# The Boston bombers were on Public Assistance, do we have the right to their records. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 25, 2013, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644 "2013-04-25T05:08:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/41 "2013-04-27T03:39:35Z")
> [@bump](#): > > But it is my business. Ultimately that’s MY money that I paid in taxes, not your money, and as such, it’s entirely appropriate for me, and all the other taxpayers to know how you spend it, especially since it’s a public program, not a gift. > > If you don’t want people telling you how to spend their money, earn some of your own. Assuming that the program is running as it should, they are spending their money on things that are buyable with EBT money. If you don’t like what is allowable on EBT money, that’s not an issue for the recipients. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/42 "2013-04-27T03:44:05Z")
> [@bump](#): > > But it is my business. Ultimately that’s MY money that I paid in taxes, not your money, and as such, it’s entirely appropriate for me, and all the other taxpayers to know how you spend it, especially since it’s a public program, not a gift. > > If you don’t want people telling you how to spend their money, earn some of your own. ^THIS is the root of his opinion, I assume. ---
**Author:** ![Renee\_RL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7c8e57/32.png) [@Renee\_RL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renee_RL)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/43 "2013-04-27T15:04:59Z")
> [@bump](#): > > But it is my business. Ultimately that’s MY money that I paid in taxes, not your money, and as such, it’s entirely appropriate for me, and all the other taxpayers to know how you spend it, especially since it’s a public program, not a gift. > > If you don’t want people telling you how to spend their money, earn some of your own. This is why the Republicans cannot use the term “compassionate conservatives” anymore. The assumption that people needing food stamps don’t work is so negative and so demeaning to all those hard-working people who don’t make enough money to feed their families. These are the same people who will fight for billionaires to get more tax credits, but get all upset at somebody who’s trying to make ends meet. I guess it makes the little guy feel more powerful to know that there is somebody worse off and yet will kiss up to the people who exploit them like the Republican Party ---
**Author:** ![Renee\_RL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7c8e57/32.png) [@Renee\_RL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renee_RL)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/44 "2013-04-27T15:06:56Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I imagine any “right” to know will actually come down to the well-established right of the prosecuting entity, or the defense lawyers, to issue subpoenas, and to fight subpoenas, and to how the court that ends up trying the bomber rules on any such fight. IANAL, though. Why the prosecutors would bother to subpoena records like that is beyond me, though. Maybe one of our resident lawyers will weigh in. > > Can’t see how one or both of the suspects having received food stamps, or any other form of public assistance, is all that relevant. In the scheme of things, whether or not they diverted a few bucks from their intended purpose seems like pretty small potatoes. I am sure we have to know where they are getting their money from. That would be true for anyone who has committed such an atrocity. But what I chuckle at is everybody on the right has all this hindsight. There are thousands of people being watched…and it’s so easy after the fact ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/45 "2013-04-27T15:41:49Z")
> [@bump](#): > > But it is my business. Ultimately that’s MY money that I paid in taxes, not your money, and as such, it’s entirely appropriate for me, and all the other taxpayers to know how you spend it, especially since it’s a public program, not a gift. > > If you don’t want people telling you how to spend their money, earn some of your own. My money pays for the roads you use, would you be so kind to attach a gps to your car so I can track your whereabouts at all times, it’s my tax dollars being used to pay for those costly road repairs and I feel I have a right to know if your making unnecessary trips. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/46 "2013-04-27T15:44:22Z")
From the title, I thought this thread was about the Boston Light Bombers of WW2. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/47 "2013-04-27T15:57:04Z")
Count me as another one who has no idea why this is relevant. Where is the “action item” on this? Have everyone on food stamps investigated by the Department of Homeland Security to make absolutely sure that extra couple hundred a month isn’t going to Al Qaeda? Or is the line of thinking that if we shut down food stamps, we can finally beat radical Islam and end the war on terror? I really can’t figure out where this line of thinking is supposed to go. > [@bump](#): > > But it is my business. Ultimately that’s MY money that I paid in taxes, not your money, and as such, it’s entirely appropriate for me, and all the other taxpayers to know how you spend it, especially since it’s a public program, not a gift. > > If you don’t want people telling you how to spend their money, earn some of your own. Unless you are a major business or ultra-rich taxpayer, you are probably getting more out of your tax dollar than you pay in, so I think it’s only fair that we provide all of your personal information to Exon and Time-Warner, and let them make decisions about your children’s schooling, your community’s police and fire systems, etc. If you didn’t want them telling you how to spend your money, you’d earn your own, right? ---
