# The Canadian Election Thread. (Or maybe not...) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 21, 2011, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419 "2011-03-21T00:51:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 60
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2011, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1181 "2011-05-05T17:31:55Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > You can’t believe that just because a person is elected that they are qualified, can you? Really? > Note: I’m not saying she can’t do a good job, because I don’t know. Maybe she can. People surprise me every day, good and bad. Yes, that’s exactly what I believe. If you can vote (and don’t fall under any of these areas of the [Canada Elections Act](http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/E-2.01/page-27.html#h-31)), you’re eligible. If you get elected, you’re qualified. What your criteria? ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1182 "2011-05-06T00:09:11Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#): > > It will depend on the next 4 years. The impression I get is that the Conservatives are not perceived as being Québec-friendly. They actually lost votes and seats (and three ministers) in Quebec while winning this majority, so this will obviously be a challenge for them. Much earlier in this thread I mentioned the (unlikely) possibility of the Conservatives forming a majority government with the Bloc as Official Opposition if the Liberals really tanked. If we look at the current situation, _it’s actually not far from what happened_. > [@](#): > > There’s a worry that the NDP MPs might not be able to continue to represent Québec as strongly as the Bloc has; that’s Layton’s challenge, basically. This is a worry. You’re currently in Quebec – and I’m not – so you’ll know this better than I, but as I understand it Quebecers are as shocked as anyone else by the NDP wave and are wondering if it didn’t go too far. One of the professors in my department apparently _apologized_ for voting NDP and thereby contributing to the Bloc defeat in Sherbrooke. So I figure that everyone will be looking at Layton and his caucus and expect something to happen. And as **Sam Stone** pointed out, the NDP now has more than 50% of his MPs from Quebec, which will definitely change the party dynamics. This reminds me of the Social Credit, which was a small Western Canadian socially conservative party until 1962 when they suddenly exploded with 26 Quebec MPs (and four in BC and AB combined). The strain split the party in two. Of course the conditions are different: the Socreds didn’t _want_ to attract the Quebec vote (Layton has been courting it) and there were ideological differences between Quebec and Western Socreds. Will there be major ideological differences between NDP MPs from Quebec and from the other provinces? There might be. The NDP has a traditional base of blue-collar, unionized, somewhat conservative workers, while many of the new Quebec MPs appear to be university students in political science, and therefore perhaps comparable to _Québec solidaire_’s voting base: urban alter-globalists, feminists and other activists, with a certain amount of Quebec nationalism wrapped in terms of social justice. I know at least one NDP candidate (who’s presumably been elected) described himself as a sovereigntist, and among the francophone NDP MPs he’s probably not the only one with some sympathy for the option. Contrary to what English Canadians seem to believe, there isn’t a discrete choice between “federalist” and “separatist”; most people fall somewhere on the spectrum. > [@](#): > > If things go wrong - if Québec feels ignored/robbed/marginalized/etc over the next 4 years, it could mean a resurgence of sovereignist sentiment, or perhaps simply a backlash against the NDP…which could benefit the Liberals depending on how they rebuild. And there is of course the fact that many of those NDP MPs are rookies with no experience of electoral politics, and (even among those who were politically active before the election) some unrealistic expectations about the role they’ll be able to play. But this said, one thing is sure: some of them will be duds, but others will become important politicians in the future. There’s no other way. Many have compared the NDP caucus to Mulroney’s caucus in 1984. During the electoral night broadcast on Radio-Canada (which failed on me just as it was becoming interesting!) they mentioned the case of one Conservative MP, named Lopez or something like that, whom nobody knew anything about, and who completely mystified the interpreter when he first spoke in the Commons, because they couldn’t figure out if he was speaking French or English. But other rookies (they mentioned Benoît Bouchard as an example) were much more successful. So we’ll see; right now I cannot say much more than you. I’m not too sure if we’ll see the Liberals rise back to the level of major national party after this, though. I get the impression that they might reinvent themselves as a third party concentrated in a few regions. As for those who talked about Senate reform: it won’t happen. Harper was theoretically committed to it, as part of his Reformer background, but he’s figured out that it’s a political minefield because it raises constitutional concerns and questions of provincial sovereignty. And there’s nothing in it for Harper since he can just continue appointing Conservative senators. So forget about it. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1183 "2011-05-06T16:45:11Z")
