# The Canadope Café, 2014 Edition: In 3-D! **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 1, 2014, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612 "2014-01-01T05:07:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2014, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/101 "2014-01-07T19:24:55Z")
Well, here’s how the New York Times expressed it last September - [Silencing Scientists](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/22/opinion/sunday/silencing-scientists.html?_r=0). Not the sort of thing I like to see said about my country. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Doom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Dr\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Doom)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2014, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/102 "2014-01-07T19:53:12Z")
> [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](#): > > Well, here’s how the New York Times expressed it last September - [Silencing Scientists](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/22/opinion/sunday/silencing-scientists.html?_r=0). Not the sort of thing I like to see said about my country. Thank you for the link. I especially liked the article, because it was extremely short. I also liked the fact that it made assertions without a single quantitative noun. > [@](#): > > …the government of Canada — led by Stephen Harper — has made it harder and harder… How? > [@](#): > > …in 2008 when scientists… What scientists? > [@](#): > > Now the government is doing all it can… Such as…? > [@](#): > > Journalists find themselves unable… Which ones? > [@](#): > > …organized public protests. Any dates, details on these? > [@](#): > > The Harper policy… What policy? That is an inexcusable piece of journalism. I’d have an easy time arguing it is actually closer to fiction, than it is to journalism. Oh wait. I think I just did. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2014, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/103 "2014-01-07T20:03:25Z")
> [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](#): > > Well, here’s how the New York Times expressed it last September - [Silencing Scientists](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/22/opinion/sunday/silencing-scientists.html?_r=0). Not the sort of thing I like to see said about my country. That certainly sounds bad - but it is short of specifics. > [@](#): > > Now the government is doing all it can to monitor and restrict the flow of scientific information, especially concerning research into climate change, fisheries and anything to do with the Alberta tar sands — source of the diluted bitumen that would flow through the controversial Keystone XL pipeline. Journalists find themselves unable to reach government scientists; the scientists themselves have organized public protests. What exactly is being done to “restrict the flow of scientific information”? The implication is that scientists are precluded from talking to scientists; the only specific example of that is this: > [@](#): > > It began badly enough in 2008 when scientists working for Environment Canada, the federal agency, were told to refer all queries to departmental communications officers. This isn’t unusual for many large organizations - the firm I work for has a similar policy, designed to avoid corporate embarassment from “off the cuff” statements by senior employees made to the press. In that case at least, it isn’t an attempt to muzzle publication. It could of course be the case that the Conservatives are using the policy in such a manner as to muzzle scientists altogether. At least, that’s what appears to be the implications. > [@](#): > > Science is the gathering of hypotheses and the endless testing of them. It involves checking and double-checking, self-criticism and a willingness to overturn even fundamental assumptions if they prove to be wrong. But none of this can happen without open communication among scientists. This is more than an attack on academic freedom. Is the allegation that government scientists are, by virtue of the government’s policies, prohibited from conversing with other scientists, engaging in the scientific method, or publishing? If true, that would be bad. However, the article provides no details other than the “inquiries to the department officer” thing and unnamed “doing all it can”. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2014, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/104 "2014-01-07T22:15:15Z")
Will this Nature OpEd piece help? [Frozen out | Nature](http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v483/n7387/full/483006a.html) > [@](#): > > Over the same period, Canada has moved in the opposite direction. Since … 2006, there has been a gradual tightening of media protocols for federal scientists … Researchers who once would have felt comfortable responding freely and promptly to journalists are now required to direct inquiries to a media-relations office, which demands written questions in advance, and might not permit scientists to speak. Canadian journalists have documented several instances in which prominent researchers have been prevented from discussing published, peer-reviewed literature. Policy directives and e-mails obtained from the government through freedom of information reveal a confused and Byzantine approach to the press, prioritizing message control and showing little understanding of the importance of the free flow of scientific knowledge. The public service exists to serve the public and the government of the day. It is critical that the work they do be available to everyone. Otherwise the public can’t determine based on evidence the best policy direction. The Conservatives have done themselves no favours with climate change denial and the hint of creationism that runs through the party. Add in the long form census and these rumours of dumping historical data and you have fertile ground for people already wary to jump to the conclusion that it’s a intentional assault on public science and not what it likely is - unintentional bureaucratic responses to “cut costs”. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2014, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/105 "2014-01-07T22:41:10Z")
