# The Cognitive Behavioral Therapy Support Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 21, 2009, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097 "2009-12-21T18:41:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Crowbar\_of\_Irony\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f08c70/32.png) [@Crowbar\_of\_Irony\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crowbar_of_Irony_3)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/21 "2009-12-22T14:48:56Z")
Of the list that **Cat Whisper** has posted, I find myself doing…all 10 of them. Honestly, I have been looking for a place like this, where I can sound off whatever issues I am making mountains out from molehills and get a CBT approach to it. I always feel that people hate me. Loath me. They are just putting on smiling facade until one day you lose your cool then they take it as the opportunity to file you off as a poor friend or a petty fellow. I examine every tiny details in the interaction, or just am cold to everyone because “they will hate me eventually”. I do my best to be likable and all that, but deep down I know at the drop of a dime everyone will hate me. Crap. Here I get started again. ---
**Author:** ![eveanyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a88e4f/32.png) [@eveanyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eveanyn)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/22 "2009-12-22T16:24:48Z")
I’ve been through a series of sessions of CBT too. I sure wish I had known about all of this sooner, it would have saved me from feeling so alone. It can be very hard work. Thank you for starting this thread. I can relate to what each and every one of you are saying. When there is a specific situation causing me confusion or pain, it helps to have the tools to really step back and try to focus on the situation itself without going into the downward spiral of focussing on my emotions and habitual response of reacting only by over-generalizing and fortune telling. Maybe not everyone hates me, maybe they won’t hate me eventually. (Crazy Chop, I do the very same thing as you do.) The really tough part has been separating my thoughts from my emotions. They really seem like one and the same. They are not. So when I am down, my challenge is to take the time to do the worksheets in the Mind over Mood book. Ugh. On the subject of perfectionism, I learned that all these years this was my way of coping. If my house is spotless and organized, maybe I will feel less scattered inside myself. Since I try to be the best at my school or work, I don’t have time to fix myself. No time for being social… no time to feel anxious. It gave me focus, and now I can see it as avoidance. ---
**Author:** ![Tess\_Trueheart](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@Tess\_Trueheart](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tess_Trueheart)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/23 "2009-12-22T17:05:24Z")
I’m about halfway through the Ellis book. I’ve also tried 3 medications, and Wellbutrin is the one for me, at least for now. It still has several side effects, but I can deal with them. Dry mouth? I have sugarless candy, lots of water and better dental hygiene. Dizziness? I’m moving/getting up slowly and taking deep breaths and sometimes Nauzene. Others managed similarly. Now that I’m relatively stable in that area, I’m able to do the exercises in _Overcoming_ and in my other workbook without thinking the whole time that either (1) This is stupid and can never work or (2) It might work for other people, but not meeee. I’m different and worse and I’ll never get out! Now it is more like, well, why not give it a shot? And if it is less effective, well, no point in blaming myself. On to the next try. Still very hard, but getting easier. I’m glad to see this thread getting started. I too checked off every thing on that list. Disqualifying the positive and catastrophizing are my current targets. ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/24 "2009-12-22T17:40:53Z")
First, I would like to wish everyone here the best of luck. I have never battled depression in the way others have described, but I do have a deeply melancholic personality that requires constant maintenance. My regimen of choice is [Stoicism](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoicism), with a capital S. I mention this because the similarities between rigorous Stoic practice (largely from the Enchiridion of Epictetus) and CBT seem absolutely remarkable. Here’s an example: > [@](#): > > Some things are in our control and others not. Things in our control are opinion, pursuit, desire, aversion, and, in a word, whatever are our own actions. Things not in our control are body, property, reputation, command, and, in one word, whatever are not our own actions. > > The things in our control are by nature free, unrestrained, unhindered; but those not in our control are weak, slavish, restrained, belonging to others. Remember, then, that if you suppose that things which are slavish by nature are also free, and that what belongs to others is your own, then you will be hindered. You will lament, you will be disturbed, and you will find fault both with gods and men. But if you suppose that only to be your own which is your own, and what belongs to others