick it was not possible to carry it and fight effectively, so you rode a chariot and stabbed people with pointy things. That said, the armor they had was moderately effective, because their metallurgy, more or less, moderately sucked. This isn’t to say they couldn’t kill you, but armor was defintiely a good thing. Bronze Armor is fine; bronze weapons are just bad. Plus, they used rivets to hold the blades on their swords - and I would guess those broke quite often. But it was certainly possible to fo right through the armor, especially if you hit them dead on with a pointy object. That would use the blades or spearheads as efficiently as possible (they used needle-like designs) and would slice through most leather. The armor would definitely help - but when have war movies ever been big on nonlethal wounds. Everyone either dies in seconds (minutes at the most) or lives. ---
**Author:** ![Spudo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbce88/32.png) [@Spudo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spudo)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/10 "2006-01-11T19:57:00Z")
> [@Push You Down](#): > > Yet he acts like he just got a mortal wound and lies motionless on the ground… then waits until the battle is over and Strider turns him over before he lets anyone know he is allright… Man either Frodo is an asshole coward… or Peter Jackson has some hack-ish tendencies. Well, the spear was being thrust by something five times his size, so even if the tip didn’t pierce him the force behind it would have hurt. He’s only a hobbit after all. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/11 "2006-01-11T20:04:43Z")
> [@Spudo](#): > > Well, the spear was being thrust by something five times his size, so even if the tip didn’t pierce him the force behind it would have hurt. He’s only a hobbit after all. Right so I’d expect him to be writhing on the ground in pain from the impact or atleast gasping for air… nope… lifeless… playing possum. MAybe he was knocked unconscious for a minute… I guess that’s possible… I think my main problem is the way it is played in the movie… it just felt manipulative. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/12 "2006-01-11T20:50:14Z")
> [@Push You Down](#): > > Right so I’d expect him to be writhing on the ground in pain from the impact or atleast gasping for air… nope… lifeless… playing possum. MAybe he was knocked unconscious for a minute… I guess that’s possible… I think my main problem is the way it is played in the movie… it just felt manipulative. It was manipulative. I was in the old cartoon, too. Still, if you want to put some logic into it, wouldn’t YOU play possum? You keep moving and he’s going to keep sticking you. Eventually he’ll probably just jab, you know, in the face or something. Or pick you up and twist your head off. -Joe, omniscient reader ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/13 "2006-01-11T21:22:21Z")
You have to remember, the ancient Achaens didn’t have our modern Army’s logistics department to make sure eeeevery last soldier had juuuust the armor he needed. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/14 "2006-01-11T21:53:05Z")
No cite, but I read once that Homeric warriors fought naked from the waist down. I don’t know why. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/15 "2006-01-11T22:03:04Z")
It eliminates chafing. This is important in a pre-baby powder civilization. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/16 "2006-01-11T22:21:07Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No cite, but I read once that Hom **o** er **ot** ic warriors fought naked from the waist down. I don’t know why. You left out some letters there. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/17 "2006-01-11T22:39:19Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > I blame Bush. 😉 Helen’s was something eh? It was not only her face that launched a thousand ships! d&r ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2006, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/18 "2006-01-11T22:46:36Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > It was manipulative. I was in the old cartoon, too. > > Still, if you want to put some logic into it, wouldn’t YOU play possum? You keep moving and he’s going to keep sticking you. Eventually he’ll probably just jab, you know, in the face or something. Or pick you up and twist your head off. > > -Joe, omniscient reader Wasn’t it also in the book? ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2006, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/19 "2006-01-12T03:43:54Z")
It’s one of the unfortunate conventions of cinema that body armor is purely decorative. We’ve seen countless scenes in which the bad guys (be they Star Wars stormtroopers, evil priest guards in _Conan_, or what have you) are wearing some sort of body armor and are attacked by the unarmored good guys – and get their asses handed to them. Armor seems to have no effect on likelihood of survival. Even in a movie like _Excalibur_ where armor is practically a fetish, its protective value is wildly variable, depending upon the momentary requirements of the plot. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2006, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513/20 "2006-01-12T04:17:12Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No cite, but I read once that Homeric warriors fought naked from the waist down. I don’t know why. Found the cite: [http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0801862299/qid=1137039384/sr=8-1/ref=sr\_8\_xs\_ap\_i1\_xgl14/103-0391155-1966269?n=507846&s=books&v=glance](http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0801862299/qid=1137039384/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/103-0391155-1966269?n=507846&s=books&v=glance) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-body-armor-in-troy-sure-did-suck/339513.md?page=2)