> [@Grey](#): > > Will this Nature OpEd piece help? [Frozen out | Nature](http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v483/n7387/full/483006a.html) > > The public service exists to serve the public and the government of the day. It is critical that the work they do be available to everyone. Otherwise the public can’t determine based on evidence the best policy direction. Yes, but that’s simply more detail concerning the point made in the first piece - that government scientists have to “vet” enquiries from journalists. There’s a reasonable debate about whether such protocols are necessary or justified, and it is a good point that the US has better and more open protocols. However, such procedures (for better or worse) are relatively common in business and government alike, and the allegation that having to funnel media inquiries through some sort of media relations office is, in and of itself, part of a ‘war on science’ is a bit of an exaggeration. Government scientists are scientists but they are also government employees, and it isn’t all that surprising that inquiries directed at them from journalists would be subject to some sort of government oversight - given that if the scientist screws up his or her answer to a reporter it is likely enough that an article could appear on the front page of the Globe saying “Government Scientist says [secrewed up answer]”, implying this is the government’s own position. As for the allegation that the policies are confusing and byzantine - well, that’s also not very surprising, for the Canadian federal government. How many of their policies could that _not_ be said of? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2014, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/106 "2014-01-07T23:10:33Z")
But the OpEd presents the current Canadian practice as markedly different from before. It compares the shift in the US to the shift in Canada implying they’ve effectively changed positions. Overall though I have no objections to public scientists prefacing statements with “Personally…”. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2014, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/107 "2014-01-08T00:08:05Z")
> [@Grey](#): > > But the OpEd presents the current Canadian practice as markedly different from before. It compares the shift in the US to the shift in Canada implying they’ve effectively changed positions. > > Overall though I have no objections to public scientists prefacing statements with “Personally…”. Neither do I - to my mind, that’s a good solution. What I suspect is happening (I don’t of course know) is simply that Canada is 5-10 years behind the trend in the US, which isn’t exactly an uncommon situation for Canada to be in. My suspicion is that Canada went from having no policies on the subject, and suffering problems with that, to instituting an ‘every enquiry must go to the media relations office’ policy. It is now encountering the problems with _that_. The next stage is (hopefully) a relaxation of the policy to the current US stance - that is, a policy where scientists (and others) must simply state when they are speaking on their own behalf or when they are not. The issue, though, is that simple institutional policies of this sort are being portrayed, without much in the way of proof, as evidence of a sinister conspiracy. Indeed, it isn’t even established that these policies originated with the elected political masters (though it would not surprise me) - Canada’s bureaucracy in many cases evolves policy on its own without input from above, and much continues without reference to who happens to be in power. If this is the case, it may ironically be an example of the very thing that the policy in question was designed to guard against, writ large - the party in government being blamed for the acts of the bureaucrats (that is, instituting the policy), just as the policy was intended (ostensibly) to prevent the government as a whole from being blamed for statements of individual scientists or other employees. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/108 "2014-01-09T16:34:47Z")
[Polar bear](http://www.blogto.com/city/2014/01/baby_polar_bear_takes_first_steps_at_toronto_zoo/) at the Toronto Zoo taking its first steps. For your daily intake of cuteness… ---
**Author:** ![Cyros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a698b9/32.png) [@Cyros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyros)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/109 "2014-01-09T17:16:46Z")
Could my sleepy little town become the next [international surfing mecca](http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/surfs-canada-small-brunswick-town-international-surfing-hotspot/story?id=21450094)? It is a nice chance to get some tourist dollars but New Brunswick will screw it up somehow. We just don’t seem to be able to market ourselves very well. Hell, I live within 90 minutes of some fantastic national parks and still pop over to PEI or Nova Scotia for my vacations. I think there may be a New Years resolution in there somewhere… ---
