# The Butterfly-In-a-Box Effect **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 9, 2014, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391 "2014-01-09T21:24:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/41 "2014-01-10T16:39:48Z")
I would ether send back a model glider, or a replica of the U.S.S. Constitution, the destination being Norway. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/42 "2014-01-10T16:40:37Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > No live(or formerly live) items, please. Remember: 2ft x 2ft x 2ft box. Does a virus count as “live”? Because my thought was to send Cowpox to North America. ---
**Author:** ![April\_R](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3da27b/32.png) [@April\_R](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/April_R)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/43 "2014-01-10T16:42:45Z")
Unwrapped of course ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/44 "2014-01-10T16:43:49Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > Does a virus count as “live”? Because my thought was to send Cowpox to North America. No go. ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/45 "2014-01-10T16:55:34Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > No live(or formerly live) items, please. So…a singing, dancing frog is out? Rats! ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/46 "2014-01-10T17:03:08Z")
> [@yellowjacketcoder](#): > > As far as what I would send back, my first thought was a suitcase nuke. Because some men just want to watch the world burn, I suppose. Or read about it a thousand years later, as the case may be. Does this time machine have the necessary government mandated paradox protections? I’m not going to send back an Uzi and have my great\*grandfather get shot, am I? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/47 "2014-01-10T17:07:51Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Or read about it a thousand years later, as the case may be. > > Does this time machine have the necessary government mandated paradox protections? I’m not going to send back an Uzi and have my great\*grandfather get shot, am I? If an Uzi fits in a 2ft x 2ft x 2ft box, it’s a go. In case of such a paradox, the event occurs but the original cause of the event(you) is wiped from history. ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/48 "2014-01-10T17:41:06Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Not allowed-read the OP. I did…did you? ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/49 "2014-01-10T17:58:41Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > A loaded revolver and box off cartridges. > > By accelerating the invention of the revolver by 500 years, many ripple effects will have certainly taken place by now. The thing is, the idea of a breech loader was around for hundreds of years before anyone managed to make one that was safe, effective, and comparable in cost to a muzzle loader. Everyone knew that breech loaders would be awesome, they just couldn’t manufacture the metals and machine them to the correct tolerances to build a gun that wouldn’t spray hot propellant gasses all over your face when you shot it. The concept of multiple barrels had been around for a long time, and as soon as breech loaders were able to be built revolvers got built very quickly, since a revolver is nothing more than a simple refinement of a multiple barrel system–you just rotate the chamber, and save the weight of multiple barrels and firing mechanisms. Improvements in firearms were much more the result of improved metallurgy and manufacturing techniques and smokeless propellants than they were new ideas for how to put guns together. The ideas invariably came long before people could build practical models of the weapons. Without smokeless powder and precision manufacturing and modern metals a 15th century Uzi is just going to get the operator killed. I think modern people forget that ideas for things invariably happen long before the actual invention gets made. The inventor isn’t the inventor of the idea, the inventor is the guy who figures out the manufacturing process for the invention, how to actually build it. And then the guy who figures out how to make the product easily and cheaply enough that it isn’t just a curiosity but a product that people will actually use. So take the problem of longitude for instance. Everyone knew that determining longitude could be done very simply if you could only have an accurate clock you could carry aboard a ship. But no one could make such a clock. And it’s all very well to send a [marine chronometer](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_chronometer)back to 1492, that instrument will remain a curiosity unless the people who get ahold of it can manufacture more copies. And this is not easy, in real life it took hundreds of engineers working on timepieces a hundred years before they could make economical clocks that actually worked. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/50 "2014-01-10T17:59:40Z")
> [@lost4life](#): > > I did…did you? Not explicitly stated as such in the OP…but corrected in post #40. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/51 "2014-01-10T18:02:51Z")
> [@NoClueBoy](#): > > A working scale model of a printing press … This, minus the type. Frankly, I’m shocked anything else is under consideration. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/52 "2014-01-10T18:07:00Z")
Minus the type and all you have is a screw-type wine press. It’s **interchangeable type** that was the revolution, not the press itself. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/53 "2014-01-10T18:11:51Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Minus the type and all you have is a screw-type wine press. It’s **interchangeable type** that was the revolution, not the press itself. If you left in blank interchangeable pieces, do you think they might figure it out? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/54 "2014-01-10T18:13:20Z")
Not one of the important parts, which was the method of manufacturing more type (basically, casting it in a mould.) ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/55 "2014-01-10T18:30:35Z")
> [@TimeWinder](#): > > To what intent? It’s a box that might have recognizable buttons on it, but even if they figured out how to point and shoot with it, eventually one of them would find the switch that opens the film compartment, and it’s extremely unlikely they’d do it in the dark. So they’d have ruined film, at best, and be no closer to understanding why you sent it. > > On the other hand, there’s some merit in just toying with them. So I’d send a smaller version of the time machine! A pre-loaded Polaroid Camera to maybe Greece. Although, I wish I could leave instruction to leave the exhausted polaroid pictures back in the time machine, so we could see what they ended up doing with the instant camera after figuring out what it did. Byzantine Selfies? ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/56 "2014-01-10T18:35:08Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Not explicitly stated as such in the OP…but corrected in post #40. Ah, so I should have read the post that came after mine to understand that I was wrong. Got it…what’s the point of this again? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/57 "2014-01-10T18:38:39Z")
> [@lost4life](#): > > Ah, so I should have read the post that came after mine to understand that I was wrong. Got it…what’s the point of this again? Have considered switching to decaf? It’s just a simple “what-if” scenario, dude-nobody is forcing you to play along with the premise. It’s not that you were technically wrong, it’s that you pointed out a loophole that I subsequently closed. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/58 "2014-01-10T18:39:59Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > A pre-loaded Polaroid Camera to maybe Greece. > > Although, I wish I could leave instruction to leave the exhausted polaroid pictures back in the time machine, so we could see what they ended up doing with the instant camera after figuring out what it did. Byzantine Selfies? Might they have a better chance of figuring out a simple box camera? ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/59 "2014-01-10T18:41:20Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > A lit stick of dynamite. Hilarity, of course! I LOL’d. Similarly a tiny thermonuclear device for even greater hilarity. To where? Who cares!? ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391/60 "2014-01-10T18:42:08Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If you left in blank interchangeable pieces, do you think they might figure it out? Yeah, that’s why I was saying I would have to really research who to send it to. I’m sure someone was probably thinking about such things before Gootie. That’s why I was also thinking a model of some industrial revolution (or just before) textile machine. Send it to China, maybe? To the Arabian Muslims? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-butterfly-in-a-box-effect/678391.md?page=4)