# The chase is on--Adam Dunn goes after Rob Deer's record **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 25, 2011, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081 "2011-08-25T20:41:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/81 "2011-08-31T17:28:21Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > On ESPN yesterday, the announcer showing the replays made what to you is s terrible gaffe. He was talking about pitchers and declared them “terrible athletes”. I suppose you should straighten him out too. No reason for you to learn anything after all. You just have to be right. Even when you are not. Having not heard the quote, I’m guessing it came from the color commentator, who was probably a former position player making a bit of a joke at pitchers’ expense. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/82 "2011-08-31T17:49:37Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I don’t really have the time or inclination to find out who you’re talking about, write ESPN, and tell him he’s wrong. > > But he IS wrong. Anyone who says major league pitchers as a group are terrible athletes is simply ignorant. It is a preoposterous, asinine claim to state that men like Roy Halladay, Justin Verlander, or Felix Hernandez are poor athletes. Most of these guys, in terms of overall atleticism, are at worst in the top two or three percent of all adult males of equal age. > > I am not always right. Everyone’s fallible. But on this subject, I am completely right, and the ESPN guy is hopelessly wrong, or else he’s just talking out his ass, as ESPN announcers so often do. I knew you would say that. But most baseball people are aware that pitchers are almost all arms. Extremely few would have a career at another position. That is why we are aware of Ankiel and Lemon and a few others. Not because it is normal, but because it is not. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/83 "2011-08-31T18:00:12Z")
Bobby Valentine said the other night that Mark Teixeira was going to be the greatest switch hitter of all time when he finished playing. Just, you know, on the subject of things people say on ESPN. I had to tell someone. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/84 "2011-08-31T18:09:25Z")
[http://www.journalgazette.net/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080621/SPORTS02/806210321/0/sports0602](http://www.journalgazette.net/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080621/SPORTS02/806210321/0/sports0602) The ESPN incident was not repartee. It was during highlights and was not a jab. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/85 "2011-08-31T18:13:25Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > Bobby Valentine said the other night that Mark Teixeira was going to be the greatest switch hitter of all time when he finished playing. Just, you know, on the subject of things people say on ESPN. I had to tell someone. Well, he only needs to pick up another 80 or so wins above replacement to catch Mantle. At his present pace of production, that would only take another 18 seasons, and I think we can all agree that we can’t absolutely rule out the possibility of his continuing to be as productive through age 49 as he has been so far. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/86 "2011-08-31T18:16:21Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > [http://www.journalgazette.net/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080621/SPORTS02/806210321/0/sports0602](http://www.journalgazette.net/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080621/SPORTS02/806210321/0/sports0602) “New York Yankees ace Chien-Ming Wang”… heh. Why do you think three-year-old blather from some putz in the Portsmouth (R.I.) Journal supports your point? Hank Steinbrenner was upset that Wang was hurt running the bases and he said some dumb stuff (yet another shocker), and Bartolo Colon, who’s always been kind of a fat slob, got hurt while swinging a bat. Both of those things happen to position players from time to time, but your writer wrote a column about it because it happened to two pitchers in a short period of time and Hank Steinbrenner whined about it. Who the hell cares? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/87 "2011-08-31T18:57:57Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > I knew you would say that. But most baseball people are aware that pitchers are almost all arms. No, they don’t. Your claim is just ridiculous. Go on believing it if you want, I’m not stopping you. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/88 "2011-08-31T19:46:50Z")
And unfortunately, Dunn was out of the lineup last night and again today. He may be more or less finished for the year, especially with September call ups. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/89 "2011-08-31T21:21:12Z")
Ah, but he showed his old form in striking out as a pinch-hitter. ---
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/90 "2011-08-31T23:47:33Z")
Aren’t pitchers generally the fattest bastards on an MLB team? Particularly after their 4th or 5th year in the league? I think pitchers are about as great of an athlete as a pro arm wrestler. Is there any difference? ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2011, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/91 "2011-09-01T00:13:04Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > I knew you would say that. But most baseball people are aware that pitchers are almost all arms. False. Most baseball people are aware that pitchers are almost all leg+torso+arm rotation - a combination that requires a tremendous amount of conditioning and control. > [@](#): > > Extremely few would have a career at another position. Absolutely true. And so fucking what? Extremely few position players would have a career playing professional tennis, basketball or football. Are you suggesting that tennis, football and basketball players aren’t athletes? > [@](#): > > That is why we are aware of Ankiel and Lemon and a few others. Not because it is normal, but because it is not. Irrelevant. Hitting a baseball and playing defense certainly require athletic ability, and the ones that do that are certainly athletes. That doesn’t mean that people who excel in other physical skills _aren’t_. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2011, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/92 "2011-09-01T00:18:10Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > … or else he’s just talking out his ass, as ESPN announcers so often do. I must say that talking out one’s ass demonstrates a certain amount of athletecism. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2011, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/93 "2011-09-01T00:18:52Z")
