The CanaDoper Café (2012 edition of The great, ongoing Canadian current events and politics thread.)

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
141

With the UK existing, we wouldn’t live the way we do. Why aren’t you giving credit to them?

Of course the existence of the USA changes the world. That doesn’t mean we’re free riders on American defense spending, it doesn’t mean that their defense spending allows us to spend more on health care, and it doesn’t mean that in the era of lower Canadian defense spending - which does NOT include World War II - we were saved from an actual threat by the United States.

The point being contested was about defense spending versus health care. You’re very off topic.

142

Anyone interested in an insight into remote reserve conditions might consider reading the Coroner’s reporton the 16 youth suicides in Pikangikum between 2006 and 2008.

143

I don’t think anyone is debating that conditions on reservations are deplorable; where we get stuck is how to fix them.

144

I am quite confident in the health of the Ontario economy. My business supplies manufacturers with raw materials, and we’ve been going steadily along since this time last year. Our business has been a general barometer for Ontario as a whole, in the past.

I can also state, due to a couple of reliable sources, that the oil sands are absolutely booming, so Canada in general is pretty solid thanks to that.

Anything from Vancouver-folk, or maritimers? Quebecers?

145

A friend has been complaining that it is too damp in Trois-Rivières, but I’m not sure whether that means their economy is going to expand or shrink.

146

I heard that everything is 3 times as damp, in Trois-Rivieres.

Best to stay on the bank, with Hammy, Matty, and G.P., I say.

147

That’s frankly pretty insulting to our armed forces. Our missile frigates and fighter jets are nowhere near obsolete, and our ground forces are well trained and equipped, if not terribly numerous and deficient in heavy armour. But given the logistical difficulties of mounting a trans-oceanic military invasion, I’m not sure that the Soviets even at their peak could have successfully invaded us even assuming minimal American participation (like, say, the willingness to defend Alaskan air and seas but nothing more). Certainly the current Russian forces wouldn’t have a prayer with no proper carriers. The fighters they have that can compete with ours don’t have the range to get to our airspace, and without air superiority they can’t get a surface fleet anywhere near us. They could nuke us into oblivion, sure, but you seem to be talking about something more substantial than not having nukes ourselves. Outside of Russia, who has a blue water navy that can compete with ours in our waters (in range of our F-18s) that isn’t a NATO member?

148

So? I was in the army in the 80’s. We knew that if it came to a shooting war, we wouldn’t last long with the USSR.

Btw, those F-18’s were developed in the US with US money. We purchased them from them. No military spending down there and we don’t have a plane that can compete. Even if we could 1-1, we’d still lose and then ships could be parked off our shore with little chance of us stopping them and create a beachhead. At that point it would be just logistics that would delay them, but not stop them.

Again, the only reason we don’t have to worry about it is because the US spends as much as they do on their military. Without that spending, and a willingness to use it, the world would be a very different place. If you want to believe that it would be a world of sunshine and lollipops, that is your prerogative.

149

Yes, the Conservatives really f*cked up when they ditched the Avro Arrow; that was Diefenbaker’s colossal mistake.

150

Osnaburg ?

151

Very close – Fort Hope.

Osnaburg and Pickle Lake.

152

Cool story. And to think that going into Pickle lake daily to pick up the mail was the highlight of my day for two years.

153

Fun fact: there are only two rivers in Trois-Rivières.

154

And then burned all the plans so no one could make any more, ever. Oy vey. Somewhat related anecdote - we watched an interesting documentary on the last flight of the Concorde the other day, and it was lovely to see how much that beautiful plane looked like the Arrow (which was no accident, of course - there aren’t that many high-performance jet designers in the world).

ETA: Hey, wasn’t it the Americans that forced us to shut down developing the Arrow?

155

And Trois-Rivières refers to only one of them.

156

I did touristy stuff in Ottawa this week! Two of my friends visiting from the UK were going up to spend a couple of days at a third friend’s house and visit the city. Since they were all at my place on Saturday, they convinced me to join them.

We just hung out and took advantage of the hot tub on Sunday night, and on Monday headed into town to visit stuff. We wanted to go to the National Art Gallery…which is closed on Mondays.

So we decided to go to the Museum of Civilization. We walked across the Alexandra Bridge and around to the front of the museum…and discovered it was closed, this week only, for maintenance.