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#): > > As for those who talked about Senate reform: it won’t happen. Harper was theoretically committed to it, as part of his Reformer background, but he’s figured out that it’s a political minefield because it raises constitutional concerns and questions of provincial sovereignty. And there’s nothing in it for Harper since he can just continue appointing Conservative senators. So forget about it. This is the problem with electoral reform in a nutshell; 1. It’s never to the benefit of the people who won the last election, and 2. You can’t do it without pissing someone off. Even if Harper and Layton were to work together on Senate reform - and I suspect Harper would still love to change it, but has been stacking it simply because he didn’t have any politically realistic alternatives - there’s no way they could devise a solution that wouldn’t open the Constitutional barrel of monkeys, and that wouldn’t piss off a huge number of their constituents. Even electoral riding reform is going to be a shitstorm. There remains the proposition to add seats to the House for Ontario, Alberta and B.C., whose voters have their votes substantially watered down by underrepresetation. (The riding of Brampton West has more people and voters than does Prince Edward Island, which has four ridings.) It’s the fair thing to do and it’s the right thing to do, but if they try it the shrieking from the Maritimes and Quebec will be unbelievable. Harper will risk losing fragile but seat-rich support down East and Layton will probably have no choice but to oppose it to keep his Quebec base happy. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1184 "2011-05-06T18:24:46Z")
The issue seems to be as good as (legally) dead: [ > [@](#): > > The Conservative Party will not contest New Democrat Ruth Ellen Brosseau’s victory in Berthier-Maskinongé, even though the local Tory candidate had called for a by-election over allegations of forged nomination signatures. > > Fred DeLorey, a spokesman for the Conservative Party, is categorically ruling out a court challenge over the issue. (snip) > > Elections Canada spokesman Diane Benson said in a statement that Ms. Brosseau remains the MP unless it is challenged and overturned by a court. > > “The result of the election is valid and stands unless a court rules otherwise. The recourse is to contest an election before a court,” she said Friday. (snip) > > One issue is that the law requires candidates to obtain 100 signatures, but Ms. Brosseau’s nomination papers carry 128 names. That suggests a court challenge might hinge on whether more than 28 names could be disqualified. ]([http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/tories-wont-challenge-election-of-absentee-new-democrat/article2012943/](http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/tories-wont-challenge-election-of-absentee-new-democrat/article2012943/)) ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1185 "2011-05-06T18:46:35Z")
Of course the Conservatives won’t contest it - if there was another election, they wouldn’t win it anyway. All it would do is remove a weak NDP MP and replace her with a better one. The fact that the NDP now has a bunch of inexperienced flakes and students in their caucus is good news for Conservatives. If the Liberals can be marginalized and the Conservatives and NDP become the major two parties, the Conservatives want the NDP to be as weak and unelectable as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1186 "2011-05-06T19:18:09Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Too bad Matt didn’t run. Would have been fun for him to become MattMCLMP. Application of Murphy’s Law: Matt runs for four straight [sic ;)] elections as NDP candidate in a Montreal suburb; the election where Quebec goes overwhelmingly NDP, he doesn’t run. Maybe we can get him in at a by-election? ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1187 "2011-05-06T20:01:24Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Even if Harper and Layton were to work together on Senate reform The NDP favours _abolishing_ the Senate. So no. > [@Polycarp](#): > > Application of Murphy’s Law: Matt runs for four straight [sic ;)] elections as NDP candidate in a Montreal suburb; the election where Quebec goes overwhelmingly NDP, he doesn’t run. I don’t think he was running last time around either. That might be the only consolation for him. Also he doesn’t seem to have posted since March 18 (though he’s visited the SDMB today), so I assume he’s just super-busy. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1188 "2011-05-06T20:06:13Z")
[The Liberal candidate is challenging her election:](http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/liberal-candidate-challenges-election-of-absentee-new-democrat/article2012943/) > [@](#): > > New Democrat MP Ruth Ellen Brosseau’s surprise victory in Berthier-Maskinongé is being challenged by the defeated Liberal candidate, who unveiled new allegations of irregularities Friday. > > Francine Gaudet said a formal complaint has been made with Elections Canada by a voter in the riding alleging there are at least 90 invalid signatures on the elected NDP candidate’s nomination papers. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1189 "2011-05-06T20:55:42Z")
The Liberal candidate likely would’ve done better to flag all this to the residents _before_ the election. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1190 "2011-05-06T22:46:02Z")
