# The Canadope Café 2016: The North Awakens **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 1, 2016, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883 "2016-01-01T05:04:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 27
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/521 "2016-05-22T05:58:26Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Perspective, Uzi, perspective. You’re in conspiracy territory now. Let’s reign it back in. Like someone asserting that the NDP planned this? If, for the sake of argument that someone was going to attempt to prosecute the PM, you think that there would not be back channel attempts to thwart, hinder, or at the least question it?:dubious: My perspective is this. The PM should be held to a higher standard than you or I. They should set the example. Because if not them, then who? That doesn’t mean they need to be angels, btw. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/522 "2016-05-22T06:19:55Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > As previously stated: de minimus. That is a common law defence. Still doesn’t mean he didn’t commit an assault. That is the defence after the fact. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/523 "2016-05-22T06:42:24Z")
The NDP did not plan to have Trudeau assault the Conservative and elbow the NDP. Such an assertion lacks perspective. It appears to me that: The NDP was deliberately frustrating the House from taking a vote by blocking the Conservative Whip from walking on his side of the isle to his seat. Trudeau inappropriately usurped the Speaker’s role by crossing the floor and physically moving the Conservative Whip through the NDP blockade. This constituted assault, but de minimus applies, so crying assault lacks perspective. There was no intent to elbow the NDP MP soccer player, so crying assault not only lacks perspective but also is incorrect in law. All in all, the Speaker needs to keep a closer eye on shenanigans. Both Trudeau and the NDP should remember their place and the importance of decorum in the House. Shame on them. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/524 "2016-05-22T07:45:28Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > [INDENT]The NDP was deliberately frustrating the House from taking a vote by blocking the Conservative Whip from walking on his side of the isle to his seat. It might be worthwhile considering why they were delaying the vote and for how long. Delaying a vote that would limit debate, something that the Liberals derided the Conservatives over when they were in power. > [@](#): > > Trudeau inappropriately usurped the Speaker’s role by crossing the floor and physically moving the Conservative Whip through the NDP blockade. Agreed > [@](#): > > This constituted assault, but de minimus applies, so crying assault lacks perspective. de minimus does negate the assault it is a defence for it and that the court won’t consider charges. Saying it was an assault isn’t lacking perspective, it is stating the facts. > [@](#): > > There was no intent to elbow the NDP MP soccer player, so crying assault not only lacks perspective but also is incorrect in law. If during the commission of an assault someone else gets hurt, then does that add to the charges or severity? And who are you to say that she wasn’t actually hurt. Getting hit in the sternum can hurt. But it occurs to me to ask, does criminal law apply in the HOC? ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/525 "2016-05-22T07:52:59Z")
Yes, it does. [Parliamentary privilege is for some civil stuff, not criminal matters.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliamentary_privilege#In_Canada) ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/526 "2016-05-22T08:08:34Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > And who are you to say that she wasn’t actually hurt. Getting hit in the sternum can hurt. I’m a citizen with a right to responsible government, not buffoons playing don’t-touch-me/don’t-block-me. She chose to get physical by participating in the blockade, so she did not have clean hands. No sympathy from me for her getting accidentally bumped, whether it hurt her or not, just as there is no toleration by me for Trudeau also getting physical. As far my guessing that she was not hurt? Seventeen years of playing rugby, fourteen years coaching a twenty person breast cancer survivor canoe team, and having cracked a rib last week. She looks like a soccer player to me – all crocodile tears, playing to the audience for effect, rather than getting the job done as a Parliamentarian. Pathetic. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/527 "2016-05-22T08:47:38Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > No sympathy from me for her getting accidentally bumped, whether it hurt her or not, just as there is no toleration by me for Trudeau also getting physical. You do see the difference between the two actions, don’t you? > [@](#): > > As far my guessing that she was not hurt? Seventeen years of playing rugby, fourteen years coaching a twenty person breast cancer survivor canoe team, and having cracked a rib last week. She looks like a soccer player to me – all crocodile tears, playing to the audience for effect, rather than getting the job done as a Parliamentarian. Pathetic. Rugby players expect to get hit at work. Cancer patients, though it sucks, expect pain. Standing against a railing and getting elbowed in the ribs at your office job is something you don’t prepare for. And while I don’t disagree that she is playing for the cameras, her reaction could be as much the shock of it happening as well. And frankly, if I was either Brown or Brossou, and been thinking quickly, I’d have gone to some back room and had someone grab me as hard as they could on the arm to cause a bruise and thrown myself on a chair to bruise a rib. But that is just me:) ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 9:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/528 "2016-05-22T09:10:47Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > And frankly, if I was either Brown or Brossou, and been thinking quickly, I’d have gone to some back room and had someone grab me as hard as they could on the arm to cause a bruise and thrown myself on a chair to bruise a rib. But that is just me:) Are you serious? ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 9:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/529 "2016-05-22T09:51:28Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Are you serious? When someone opens the door a crack, you kick it the f\*\*\* down. (I think I’ve been watching too much House of Cards, frankly!) ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/530 "2016-05-22T12:54:15Z")