“The War Museum, then!” we decide, but have the presence of mind to call and see if they were open. They are managed by the same people as the Civ…so it was also closed for maintenance.

We then found a tourist info post/map thing and called the information number, and asked what was actually open! After explaining to the woman that we were on foot and currently in Gatineau, so the Natural History and Air and Space Museums were not valid options, she gave us times for Parliament, the Supreme Court and the Royal Mint and then wished us luck, as it was already about 2:30 by this point.

Ottawa: Closed for Business.

We made it to Parliament and managed to get tickets for a tour, but would not have time to visit the Peace Tower or the Memorial Chamber. The tour was rather simplistic and kind of rushed, but the building is gorgeous and our photographer friend had some fun taking shots of the sculptures and architecture. For some reason, Ace, the Toronto Blue Jays mascot was there, though we didn’t get a photo with him. After going through security, one little kid in the tour kept saying “Going on an AIRPLANE!” and the mom kept replying “It’s not an airplane…” in a rather exasperated voice.

Next, we made our way to the Mint, which is open much later than our government apparently is (money works harder than talk, obviously). The last tour of the day, at 4:40 was scheduled to be done in French, but if no one else showed up, they could do it in English. As it happened, it was just us, and it was the first tour of the day for the guide. I liked the mint - it’s a rather fascinating process with some wonderfully efficient machinery. I recommend the tour, especially on a Monday after the holidays when you have a bit more time than usual to stroll through and ask questions.

We had supper at The Works that night, then got up the next day to head back to Parliament to visit the Peace Tower, because the photographer wanted to get shots of the view. A quick swing by the LCBO for cheap wine, and we then hopped on a Viarail train back to Montreal.

So that was my Tourist in Canada story. It was fun!
ETA: I’d done all these tours before, but at least 15+ years ago, FWIW.

157

I’d like to visit the Mint and the currency museum at the Bank of Canada. Part of the reason, of course, is my nefarious plan to Bring Back the Fifty-Cent Coin, and I’ve heard that the currency museum is one of the few places where you don’t have to special-order rolls of the coins.

[sub]Now if we can just kill off the penny (except as a collector’s item, of course)…[/sub]

158

It wasn’t a mistake at all. The Arrow was preposterously over budget, nowhere near completion, and would have given Canada a fighter jet that would have never been used in warfare and would have had a service life of maybe 15 years before being hopelessly outdated. No other country was willing to buy it, which made it hopelessly unaffordable.

It was the absolute epitome of a white elephant. Cancelling it was the correct thing to do. Had it not been cancelled Canada would have been out an absolutely staggering amount of money for not an especially large amount of additional military capability than we got from the F-101 anyway.

It would have been like us trying to build our own F-35 today with no assistance from any other country, except building it without half its capabilities.

[QUOTE=Cat Whisperer]
Hey, wasn’t it the Americans that forced us to shut down developing the Arrow?
[/QUOTE]

No.

159

I’m truly disgusted by the Conservative’s move to nullify many gay marriages made in Canada.

When people – gay or not – want to get divorced, at least one of them has to live in a province or territory for a full year. What the Harper government is doing in a divorce case that is before the court concering this residency issue is arguing that gays who get married in Canada but live elsewhere where gay marriage is not recognized are then no longer married under Canadian law.

I think the technical legal term for this argument is: “The stupid, it burns.” Much more importantly, however, is that it demonstrates the viscious hatred of gays that the Conservatives hold.

160

I think you’re jumping the gun, Muffin. I heard the news story and I looked up more information on the case, and it’s not as simple as “Conservatives hate gays.” Stripping the sensationalism from the story from this fairly slanted story, this is what I understand:

That doesn’t seem horribly out of line to me - I don’t see how can someone who got married in Canada can be legally married in the US (for example) if their home country doesn’t recognize their marriage, and from what I’m understanding, their home country doesn’t recognize their marriage from Canada, so they can’t divorce there. It isn’t right, no, but that’s the fault of the countries that still won’t recognize same-sex marriage, not Canadian Conservatives.

On the other hand, if this is some kind of kick at homosexuals, I’ll be even more disappointed than you are, Muffin. Any stance that involves prejudice against homosexuals doesn’t represent me at all.