Now I’m confused as hell: [Libs, Tories protest controversial NDP MP’s win, but won’t challenge it in court > [@](#): > > Denis Coderre, a Liberal MP from Montreal, said six of the 11 pages of signatures for Brosseau did not contain her name, which was only added later by an Elections Canada official. > > Though the Liberals appear willing to contest the legitimacy of Brosseau’s election, Elections Canada made it clear Friday that only a court challenge could annul her victory. > > “The results of the election are valid unless a court decides otherwise,” Elections Canada said in a statement. > > During the campaign, each party has the chance to verify the signatures on each other’s nomination papers. > > The Liberals acknowledge they never bothered to do so for Brosseau because they felt she didn’t stand a realistic chance of winning. > > “We didn’t verify the NDP’s at the beginning because they weren’t in the running; it’s more Conservative and Bloc Quebecois,” said Sylvestre. ]([http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5jKSES69vHIn2cHHkZBMNXJ29nsnQ?docId=6779334](http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5jKSES69vHIn2cHHkZBMNXJ29nsnQ?docId=6779334)) ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1191 "2011-05-07T00:11:32Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > The fact that the NDP now has a bunch of inexperienced flakes and students in their caucus is good news for Conservatives. Could be a bad one if these flakes and students prove to be an effective opposition. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1192 "2011-05-07T02:37:25Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > The fact that the NDP now has a bunch of inexperienced flakes and students in their caucus is good news for Conservatives. Those inexperienced flakes have exactly the same potential to become usefull and competent members of Government as the inexperienced flakes of the Conservative Party not all that long ago. Or not. We shall see. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1193 "2011-05-07T02:49:26Z")
Young, earnest and eager is a potent weapon, assuming it’s pointing the right way of course. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1194 "2011-05-07T03:20:30Z")
> [@Grey](#): > > Young, earnest and eager is a potent weapon, assuming it’s pointing the right way of course. That’s what _she_ said! ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1195 "2011-05-07T03:23:16Z")
The young MPs now have several years to learn their trade before having to prepare for the next election. Gotta start somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1196 "2011-05-07T18:00:42Z")
Brosseau has surfaced, and stated that [she has never set foot in the riding](http://www.cyberpresse.ca/le-nouvelliste/actualites/201105/06/01-4397108-ruth-ellen-brosseau-sort-de-son-mutisme.php). > [@](#): > > Ruth Ellen Brosseau l’admet sans ambages: elle n’a jamais mis les pieds dans Berthier-Maskinongé. Et elle a bien l’intention de le faire au cours des prochains jours. > > «Je suis vraiment excitée à l’idée de me rendre dans la circonscription. On m’a dit que c’était une très belle région. Tout le monde a été tellement gentil depuis l’élection», explique celle qui dit avoir reçu beaucoup de courriels et de messages de soutien malgré la tempête médiatique au coeur de laquelle elle se retrouve. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1197 "2011-05-07T18:56:53Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Brosseau has surfaced, and stated that [she has never set foot in the riding](http://www.cyberpresse.ca/le-nouvelliste/actualites/201105/06/01-4397108-ruth-ellen-brosseau-sort-de-son-mutisme.php) > > > [@](#): > > > > Ruth Ellen Brosseau l’admet sans ambages: elle n’a jamais mis les pieds dans Berthier-Maskinongé. Et elle a bien l’intention de le faire au cours des prochains jours. > > > > «Je suis vraiment excitée à l’idée de me rendre dans la circonscription. On m’a dit que c’était une très belle région. Tout le monde a été tellement gentil depuis l’élection», explique celle qui dit avoir reçu beaucoup de courriels et de messages de soutien malgré la tempête médiatique au coeur de laquelle elle se retrouve. > > . Traduisez ceci en anglais, s’il vous plait. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1198 "2011-05-07T18:59:16Z")
Here, I’ve translated it: > [@](#): > > Ruth Ellen Brosseau l’ admits to the point: it n’ put forever feet in Berthier-Maskinongé. And it has l’ well; intention to do it during the next days. “I am really excited with l’ idea to return to me in the district. One m’ said that c’ was a very beautiful area. Everyone was so nice since l’ election”, that which explains says to have received many emails and messages of support in spite of the media storm in the middle which it is found. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1199 "2011-05-07T19:52:04Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > Traduisez ceci en anglais, s’il vous plait. Google it yourself if you don’t think my translated synopsis was correct. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419/1200 "2011-05-07T20:32:47Z")
And for those of you who are not yet familiar with Google: [http://translate.google.ca/translate\_t?rlz=1C1RNNN\_enCA372CA372&q=Ruth+Ellen+Brosseau+l'admet+sans+ambages:+elle+n'a+jamais+mis+les+pieds+dans+Berthier-Maskinongé.+Et+elle+a+bien+l'intention+de+le+faire+au+cours+des+prochains+jours. «Je+suis+vraiment+excitée+à+l'idée+de+me+rendre+dans+la+circonscription.+On+m'a+dit+que+c'était+une+très+belle+région.+Tout+le+monde+a+été+tellement+gentil+depuis+l'élection»,+explique+celle+qui+dit+avoir+reçu+beaucoup+de+courriels+et+de+messages+de+soutien+malgré+la+tempête+médiatique+au+coeur+de+laquelle+elle+se+retrouve.&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wT#](http://translate.google.ca/translate_t?rlz=1C1RNNN_enCA372CA372&q=Ruth+Ellen+Brosseau+l%27admet+sans+ambages:+elle+n%27a+jamais+mis+les+pieds+dans+Berthier-Maskinong%C3%A9.+Et+elle+a+bien+l%27intention+de+le+faire+au+cours+des+prochains+jours.%0A%0A%C2%ABJe+suis+vraiment+excit%C3%A9e+%C3%A0+l%27id%C3%A9e+de+me+rendre+dans+la+circonscription.+On+m%27a+dit+que+c%27%C3%A9tait+une+tr%C3%A8s+belle+r%C3%A9gion.+Tout+le+monde+a+%C3%A9t%C3%A9+tellement+gentil+depuis+l%27%C3%A9lection%C2%BB,+explique+celle+qui+dit+avoir+re%C3%A7u+beaucoup+de+courriels+et+de+messages+de+soutien+malgr%C3%A9+la+temp%C3%AAte+m%C3%A9diatique+au+coeur+de+laquelle+elle+se+retrouve.&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wT#) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419.md?page=59) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadian-election-thread-or-maybe-not/575419.md?page=61)