# The CanaDoper Café (2012 edition of The great, ongoing Canadian current events and politics thread.) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 1, 2012, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014 "2012-01-01T03:31:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 115
**Author:** ![Bookkeeper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bookkeeper/32/281_2.png) [@Bookkeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bookkeeper)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2012, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2282 "2012-12-02T05:50:12Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Time to think things through rather than make a hasty decision. The defence pointed out the similarities between this case and a previous case (right down to the details of the totally clueless testimony that he had his client give matching the equally clueless testimony in the other case :dubious:) which had ended in acquittal, and which submitted the very thick reprint of. It was going to take the JP some time just to read it, I expect. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2012, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2283 "2012-12-02T05:53:59Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Time to think things through rather than make a hasty decision. Well, I wish the 100 year old judge, or justice, or whomever would have thought things through in my witness case. I clearly said the light was green and the guy turning left did so into the path of an oncoming car, and yet the judge found the guy turning left innocent. Weirdest fucking experience ever. Guy turning left was an immigrant family dude. Guy who ploughed into him was a guy who went to the same high school as me. I was the only witness, The defense lawyer implicated that I was somehow biased and not telling the truth. The judge bought it. I felt sorry for my classmate. A complete travesty of justice because it was young dude with young dude’s “friend” as a witness, versus middle-aged immigrant family dude. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2012, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2284 "2012-12-02T06:22:12Z")
> [@Bookkeeper](#): > > The defence pointed out the similarities between this case and a previous case (right down to the details of the totally clueless testimony that he had his client give matching the equally clueless testimony in the other case :dubious:) which had ended in acquittal, and which submitted the very thick reprint of. It was going to take the JP some time just to read it, I expect. Some decisions are huge. Here, for example, is _Meads v. Meads_, 2012 ABQB 571 ([PDF link](http://canlii.ca/en/ab/abqb/doc/2012/2012abqb571/2012abqb571.pdf)), which checks in at a novel-length 188 pages. It’s not just the length of the decision, though–it can also be the cases cited in the decision that need to be read and understood. It took me a week to read _Meads_ in between other things, and a further two or three weeks to read the decisions that contributed to it. I finally came away with an understanding, even though I did not need to decide anything, unlike a judge. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2012, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2285 "2012-12-02T06:33:51Z")
**Leaffan** , was the decision ever published? Can we find it online, in a resource such as [Canlii](http://canlii.ca/en/)? We may be able to comment more knowledgeably if we can read it. If the decision has been published, and you’d like some commentary; PM me the details (names of the parties, etc.). I’d suggest not posting them here in public, as that would compromise your anonymity. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2012, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2286 "2012-12-02T11:27:06Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > **Leaffan** , was the decision ever published? Can we find it online, in a resource such as [Canlii](http://canlii.ca/en/)? We may be able to comment more knowledgeably if we can read it. > > If the decision has been published, and you’d like some commentary; PM me the details (names of the parties, etc.). I’d suggest not posting them here in public, as that would compromise your anonymity. I can search there I guess. This was, what, something like 34 years ago though. Is it possibly there? ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2012, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2287 "2012-12-02T13:29:11Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I can search there I guess. This was, what, something like 34 years ago though. Is it possibly there? No. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2012, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2288 "2012-12-03T16:30:42Z")
I find that interesting, Leaffan, as I was in a similar situation but was the left turner at a busy intersection and got smacked by someone who changed lanes at the last second and accelerated right into me. I was told by the cops that the person turning left is always at fault, as is the person who rear ends another car. I never fought it in court because I was told by a few people it would be a waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2289 "2012-12-04T05:49:40Z")
[Justin Trudeau under fire for long gun registry comments.](http://ca.news.yahoo.com/trudeau-under-fire-long-gun-registry-comments-020854000.html) He does seem to be a bit of a panderer. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Doom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Dr\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Doom)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2290 "2012-12-04T17:36:58Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > [Justin Trudeau under fire for long gun registry comments.](http://ca.news.yahoo.com/trudeau-under-fire-long-gun-registry-comments-020854000.html) He does seem to be a bit of a panderer. > [@](#): > > "When he’s in Quebec he says Albertans have too much power, but when he’s in Alberta he says the opposite. When he’s with his Liberal friends he votes in favour of the long-gun registry, when he’s in a rural community he calls it a failure. > “Justin Trudeau will tell you whatever he thinks you want to hear, whenever he thinks you want to hear it,” Poilievre said. I love politicians like this – old school, bald-faced, shameless. So entertaining. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2291 "2012-12-04T18:01:16Z")