A [month ago](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19273714&postcount=333) you opposed the building of a youth centre in Attawapiskwat, despite the youth suicide crisis there and the youth themselves requesting it. [This month](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19348807&postcount=527) you are advocating deceit and falsehood by parliamentarians. I’m curious as to what next month will bring. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/531 "2016-05-22T13:17:38Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > I agree. Doesn’t mean he didn’t do the crime. Maybe someone will understand my point which is the PM should be held to a higher standard especially in the HOC and that what you and I do are one thing and may be considered ‘a trifle’ to the law, but what he does shouldn’t necessarily be. No. That goes contrary to the rule of law: the law is the same for all. The definition of assault does not change depending on the political status of the person alleged to have committed the assault. > [@](#): > > Nor are they stupid enough to go against the government whether that government can directly, or indirectly, affect their careers. I don’t think you appreciate just how decentralised the administration of justice is in Canada, the separation between the provinces and the federal government, and the extremely strong institutional protections against political interference in criminal investigations and prosecutions. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/532 "2016-05-22T13:22:42Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > If, for the sake of argument that someone was going to attempt to prosecute the PM, you think that there would not be back channel attempts to thwart, hinder, or at the least question it?:dubious: Yes, back-channel methods worked so well for the career of the PM’s Chief of Staff, Nigel Wright: [‘Mind-boggling and shocking’: Judge slams Harper PMO in Mike Duffy verdict](http://globalnews.ca/news/2655906/mind-boggling-and-shocking-judge-slams-harper-pmo-in-mike-duffy-verdict/) ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/533 "2016-05-22T15:11:00Z")
Just out of curiosity, in the middle of that scrum had someone just reacted like they would on the street, and take hairboy down, what would have happened. Declan ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/534 "2016-05-22T15:12:53Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > No. That goes contrary to the rule of law: the law is the same for all. The definition of assault does not change depending on the political status of the person alleged to have committed the assault. Uzi, this gets back to your question about whether or not criminal law applies in the House of Commons. Although there is parliamentary privilege for some civil matters, there is no parliamentary privilege for criminal matters due to the overarching importance that all of us, from plebeians to parliamentarians, be equal before the criminal law. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/535 "2016-05-22T15:17:15Z")
> [@Declan](#): > > Just out of curiosity, in the middle of that scrum had someone just reacted like they would on the street, and take hairboy down, what would have happened. > > Declan [Here’s the vid.](https://youtu.be/xrQLMVyXjIE) ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/536 "2016-05-22T15:32:38Z")
More seriously, if someone took down a member of the House within the House, I expect that security would step in and the person would be charged with assault. ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/537 "2016-05-22T15:41:02Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > More seriously, if someone took down a member of the House within the House, I expect that security would step in and the person would be charged with assault. Sounds like an Australian parliamentry session. Declan ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2016, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/538 "2016-05-22T23:27:32Z")
Great Daily Show interview of Justin Trudeau here where he defends Canada’s influx of refugees and shows the correspondent that he knows what an Upper Deck is. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/9gT-vJg-EfM/maxresdefault.jpg "Prime Minister Justin Trudeau Welcomes Syrian Refugees to Canada: The Daily Show") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gT-vJg-EfM) ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2016, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/539 "2016-05-23T01:06:17Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > A [month ago](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19273714&postcount=333) you opposed the building of a youth centre in Attawapiskwat, despite the youth suicide crisis there and the youth themselves requesting it. For which I said the money would be better spent getting the people out of that no future reserve. What a community center is going to do with no prospects of jobs I have no idea. > [@](#): > > [This month](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19348807&postcount=527) you are advocating deceit and falsehood by parliamentarians. Deceitful is complaining that the last government was shutting down debate, campaigning on how they would be a better government, and then immediately doing what they were previously complaining about. The falsehood was saying they were going to act differently. You’ve already said that Brosseau wasn’t really hurt. So, what was she doing by saying she was? Was that being deceitful? The whole thing is a game that relies on deception, deceit, misdirection, and outright lies. Losing is getting caught. Winning is being better at it than the opposition. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2016, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883/540 "2016-05-23T03:25:14Z")
So how is everybody’s Victoria Day weekend going? We’ve had a Saturday and Sunday of rain, and I have a golf game scheduled for tomorrow (Monday). I hope it clears up in time for our game, but I’m doubtful. Well, even if our game is cancelled, the Monday off work is nice, at any rate! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883.md?page=26) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadope-cafe-2016-the-north-awakens/741883.md?page=28)