**Author:** ![huck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@huck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/huck)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/48 "2013-04-27T19:49:55Z")
I don’t think whether a person receives food stamps should be public knowledge, and don’t see why committing a crime changes that. It also seems to me that compared to setting off bombs at the Boston Marathon and killing and injuring so many people, any food stamp irregularity is, um, not terribly significant. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/49 "2013-04-27T19:57:10Z")
> [@Prejteach2](#): > > Maybe those who send their kids to public schools should also have their records open for all to see (tongue in cheek) Don’t forget about the medical records of anybody on Medicaid or Medicare. And the student records of everyone who’s attended a public college. Or even a private college if they used government grants or subsidized loans. > [@Leaffan](#): > > I think I know how food stamps work, but I’m having much difficulty trying to figure out what records you’re talking about (food purchases?) and why it even matters at all in the first place. > > 😕 There’s also a bunch of personal information the applicant has to supply to social services so they can determine eligability and how much the benefit should be. And in case you’re wondering social services doesn’t actually keep a record of what each recipient purchased with his card; they see that he spend $X at [name of merchant] just like a credit card statement. It’s up to the actual store to keep copies of the reciepts and those only get pulled by the government as part of random audits or fraud investigations. ---
**Author:** ![Lochdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/edb3f5/32.png) [@Lochdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lochdale)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/50 "2013-04-27T21:42:37Z")
What’s the upside of knowing? Obviously it would be better if immigrants didn’t go on welfare but that’s not the issue. Of great import to me is what do we do with immigrants who commut crimes. My own view is that if you are not a citizen then you should be deported if you commit a felony that results in your spending a year or more in prison. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2013, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/51 "2013-04-27T22:26:04Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Can you turn cake batter into explosives? > > What could food stamps possibly buy to make bombs? You can’t even buy cookware (like a pressure cooker, for example) with them. Menthos and Diet Coke? ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2013, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/52 "2013-04-28T01:47:28Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > Assuming that the program is running as it should, they are spending their money on things that are buyable with EBT money. If you don’t like what is allowable on EBT money, that’s not an issue for the recipients. That’s fair. My point was that the EBT money isn’t _his_, it’s the taxpayers’ money, and taking that money does imply a certain intrusion into its expenditure, by the very fact that the government has essentially taken that money from me and given it to someone else. It’s only fair that I have visibility into how that money’s spent beyond “food stamps”. Maybe I’m more cynical than most, living in a part of Dallas where I see people spending food stamp money on the stupidest, least nutritious and frivolous things you can imagine that are allowable. A cart full of store-brand 2-liter sodas is something I’ve seen more than once. I don’t like the idea that my tax money is paying for some guy to drink Kroger-brand fruit punch- I don’t have an issue with it being used for food, but carbonated sodas is frivolous in my view. It’s not at all the same thing as using a highway, unless in some way, I don’t pay state taxes, I don’t pay fuel taxes, I don’t pay my registration, and I inordinately use the roads above and beyond other people. I kind of doubt that I get back more from my taxes than I pay in; I’m not a big consumer of government services, but I do pay a significant chunk in taxes to state, local and federal governments. All that said, I don’t know how the bombers’ public assistance records would be particularly useful; knowing that they were on public assistance would be one more thing to point toward how/why the older brother got radicalized, but that’s about it. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2013, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/53 "2013-04-28T04:09:02Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Maybe I’m more cynical than most, living in a part of Dallas where I see people spending food stamp money on the stupidest, least nutritious and frivolous things you can imagine that are allowable. A cart full of store-brand 2-liter sodas is something I’ve seen more than once. I don’t like the idea that my tax money is paying for some guy to drink Kroger-brand fruit punch- I don’t have an issue with it being used for food, but carbonated sodas is frivolous in my view. I won’t argue that sugared sodas and sugared punch is a healthful choice, especially for kids, but it is a way to get some calories for a lot less than the cost of orange juice and other more healthful options. I guess that comes back to the cost of the program versus what is allowed. ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2013, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/54 "2013-04-28T12:10:48Z")
