# The CanaDoper Café (2012 edition of The great, ongoing Canadian current events and politics thread.) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 1, 2012, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014 "2012-01-01T03:31:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 116
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2012, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2302 "2012-12-06T15:26:29Z")
I still remember ripping up my pillow case and tying a strip around my engineering jacket’s left arm when I heard what happened. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2012, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2303 "2012-12-06T17:58:32Z")
Thanks, Le Ministre. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2304 "2012-12-07T14:06:38Z")
So, the [F-35](http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Federal+government+cancels+fighter+purchase/7663407/story.html) deal is cancelled. Interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2305 "2012-12-07T14:36:03Z")
Remember when the government was railing against the PBO’s estimate of 30 billion over 30 years? For $2.8 million a year and 18 people it has to be one of the better government investments around. ---
**Author:** ![gregorio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/fbc32d/32.png) [@gregorio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gregorio)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2306 "2012-12-07T15:52:49Z")
Will they just call the new fighter the Sea King? Because this sure sounds like it’s going down the same road. [http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/Canadas-CH-148-Cyclones-Better-Late-Than-Never-05223/](http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/Canadas-CH-148-Cyclones-Better-Late-Than-Never-05223/) ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Doom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Dr\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Doom)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2307 "2012-12-07T19:19:04Z")
> [@Dr\_Doom](#): > > So, just another reason to (although I don’t like his face, his name, or his politics in general) admire and respect the _impeccable timing_ of **Dalton McGuinty** , erstwhile Premier of Ontario (the _Economic Engine of Canada_ and last, best hope for _World Peace_): > > [Looming Teachers’ Strike!](http://www.thestar.com/living/parent/article/1297714--ontario-teacher-protest-after-school-help-cancelled-as-teachers-step-up-job-action) > > Way to get, when the gettin’ is good, **Dalton**! Just got word from a co-worker whose wife is in administration at the Simcoe County Board of Education that the teachers are striking starting Tuesday. Will now see if there’s anything official on the webz. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2308 "2012-12-07T19:24:16Z")
Just a day long walkout, or a strike strike? The boads in my region cut new deals, so no strikes here. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Doom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Dr\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Doom)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2309 "2012-12-07T19:32:17Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Just a day long walkout, or a strike strike? > > The boads in my region cut new deals, so no strikes here. Ok, Muffin, it seems you are [correct](http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/ontario-teachers-suggest-walkouts-could-last-more-than-one-day/article6018132/). > [@](#): > > … rotating one-day walkouts across the province set to begin on Monday… I guess it’s just this Board in particular to which his wife was referring. At least the teachers held to their promise, as outlined via a missive sent home with students a week-and-a-half ago from the Board, that they’d give 72 hours notice of any work stoppages. That’s awfully charitable of them, I thought. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2310 "2012-12-07T19:36:52Z")
Those poor teachers. I hope they negotiate higher salaries and better vacation, not to mention pension and sick time. I don’t know how they can possibly continue to work under such deplorable conditions. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2311 "2012-12-07T20:16:40Z")
So do I Leaffan, because I live with a kindergarten teacher and if you had to put up with the monumental BS they have to go through between parents and government bozos trying to nickel and dime every last item out of the school system, you’d want more va-kay and cash too. When was the last time you had someone ask you to come in on a day off to talk to them because the scheduled 48 hrs were “inconvenient”? Or had to wait 2 hours after a 9 hr work day because a supposed adult treats the school like a glorified daycare? Or having your staffing cut by 50% because new policy says that there are no more codes for kids with developmental difficulties. No codes, no extra cash to hire people like EAs. I often wonder why it is that teaching colleges aren’t bursting with people trying to get the easy life of a teacher after doing “real” work. Volunteer in a class for a week, see what you think then. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2312 "2012-12-07T20:39:35Z")
**swampspruce** - you forgot the lice, pinworms, flu germs, cold germs, ringworm and other charming conditions that pound away at a teacher’s immune system. Here’s a link to a piece that covers the teachers’ position quite well - [Are Those Darn Teachers Still Complaining About Their Salaries?](http://geoffreybrittan.com/2012/12/06/are-those-darn-teachers-still-complaining-about-their-salaries/) A quick couple of paragraphs that sum up the article well - > [@](#): > > I went into teaching because I love kids. Yes, there are many people who think we go into this profession for the money, but please consider this. A starting teacher’s salary in our school board is $39 000. And this is after an average of 5-7 years to get a contract. In order to move up on the pay grid, teachers must have years of experience (so our salary goes up a little every year up to a maximum of 10 years) and we must also take extra courses in order to be paid the maximum amount. So in order to reach the top of the pay scale, a teacher must have had a contract for 10 years and have taken several extra university credits (paid out of their own pockets AFTER two university degrees). > > So given that it might take 10-15 years to make it to the top of the pay scale (which is still a modest amount), many people’s assertion that teachers are in this for the money really have no justification for their position. When you ask teachers to look at “how good we have it”, please realize that when we go into teaching, the reasons are NEVER about the money! If I wanted to get rich, I definitely would not have chosen teaching as a career. - by Karen Nancarrow. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2313 "2012-12-07T20:54:44Z")
> [@swampspruce](#): > > When was the last time you had someone ask you to come in on a day off to talk to them because the scheduled 48 hrs were “inconvenient”? Or had to wait 2 hours after a 9 hr work day because a supposed adult treats the school like a glorified daycare? I worked many weekends and evenings to get caught up when I was employed in high-tech. Drive by any place that employs professionals on weekends and you’ll see cars. You’ll see some at 9:00 PM too. > [@](#): > > Or having your staffing cut by 50% because new policy says that there are no more codes for kids with developmental difficulties. No codes, no extra cash to hire people like EAs. > I often wonder why it is that teaching colleges aren’t bursting with people trying to get the easy life of a teacher after doing “real” work. Volunteer in a class for a week, see what you think then. Yeah, and when recessions hit and stock prices plummet you get laid off. Teachers never have this problem. I hear stories all the time about the number of young teachers who can’t find work teaching. If it’s so bad, why aren’t teachers quitting in droves? I know I’m sounding snarky, but really, there are much, much worse places to work than in secure schools with every summer off. ---