such as it really is, then no one will ever compel you or restrain you. Further, you will find fault with no one or accuse no one. You will do nothing against your will. No one will hurt you, you will have no enemies, and you not be harmed. > > Aiming therefore at such great things, remember that you must not allow yourself to be carried, even with a slight tendency, towards the attainment of lesser things. Instead, you must entirely quit some things and for the present postpone the rest. But if you would both have these great things, along with power and riches, then you will not gain even the latter, because you aim at the former too: but you will absolutely fail of the former, by which alone happiness and freedom are achieved. > > Work, therefore to be able to say to every harsh appearance, “You are but an appearance, and not absolutely the thing you appear to be.” And then examine it by those rules which you have, and first, and chiefly, by this: whether it concerns the things which are in our own control, or those which are not; and, if it concerns anything not in our control, be prepared to say that it is nothing to you. This is from an extremely antiquated translation, but it reads well nevertheless. The core of CBT, I believe, has been quite well understood for a long time. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/25 "2009-12-22T17:41:14Z")
> [@olivesmarch4th](#): > > **Cat Whisperer,** I think perfectionism falls under “all or nothing” thinking. Either “I must have everything under control, no exceptions,” or “I have to do this perfectly, and I might fail at that, so I better not try.” I agree with this. Perfectionism is really destructive. One thing that CBT helped me do is accept things about myself and see that they’re not “bad,” but they’re just the way I am. If these behaviors cause problems, then it can make a lot more sense to find a way to mitigate the problems than to change the underlying behavior. An example–I had always heard that you should deal with the mail as soon as you walk in the door, or at least go through and discard the junk mail immediately. I really thought I was supposed to do that. But as soon as I walk in the door, I have other priorities, like going to the bathroom, getting dinner started so my kid wouldn’t starve by the time it’s ready, etc. Also, I’m a usually a little stressed out when I walk in, so I just don’t want to deal with the mail right then. I know some people put it in a designated place like on a hall table, but when I tried that, it would just pile up and I’d put other things there and it would get really messy, and frankly, I just don’t want to deal with the mail every day. So for years I beat myself up about not taking care of the mail “properly.” I’d stick it someplace and misplace or overlook things and then I’d feel worse. But with CBT, I came to accept that taking care of the mail as soon as I walked in just wasn’t going to happen. And that’s okay. I just had to find a way to deal with the “stick it somewhere and lose it” problem. So my idea was to get a large basket and put it on the shelf by the door. Now I just chuck everything in there when I go in the door, junk mail and all. It gets kind of full but I don’t have to clean it out too often. If I’m looking for bills or something, I know just where to look. If I ignore it for a few days, it doesn’t matter because it’s all corralled in the basket. Now some of you are probably saying “duh, why didn’t you just do that in the first place?” Well, it’s because I couldn’t get past that perfectionist ideal of how I was “supposed to” deal with the mail. And the way my thought processes worked, I just naturally chalked it up to more failure on my part. I beat myself up for not being able to do it the “right” way. It never occurred to me to work _with_ my natural tendencies than against them, because my natural tendencies were obviously (to me) inferior. So CBT helped me change those thought patterns. Dealing with the mail is still somewhat stressful. I still let it pile up too much in the basket and ignore it for too long sometimes. So that’s something I have to work on. But “better” is my goal rather than “perfect.” In the meantime, it’s manageable. And if I do let it pile up too much, I don’t hate myself because of it. It’s a really nice change. And it’s happened in so many areas throughout my life. > [@heavyarms553](#): > > I’ve done CBT before. It’s no cure-all, nor is it effective for all types of depression. Still, it has its place in psychiatric treatment. If the source of your depression is a focal, localized misconception then it’s just what the doctor ordered, so to speak. For many people it won’t do a thing though. Sorry, you’re dead wrong. It may not be the right therapy for all disorders, but I can’t imagine why you say it’s only good for a “focal, localized misconception.” I was suffering from a whole universe of misconceptions and negative thoughts. And little by little, CBT is correcting them. My mail example is just one small thing, but extrapolate that to every area of my life. My thinking was totally screwed up. Now it’s not so screwed up anymore. And I’d like to know what type of therapy you think works better. Hey, CBT may not be for you, but it has been proven effective for an incredibly wide range of problems. And don’t forget that there are many different approaches to it. My therapist doesn’t give me homework, for example. Maybe your therapist was taking the wrong approach for your issues. ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/26 "2009-12-22T19:31:07Z")