**Author:** ![Poysyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Poysyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poysyn)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/110 "2014-01-09T19:16:01Z")
> [@Cyros](#): > > Could my sleepy little town become the next [international surfing mecca](http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/surfs-canada-small-brunswick-town-international-surfing-hotspot/story?id=21450094)? It is a nice chance to get some tourist dollars but New Brunswick will screw it up somehow. We just don’t seem to be able to market ourselves very well. Hell, I live within 90 minutes of some fantastic national parks and still pop over to PEI or Nova Scotia for my vacations. I think there may be a New Years resolution in there somewhere… That would be REALLY cool. I love New Brunswick. ---
**Author:** ![Sparky812](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Sparky812](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparky812)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/111 "2014-01-09T19:33:56Z")
> [@Poysyn](#): > > That would be REALLY cool. I love New Brunswick. Anyone who has swum in the Bay will tell you it’s cool, it’s really effin COOL! :eek: 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/112 "2014-01-09T23:02:21Z")
> [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](#): > > [Polar bear](http://www.blogto.com/city/2014/01/baby_polar_bear_takes_first_steps_at_toronto_zoo/) at the Toronto Zoo taking its first steps. For your daily intake of cuteness… It is certainly that! Unsteady, unsure, but managing. Great little guy! ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/113 "2014-01-09T23:33:13Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > It is certainly that! Unsteady, unsure, but managing. Great little guy! It’s amazing how something so cute and innocent can’t grow up to trust humans. Apparently they don’t like us so much.☹ But cute, yeah! ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/114 "2014-01-10T13:07:25Z")
Oh, they like us all right - omnomnom… 🙂 It’s amazing to consider that something that starts out that helpless turns into the nine foot top predator we all know and love (and don’t want to see face to face). ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/115 "2014-01-10T22:38:24Z")
> [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](#): > > Well, here’s how the New York Times expressed it last September - [Silencing Scientists](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/22/opinion/sunday/silencing-scientists.html?_r=0). Not the sort of thing I like to see said about my country. For a little more on this [subject](http://scientistsfortherighttoknow.wildapricot.org/timeline), with refs, check out the list of things that this government is doing to sacrifice scientific research to the gods of the Almighty “Economy”. Knowledge is power, ignorance is bliss. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/116 "2014-01-11T04:09:30Z")
Yay! Another freezing rain \*event happening overnight tonight in the Ottawa valley. [George Carlin]\*Event! Shit, I hope I can get tickets to _that_![/GC] (Apologies if I’ve alrady used this one.) ---
**Author:** ![Cyros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a698b9/32.png) [@Cyros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyros)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/117 "2014-01-11T23:06:30Z")
We started the day with freezing rain but it switched to rain fairly quickly. I took my daughter to a travelling exhibit of Little Ray’s Reptile Zoo’s Dinosaurs! Past and present! It was better than I thought it would be. The best part was the Canadian Raptor Conservacy show. A harris hawk actually brushed the top of my head as it flew past. ---
**Author:** ![Sparky812](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Sparky812](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparky812)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2014, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/118 "2014-01-12T03:53:28Z")
It was a little crazy this morning on the way to the rink, I saw a couple of crews out replacing a few light standards. The main road are OK now but residential streets are solid ice now. My son is supposed to be having his hockey team over tomorrow for a game in the backyard but I don’t think it’s gonna get cold enough to freeze the puddles on it now. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2014, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/119 "2014-01-12T06:28:28Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Yay! Another freezing rain \*event happening overnight tonight in the Ottawa valley. > [George Carlin]\*Event! Shit, I hope I can get tickets to _that_![/GC] (Apologies if I’ve alrady used this one.) I often hear “Special Weather Statement” on The Weather Network - my response in my head is always, “Here’s my “special weather statement” - The weather is complete shit today!” ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2014, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612/120 "2014-01-13T16:14:40Z")
Hey Neil. I love you, man. But stick to making music, OK? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2014-edition-in-3-d/677612.md?page=7)