**Author:** ![Bookkeeper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bookkeeper/32/281_2.png) [@Bookkeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bookkeeper)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2012, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2314 "2012-12-07T21:25:29Z")
> [@Bookkeeper](#): > > I have to wonder whether he’s planning on resigning as an MPP also. His local constituency office, which has been at the same location for his whole political career (used to be his law office) has a “For Lease” sign on it. I was wrong on this. Had a better look in daylight, and it’s the old law office next door that’s for lease. The constituency office is still open. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2012, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2315 "2012-12-10T23:26:32Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I worked many weekends and evenings to get caught up when I was employed in high-tech. Drive by any place that employs professionals on weekends and you’ll see cars. You’ll see some at 9:00 PM too. Oh, I’m not including the hours spent on report cards, marking, or the money they spend out of thier own pocket to enhance student learning that isn’t tax deductible, etc. I’m also not saying teachers have exclusive domain on overtime. That’s why professionals get paid like, well, professionals. > [@](#): > > Yeah, and when recessions hit and stock prices plummet you get laid off. Teachers never have this problem. I hear stories all the time about the number of young teachers who can’t find work teaching. > > If it’s so bad, why aren’t teachers quitting in droves? There are a few reasons for this. Talk to a few teachers and what you’ll generally find is that are committed to and honestly believe that teaching is not only a profession but a calling. Teachers genuinely like what they do. They like seeing those young minds grow and achieve. Do all of them? No. But a great majority of them. > [@](#): > > I know I’m sounding snarky, but really, there are much, much worse places to work than in secure schools with every summer off. Sanrky or jealous? I know I grumble a bit walking out the door mid-July at 6 AM while my spouse and kids saw logs… On the other side of it, I’d be an alcoholic in short order if I had to corral and engage twenty seven 5 year olds for 8 hrs a day. Besides, this walkout isn’t about the pay freeze as much as the government stripping away the teachers ability to collective bargaining, which is Bollocks. ---
**Author:** ![Ibanez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a4c791/32.png) [@Ibanez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibanez)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2012, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2316 "2012-12-10T23:49:58Z")
I have no sympathy for Ontario teachers, they seem to have been threatening strikes at least every two years for well over a decade now over anything and everything. Cry wolf syndrome, I don’t care anymore. Oddly teachers unions in other provinces don’t seem to have problems year, after year. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2012, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2317 "2012-12-10T23:50:25Z")
> [@swampspruce](#): > > Oh, I’m not including the hours spent on report cards, marking, or the money they spend out of thier own pocket to enhance student learning that isn’t tax deductible, etc. I’m also not saying teachers have exclusive domain on overtime. That’s why professionals get paid like, well, professionals. > > There are a few reasons for this. Talk to a few teachers and what you’ll generally find is that are committed to and honestly believe that teaching is not only a profession but a calling. Teachers genuinely like what they do. They like seeing those young minds grow and achieve. Do all of them? No. But a great majority of them. > > Sanrky or jealous? I know I grumble a bit walking out the door mid-July at 6 AM while my spouse and kids saw logs… On the other side of it, I’d be an alcoholic in short order if I had to corral and engage twenty seven 5 year olds for 8 hrs a day. > > Besides, this walkout isn’t about the pay freeze as much as the government stripping away the teachers ability to collective bargaining, which is Bollocks. **swampspruce** , that’s a very polite and well-worded response. Thank you. If it’s not about money, why didn’t they accept the wage freeze and move on. If it’s not about money, then what are they bargaining over exactly? ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2012, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2318 "2012-12-11T02:14:15Z")
Anybody notice this in the news: [CRTC gets earful on 3-year cellphone contracts](http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/12/08/cellphones-canada.html) Seems that the CRTC is looking into wireless services. According to the linked item, “The CRTC said in October it would develop a national code so Canadians could have a better understanding of their rights as consumers, and so wireless companies would clearly know their responsibilities.” While the CRTC plans to hold public hearings on this matter in February, it solicited online opinions over a couple of weeks. The biggest complaint: get rid of the three-year contract. I’d like to see the end of the three-year contract. Anybody else? ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2012, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2319 "2012-12-11T02:28:25Z")
[Toronto IKEA monkey!](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=675155) ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2012, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2320 "2012-12-11T05:36:55Z")
What do you guys think of the Chinese state-owned company [buying Nexen, an oil and gas company?](http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/a-new-model-on-foreign-investment/article6142944/) What do you think of the government’s stance on foreign ownership of Canadian companies? I’m not thrilled by the sale, but I don’t think I know enough about the circumstances or potential fallout. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2012, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014/2321 "2012-12-11T10:37:17Z")
I’m not sure. Foreign investment is surely a good thing. But foreign ownership of our natural resources doesn’t sit right with me. I don’t pretend to know enough about this deal to make an informed decision. Good thing all those commenters on the Globe and Mail website are so wonderfully informed. As usual. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014.md?page=115) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-canadoper-cafe-2012-edition-of-the-great-ongoing-canadian-current-events-and-politics-thread/608014.md?page=117)