**Maeglin** , thank you for sharing, I enjoyed that. ---
**Author:** ![Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/bc8723/32.png) [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unauthorized_Cinnamon)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/27 "2009-12-22T19:44:55Z")
> [@Maeglin](#): > > I mention this because the similarities between rigorous Stoic practice (largely from the Enchiridion of Epictetus) and CBT seem absolutely remarkable. Interesting! Zen Buddhism (which BTW can be entirely secular and materialist) has some very similar concepts as well. Attachment is the source of suffering, and all that. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/28 "2009-12-22T19:55:02Z")
> [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](#): > > \ > **Cat Whisperer,** I think perfectionism falls under “all or nothing” thinking. Either “I must have everything under control, no exceptions,” or “I have to do this perfectly, and I might fail at that, so I better not try.” > \ Yeah, that works. I wanted to say to **olives** (but forgot, because I’m not perfect 🙂 ), that one thing you posted really stood out for me - > [@](#): > > The very first thought I had this morning: ‘‘I am so tired of being afraid.’’ That actually strikes me as a positive step forward - next comes anger, because you’re starting to believe that you don’t deserve to feel so bad all the time. Believe it or not, it sounds like you are moving forward. I had moments much like that when I was recovering from anxiety; I was working on replacing my negative thoughts with more positive ones; I distinctly remember one day, after a particularly busy day of thought replacement, thinking to myself, “Am I ever going to get to just think a thought again without it being so much work?” The answer to that was yes. I was building a habit that I use to this day. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/29 "2009-12-22T19:59:46Z")
> [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](#): > > Interesting! Zen Buddhism (which BTW can be entirely secular and materialist) has some very similar concepts as well. Attachment is the source of suffering, and all that. The poem [“Desiderata”](http://www.fleurdelis.com/desiderata.htm) is also very positive - > [@](#): > > Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. > But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings. > Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness. > > Beyond a wholesome discipline, > be gentle with yourself. Good advice there. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/30 "2009-12-22T20:32:38Z")
> [@olivesmarch4th](#): > > When I first signed up, they estimated it would take 8-10 sessions, and they told me that they expected my symptoms to get worse for a little while before they got better. I was thinking this would happen for 2-3 weeks and I would start feeling better. > > Well, we all underestimated how much work this would be. It has been 2 months and I’m still not finished processing the first memory. And I have, oh, a bazillion. > [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](#): > > IME, this kind of thing is one of the hardest things to cope with. You set up an expectation and gird your loins for a certain amount of suffering . . . and then find out it’s a lot more. I get the measure of how bad, no, how lousy, most people are at guesstimates from how they react to mine. Well, not to getting the estimate, but to how close the final value ends up being to the actual one. People consider 200% errors normal :eek: I have to remind me to stop kicking myself if I go over by half an hour on a month-long guess 😛 _It is not your fault that most people run estimates from their ass._ ---
**Author:** ![Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/bc8723/32.png) [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unauthorized_Cinnamon)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/31 "2009-12-22T21:58:56Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > “Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. > But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings.” Call it catastrophizing, fortune-telling, or just borrowing trouble, but I have the hardest time giving up my habit of running awful scenarios “so I’ll be prepared.” I’m so much like Harry in the following conversation: > [@When Harry Met Sally](#): > > Sally: I have just as much of a dark side as the next person. > Harry: Oh really. When I buy a new book I always read the last page first that way in case I die before I finish I know how it ends. That my friend is a dark side. > . . . > Harry: Of course not you’re too busy being happy. Do you ever think about death? > Sally: Yes. > Harry: Sure you do, a fleeting thought that jumps in and out of the transient of your mind. I spend hours, I spend days… > Sally: And you think that makes you a better person. > Harry: Look, when the shit comes down I’m gonna be prepared and you’re not that’s all I’m saying. > Sally: And in the mean time you’re gonna ruin your whole life waiting for it. Like when that crib recall came out, I felt compelled to re-enact in my mind the experience of the mother who came in to find her 10 month old dead, caught in a gap between crib and mattress. Like, with me in her place, and trying to feel what she must have felt. _Why would I do this?