This [time](http://www.ottawasun.com/2012/12/03/trudeau-would-vote-again-for-failed-long-gun-registry) from a stop in Quebec: > [@](#): > > “If we had a vote tomorrow, I would vote once again to keep the long-gun registry.” > [@](#): > > “The definition of a failed public policy is a policy that gets eliminated when governments change. That is the very definition,” Trudeau said. “You can’t talk about success because it doesn’t exist anymore. It was able to be eliminated, therefore it was a failed public policy unfortunately.” The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2292 "2012-12-04T18:51:44Z")
Those quotes don’t sound as contradictory to me as they do to some people, I guess. Just because he said the long gun registry was a failure, it doesn’t necessarily follow that he thinks that abolishing it was preferable to keeping it and fixing it somehow. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2293 "2012-12-04T19:59:21Z")
> [@hogarth](#): > > Those quotes don’t sound as contradictory to me as they do to some people, I guess. Just because he said the long gun registry was a failure, it doesn’t necessarily follow that he thinks that abolishing it was preferable to keeping it and fixing it somehow. I agree. The quotes I made makes sense paired together, but they are contradictory to what he said in Ontario earlier: > [@](#): > > “The long-gun registry, as it was, was a failure and I’m not going to resuscitate that,” > [@](#): > > “But there are better ways of keeping us safe than that registry which is, has been removed,” It’s smae kid of backpeddling as the anti-Alberta comments. Anyway, I’ not going to beat a dead horse here; it’s politics. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2294 "2012-12-04T20:28:58Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > \ > The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. Was Pierre Trudeau known for his pandering? He didn’t seem to care what western people thought of him at all. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2295 "2012-12-04T20:50:27Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I agree. The quotes I made makes sense paired together, but they are contradictory to what he said in Ontario earlier: > > It’s smae kid of backpeddling as the anti-Alberta comments. Anyway, I’ not going to beat a dead horse here; it’s politics. I should really find time to proofread. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2296 "2012-12-04T21:02:47Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I agree. The quotes I made makes sense paired together, but they are contradictory to what he said in Ontario earlier: It still doesn’t sound that contradictory to me. He’s saying the registry “ **as it was** , was a failure” and “there are better ways of keeping us safe than **that registry** ”. So it sounds to me like he’s saying that the specific implementation was poor (hard to argue with that), but that still leaves room to say that there could be a new, improved long gun registry that everyone could be happy with (good luck with that). Since the old registry was eliminated, it would make no sense to say “duh, let’s reinstitute the registry that had problems and then fix it later” instead of “let’s go back to the drawing board”. Maybe I’m missing a nuance, though. > [@Leaffan](#): > > It’s same kid of backpeddling as the anti-Alberta comments. Anyway, I’ not going to beat a dead horse here; it’s politics. Those Quebec/Alberta comments were just dumb. Full stop. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2012, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2297 "2012-12-04T21:08:34Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I should really find time to proofread. I thought you just slipped into Scottish for a bit there. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Doom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Dr\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Doom)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2012, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2298 "2012-12-05T16:02:30Z")
So, just another reason to (although I don’t like his face, his name, or his politics in general) admire and respect the _impeccable timing_ of **Dalton McGuinty** , erstwhile Premier of Ontario (the _Economic Engine of Canada_ and last, best hope for _World Peace_): [Looming Teachers’ Strike!](http://www.thestar.com/living/parent/article/1297714--ontario-teacher-protest-after-school-help-cancelled-as-teachers-step-up-job-action) Way to get, when the gettin’ is good, **Dalton**! ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2012, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2299 "2012-12-05T16:23:59Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I thought you just slipped into Scottish for a bit there. 😃 Och. Don’t be cheekie. ---
**Author:** ![Bookkeeper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bookkeeper/32/281_2.png) [@Bookkeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bookkeeper)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2012, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2300 "2012-12-06T05:04:32Z")
> [@Dr\_Doom](#): > > So, just another reason to (although I don’t like his face, his name, or his politics in general) admire and respect the _impeccable timing_ of **Dalton McGuinty** , erstwhile Premier of Ontario (the _Economic Engine of Canada_ and last, best hope for _World Peace_): > > [Looming Teachers’ Strike!](http://www.thestar.com/living/parent/article/1297714--ontario-teacher-protest-after-school-help-cancelled-as-teachers-step-up-job-action) > > Way to get, when the gettin’ is good, **Dalton**! I have to wonder whether he’s planning on resigning as an MPP also. His local constituency office, which has been at the same location for his whole political career (used to be his law office) has a “For Lease” sign on it. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2012, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2301 "2012-12-06T15:23:39Z")
In memoriam - Geneviève Bergeron (1968 - 1989), civil engineering student Hélène Colgan (1966 - 1989), mechanical engineering student Nathalie Croteau (1966 - 1989), mechanical engineering student Barbara Daigneault (1967 - 1989), mechanical engineering student Anne-Marie Edward (1968 - 1989), chemical engineering student Maud Haviernick (1960 - 1989), materials engineering student Maryse Laganière (1964 - 1989), budget clerk in the École Polytechnique’s finance department Maryse Leclair (1966 - 1989), materials engineering student Anne-Marie Lemay (1967 - 1989), mechanical engineering student Sonia Pelletier (1961 - 1989), mechanical engineering student Michèle Richard (1968 - 1989), materials engineering student Annie St-Arneault (1966 - 1989), mechanical engineering student Annie Turcotte (1969 - 1989), materials engineering student Barbara Klucznik-Widajewicz (1958 - 1989), nursing student [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014.md?page=114) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014.md?page=116)