> [@Cubsfan](#): > > Aren’t pitchers generally the fattest bastards on an MLB team? Oh yeah - pitchers aren’t trim like Prince Fielder, Ryan Howard, Pablo Sandoval, Andruw Jones… > [@](#): > > I think pitchers are about as great of an athlete as a pro arm wrestler. Is there any difference? Yes. Arm wrestling is supposed to be just your arm strength. You can’t throw a major league fastball over and over using just your arm. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2011, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/94 "2011-09-01T00:49:36Z")
> [@Cubsfan](#): > > I think pitchers are about as great of an athlete as a pro arm wrestler. Is there any difference? Go get a baseball, go outside, and see how far/hard you can throw it. Then retrieve the ball, and throw the ball as hard as you can _while standing perfectly still_. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2011, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/95 "2011-09-01T01:34:22Z")
> [@Cubsfan](#): > > Aren’t pitchers generally the fattest bastards on an MLB team? Particularly after their 4th or 5th year in the league? No. I have no idea what you’re talking about, in fact. I’m watching the Jays-Orioles game right now. The Blue Jays have no fat pitchers. I guess Jesse Litsch is a little round, but it’s just his shape, he’s actually very athletic. If the Orioles have any fat pitchers, they have not pitched in this series. ---
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2011, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/96 "2011-09-01T03:32:11Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > No. > > I have no idea what you’re talking about, in fact. I’m watching the Jays-Orioles game right now. The Blue Jays have no fat pitchers. I guess Jesse Litsch is a little round, but it’s just his shape, he’s actually very athletic. If the Orioles have any fat pitchers, they have not pitched in this series. Yeah, maybe not. Dunno. ---
**Author:** ![Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dread_pirate_jimbo/32/3897_2.png) [@Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dread_Pirate_Jimbo)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2011, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/97 "2011-09-01T16:16:42Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > Go get a baseball, go outside, and see how far/hard you can throw it. Then retrieve the ball, and throw the ball as hard as you can _while standing perfectly still_. This. “Arm strength” as a pitcher doesn’t come from your arm but from your legs and abs. Whether or not your arm itself is strong is way down the list of priorities. Pitchers don’t spend their time between starts doing pushups and curls; they spend their time on the stationary bike and on the floor doing crunches. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/98 "2011-09-26T19:14:50Z")
It’s coming right down to the wire! Ozzie has started playing Dunn again, and with three games to go, he needs only 13 more plate appearances. His average at the moment is .161, which would shatter Deer’s record by a full 18 points. To get 13, Dunn will need to play in all three remaining games, and get at least 5 PA’s in one game. Which may be difficult, given the White Sox popgun offense and the fact that they’re at home and so won’t likely bat in the ninth if they do generate offense. **However** –there is a Plan B. As we know, there is the “Tony Gwynn loophole” which allows a player to win the batting title with fewer than 502 PA’s, if by making outs the player could reach 502 and still win. Should a similar exemption apply to a futility record? It’s possible that Dunn will trail Deer even with sufficient hits added to his record to reach 502 PA’s. This is a profound existential question. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/99 "2011-09-26T20:00:53Z")
> [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](#): > > Unfortunately, the White Sox have 56 million reasons for keeping him on their roster–the $14 million that they have to pay him this year and each of the three following years. > > Of course, at some point paying a guy $56 million not to play becomes better than paying him $56 million to make outs. I wonder what his VURP (Value _Under_ Replacement Player) is. 😉 Seems like what you’d want to do with Dunn, if you’re on the hook for another $42M now that this season’s essentially over, is (barring a dramatic recovery in spring training next year) send him down to AAA next year and see if he can find his swing again. Meanwhile there’s replacement-level talent who can do a lot better than Dunn’s doing at DH. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081/100 "2011-09-26T20:03:52Z")
> [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](#): > > Should a similar exemption apply to a futility record? It’s possible that Dunn will trail Deer even with sufficient hits added to his record to reach 502 PA’s. Sure, why not? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-chase-is-on-adam-dunn-goes-after-rob-deers-record/594081.md?page=6)