_ Because I’m crazy. I think I have an underlying belief that by doing this stuff I’m somehow inoculating myself from future tragedy. I’m trying to stop. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2009, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/32 "2009-12-23T01:52:40Z")
I like this idea, **Unauthorized Cinnamon**. But for my $.06, I prefer a members-only LJ community over a public message board. Does anybody know how to start and administrate an LJ community? Need answer… oh, anytime in the next 2 or 3 weeks. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2009, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/33 "2009-12-23T05:46:03Z")
> [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](#): > > Call it catastrophizing, fortune-telling, or just borrowing trouble, but I have the hardest time giving up my habit of running awful scenarios “so I’ll be prepared.” I’m so much like Harry in the following conversation: > > Like when that crib recall came out, I felt compelled to re-enact in my mind the experience of the mother who came in to find her 10 month old dead, caught in a gap between crib and mattress. Like, with me in her place, and trying to feel what she must have felt. _Why would I do this?_ Because I’m crazy. I think I have an underlying belief that by doing this stuff I’m somehow inoculating myself from future tragedy. I’m trying to stop. It is my belief that the “trying to be prepared for anything that happens” attitude stems from an underlying lack of self-confidence. A truly self-confident person knows that they’ll handle whatever comes up; you don’t have to be prepared for every possible scenario. ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2009, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/34 "2009-12-23T11:50:59Z")
> [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](#): > > Interesting! Zen Buddhism (which BTW can be entirely secular and materialist) has some very similar concepts as well. Attachment is the source of suffering, and all that. There are some practical similarities between Buddhism (with which I have a great deal of sympathy) and Stoic therapy. But Stoicism is highly telological and proceeds by logical argument, and Zen is pretty much the opposite on both counts. Here is another gem. This is from the first chapter of the Consolation of Philosophy, by Boethius. The author is currently (wrongfully) imprisoned for treason and is about to be executed. He laments, taking refuge in the Muses of Poetry. Philosophy arrives and drives them out. She’s annoyed with him and tells him so, and then spends the rest of the book demonstrating to him logically how a man facing impending torture and death can still be happy. This translation is from 1905, so I don’t imagine issues with posting the entire passage. I think it’s well worth reading; I have read the entire Consolation several times and have translated most of it myself. > [@](#): > > 'Ah me! how blunted grows the mind when sunk below the o’erwhelming flood! Its own true light no longer burns within, and it would break forth to outer darknesses. How often care, when fanned by earthly winds, grows to a larger and unmeasured bane. This man has been free to the open heaven: his habit has it been to wander into the paths of the sky: his to watch the light of the bright sun, his to inquire into the brightness of the chilly moon; he, like a conqueror, held fast bound in its order every star that makes its wandering circle, turning its peculiar course. Nay, more, deeply has he searched into the springs of nature, whence came the roaring blasts that ruffle the ocean’s bosom calm: what is the spirit that makes the firmament revolve; wherefore does the evening star sink into the western wave but to rise from the radiant East; what is the > cause which so tempers the season of Spring that it decks the earth with rose-blossoms; whence comes it to pass that Autumn is prolific in the years of plenty and overflows with teeming vines: deeply to search these causes was his wont, and to bring forth secrets deep in Nature hid. > > 'Now he lies there; extinct his reason’s light, his neck in heavy chains thrust down, his countenance with grievous weight downcast; ah! the brute earth is all he can behold. > > ‘But now,’ said she,’ is the time for the physician’s art, rather than for complaining.’ Then fixing her eyes wholly on me, she said, ’ Are you the man who was nourished upon the milk of my learning, brought up with my food until you had won your way to the power of a manly soul? Surely I had given you such weapons as would keep you safe, and your strength unconquered; if you had not thrown them away. Do you know me? Why do you keep silence? Are you dumb from shame or from dull amazement? I would it were from shame, but I see that amazement has overwhelmed you.’ > > When she saw that I was not only silent, but utter]y tongue-tied and dumb, she put her hand gently upon my breast, and said,’ There is no danger: he is suffering from drowsiness, that disease which attacks so many minds which have been deceived. He has forgotten himself for a moment and will quickly remember, as soon as he recognises me. That he may do so, let me brush away from his eyes the darkening cloud of thoughts of matters perishable.’ So saying, she gathered her robe into a fold and dried my swimming eyes. > > Then was dark night dispelled, the shadows fled away, and my eyes received returning power as before. 'Twas just as when the heavenly bodies are enveloped by the west wind’s rush, and the sky stands thick with watery clouds; the sun is hidden and the stars are not yet come into the sky, and night descending from above o’erspreads the earth: but if the north wind smites this scene, launched forth from the Thracian cave, it unlocks the imprisoned daylight; the sun shines forth, and thus sparkling Phoebus smites with his rays our wondering eyes. > > ``` > In such a manner were the clouds of grief scattered. Then I drew breath again and engaged my mind in taking knowledge of my physician's countenance. So when I turned my eyes towards her and fixed my gaze upon her, I recognised my nurse, Philosophy, in whose chambers I had spent my life from earliest manhood. And I asked her,' Wherefore have you, mistress of all virtues, come down from heaven above to visit my lonely place of banishment? Is it that you, as well as I, may be harried, the victim of false charges? ' 'Should I,' said she,' desert you, my nursling? > > ``` I like to think I am a little better put together than Ignatius J Reilly, though. ---
**Author:** ![Nesyut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b3f665/32.png) [@Nesyut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nesyut)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2009, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/35 "2009-12-23T12:38:00Z")
> [@olivesmarch4th](#): > > It’s arguably the most effective treatment there currently is for depression, with a vast number of randomized controlled trials and benchmark studies indicating its efficacy. Which isn’t to say it would work for everyone, just most people. Sorry it didn’t work out for you. ☹ > > ETA: Sorry to be a pain, but I’m not climbing off of my CBT soapbox until therapists are consistently using evidence-based treatments for psychological disorders. It is a moral obligation of therapists to use treatments that have been proven to work. I say that as someone who wasted 8 years of my life trusting that I wasn’t getting treatments therapists pulled out of their ass. They meant well, but they wasted nearly a decade of my life. The best thing we can do is educate the public about what works and what doesn’t. Since therapists who use unproven treatments obviously won’t take the responsibility, it is important that those seeking treatment are fully educated. There is one somewhat similar treatment but helps work with those with under- or overdeveloped senses of emotion. Again evidence based, and is what I’m on as well as CBT. Dialectical Behaviour Therapy. [DBT](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectical_behavior_therapy) is aimed more at those with borderline personality disorder, those that require help with emotion regulation and deals with how to cope with certain situations before being able to deal with why someone thinks about that situation in the first place. I still agree that CBT is an absolute godsend, and with DBT it is really helping change my life for the better! ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2009, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/36 "2009-12-24T02:02:42Z")
> [@Nesyut](#): > > There is one somewhat similar treatment but helps work with those with under- or overdeveloped senses of emotion. Again evidence based, and is what I’m on as well as CBT. Dialectical Behaviour Therapy. [DBT](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectical_behavior_therapy) is aimed more at those with borderline personality disorder, those that require help with emotion regulation and deals with how to cope with certain situations before being able to deal with why someone thinks about that situation in the first place. > > I still agree that CBT is an absolute godsend, and with DBT it is really helping change my life for the better! DBT is fantastic (and technically it is also a kind of CBT). I recently wrote a research paper on it and learned that it has even been proven effective for substance abuse and comorbid diagnoses. My husband is reading Linehan’s book and receiving DBT training as part of his Ph.D. in clinical psychology. Research currently underway is indicating that DBT may not be so narrowly applied – it is showing proming results in RTCs with depression and anxiety as well. The most remarkable thing about Linehan and DBT is that it is the first treatment really to take individuals with borderline personality disorder and reject the stigma so frequently attached to them. A BPD diagnosis was once the kiss of death, and she transformed it into something treatable using an approach that honors the sufferer with compassion and respect. She excoriates the stigmatizing language used in the DSM-IV against sufferers of BPD, and rejects the assertion, _based on evidence_, that any attempts of suicide/self-injury are ‘‘manipulative.’’ When you think of BPD as a coping strategy for severe trauma, the behaviors make so much more sense. I celebrate this, as my mother suffers, untreated, for this disorder. I feel like I am the only one who has ever seen her in a sympathetic light because she has done many objectively horrible things. But I have always recognized her actions as coming from a deep core of pain, and I love that Linehan is doing that and backing up the fact that compassion works using hard scientific evidence. I also love DBT because it is based in Buddhist philosophy. I once suffered extreme problems with emotion regulation and in all honesty was probably a hair’s breadth away from a borderline diagnosis (I was diagnosed with [Complex PTSD](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complex_post-traumatic_stress_disorder), which is basically PTSD with more pervasive and severe effects as the result of captivity/repeated interpersonal trauma: psychological fragmentation, the loss of a sense of safety, loss of coherent sense of self, trust, and self-worth. There is often a thin line between CPTSD and borderline.) It was ‘‘the middle way’’ preached in Buddhism that helped me become more grounded. Core concepts like acceptance, integrated thinking, impermanence, etc. are key both to DBT and Buddhism. **UC** , thank you so much for your help. It’s amazing to me how hard it can be to identify my own irrational thoughts. It’s striking to me how my choice of self-expression can effect how I view a situation. For example, even as I wrote, ‘‘I have a bazillion memories’’ it never occurred to me that silly hyperbole was actually making my view of the situation worse. All those little exaggerations we let ourselves get away with, thinking they aren’t a big deal… they can have a big cumulative affect. I really appreciate you tackling that one, because sometimes life is seems so messy, and complicated. When we can label our reactions to the experience it just makes everything seem more… clear. **Cat Whisperer** , that’s a good point. I never even thought of ‘‘I am so tired…’’ statements as maybe, a positive thing. But if I look back at the positive choices I’ve made in my life, they were usually predicated with an, ‘‘I am so tired…’’ Must be a sign of good things to come. I’m happy to report I’ve done my exposure every day so far this week! And… it’s getting boring… which means it’s working 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/37 "2010-01-12T22:12:54Z")
To resurrect this thread, there is a software program called emotions manager 2000 that is free and fairly user friendly which you can use to categorize and address negative emotions. I enjoy it. > **[Emotions Manager](https://download.cnet.com/Emotions-Manager/3000-2129_4-10160532.html)** > > Download Emotions Manager for Windows to use Cognitive Therapy techniques to deal with your negative emotions. ---
**Author:** ![Indyellen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/indyellen/32/4176_2.png) [@Indyellen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indyellen)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2010, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/38 "2010-01-12T22:28:00Z")
Does anyone else who’s been through CBT ever find themselves being tired of analyzing their feelings? I’ve done 3 intense group CBT sessions, and my therapist uses it somewhat, but some days when I’m having some sort of emotional upheaval (for good or bad), the thought crosses my mind that I sometimes wish I could just FEEL things, instead of having to THINK about them right away, and then decide if it’s “ok” if I feel them. It’s not all the time, but I occasionally feel like I’ve lost some of that “in the moment” thing because of my destructive thinking habits. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/39 "2010-01-13T02:37:35Z")
I had a moment like that years ago, when I was working very hard on my anxiety. I don’t do that anymore; thinking positively really does become a habit. It sounds like you’re still building the habit of positive thinking, and things are more difficult and less natural when you’re still in the building stage. ---
**Author:** ![Runs\_With\_Scissors](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/278dde/32.png) [@Runs\_With\_Scissors](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Runs_With_Scissors)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097/40 "2010-01-13T04:50:50Z")
I have anxiety, not depression (although during sever anxiety attacks that last weeks, I get depressed). I did want to pop in to say to anyone interested in CBT not to give up. I’m in round 3 (second time with current psychologist, one year after my last session), and this time…I’m actually “getting” it. It’s hard. It’s work. But I’m actually feeling some mental and physiological rewards…and they’re awesome. The first time I had depression from anxiety, I didn’t even know what the hell was wrong. It sure as hell ain’t “the blues.” It felt like a death eater from Harry Potter got to me. I did not feel human. I understood what people mean when they say they are a shell of a person. It’s nothing like when I’m “depressed” (bummed out) about every day stuff. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-cognitive-behavioral-therapy-support-thread/522097.md?page=3)