> [@bump](#): > > That’s fair. My point was that the EBT money isn’t _his_, it’s the taxpayers’ money, and taking that money does imply a certain intrusion into its expenditure, by the very fact that the government has essentially taken that money from me and given it to someone else. It’s only fair that I have visibility into how that money’s spent beyond “food stamps”. Maybe I’m more cynical than most, living in a part of Dallas where I see people spending food stamp money on the stupidest, least nutritious and frivolous things you can imagine that are allowable. A cart full of store-brand 2-liter sodas is something I’ve seen more than once. I don’t like the idea that my tax money is paying for some guy to drink Kroger-brand fruit punch- I don’t have an issue with it being used for food, but carbonated sodas is frivolous in my view. So your bitch is money you pay in taxes might be being used for something you don’t approve of? Welcome to America. My taxes go to all types of things I don’t personally approve of but it’s stupid to get upset at the recipients take your rage out on your elected representatives not some guy too poor to afford his own food. > [@](#): > > It’s not at all the same thing as using a highway, unless in some way, I don’t pay state taxes, I don’t pay fuel taxes, I don’t pay my registration, and I inordinately use the roads above and beyond other people . It is the same thing unless you also believe that poor people pay zero taxes, which is wrong. They pay all sorts of daily taxes, almost always a higher percentage of their income than you would. > [@](#): > > I kind of doubt that I get back more from my taxes than I pay in; I’m not a big consumer of government services, but I do pay a significant chunk in taxes to state, local and federal governments. You consume a lot more government resources than you think you do. Having police, fire and military protection, clean air to breath and water to drink cost a lot of tax dollars. We collectively agree to pay for things for the society you and I enjoy, stop pretending like your holding it up on your own. ---
**Author:** ![Renee\_RL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7c8e57/32.png) [@Renee\_RL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renee_RL)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2013, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/55 "2013-04-28T13:24:47Z")
> [@bump](#): > > That’s fair. My point was that the EBT money isn’t _his_, it’s the taxpayers’ money, and taking that money does imply a certain intrusion into its expenditure, by the very fact that the government has essentially taken that money from me and given it to someone else. It’s only fair that I have visibility into how that money’s spent beyond “food stamps”. Maybe I’m more cynical than most, living in a part of Dallas where I see people spending food stamp money on the stupidest, least nutritious and frivolous things you can imagine that are allowable. A cart full of store-brand 2-liter sodas is something I’ve seen more than once. I don’t like the idea that my tax money is paying for some guy to drink Kroger-brand fruit punch- I don’t have an issue with it being used for food, but carbonated sodas is frivolous in my view. > > It’s not at all the same thing as using a highway, unless in some way, I don’t pay state taxes, I don’t pay fuel taxes, I don’t pay my registration, and I inordinately use the roads above and beyond other people. > > I kind of doubt that I get back more from my taxes than I pay in; I’m not a big consumer of government services, but I do pay a significant chunk in taxes to state, local and federal governments. > > All that said, I don’t know how the bombers’ public assistance records would be particularly useful; knowing that they were on public assistance would be one more thing to point toward how/why the older brother got radicalized, but that’s about it. How do you know the person is on food stamps? You have no idea because they don’t use food stamps anymore just a credit card. i did a workshop with daycare workers. And this was years ago where they actually used food stamps and the woman was telling me how humiliating it was when people like you would look at everything in her cart. One day she had some steak and a woman commented out loud" I can’t even buy steak". She turned around and said “we have rice and beans all week so we can have this steak”. I guess my question to you is why does it bother you. Since it bothers you that you give money to services you don’t use. I decided I am not going to pay school taxes anymore because I have no children in school. I don’t want to support national parks because I don’t get to them. Why should I pay for major highways that I don’t use? (Tongue in cheek) ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2013, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/56 "2013-04-28T18:14:03Z")
> [@bump](#): > > That’s fair. My point was that the EBT money isn’t _his_, it’s the taxpayers’ money, and taking that money does imply a certain intrusion into its expenditure, by the very fact that the government has essentially taken that money from me and given it to someone else. But it is “his.” Once the money\* is transferred, it’s his. My employer’s money is his (well, the corporation’s) in the same way that whatever money one or the other of the Tsarnaev brothers was the taxpayers’ money. Should they be able to access records of all my spending? Perhaps be able to review my credit card statements? \*The “money” the OP refers to seems to have been in the form of food stamps (or, more accurately, a voucher from the Supplemental Nutritional Assistance Program that can be used to purchase some food items). “EBT” is just the means of delivery for that voucher, and cannot be converted to cash (yes, I realize that some people will figure out ways to fiddle the system and squeeze some trivial amount of cash out of it). I think it’s important to note that the program is not just a form of public assistance, but also a price support program for agricultural products. It’s not just the poor who benefit from SNAP, but also agribusiness. That’s why, in its current incarnation, it’s part of the Federal Agriculture Improvement and Reform Act of 1996. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2013, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644/57 "2013-04-28T19:54:40Z")
Saintly-That’s precisely what I meant. I used “food stamps” because people are familiar with that term. BTW, I LOVE that it’s a credit card. because now people in line just assume I’m using my MasterCard. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-boston-bombers-were-on-public-assistance-do-we-have-the-right-to-their-records/656644.md?page=2)