# The Conyers Report **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 6, 2005, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325 "2005-01-06T01:26:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Mojo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Mojo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mojo)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2005, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/41 "2005-01-06T19:46:29Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > **Bricker** : Have those involved in the creation of this report engaged in lying on this scale before? Is their credibility shot? [This](http://www.freep.com/news/metro/turkey6e_20050106.htm) is more snarky than topical, but hey, it’s the pits. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2005, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/42 "2005-01-06T19:52:01Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I really admire the honesty of this response. I wonder if I could impose on this honesty and get the answer to another question: **Captain Amazing** , just as a guess, what percentage of the complaints would you guess are arising from this pragmatic view that you’ve taken, and what percentage are grounded in more idealistic concerns? Who can say? I’m willing to believe that most of the people complaining about this do really think that there’s been fraud, that people have been disenfranchised, and that a bad thing has happened that needs to be fixed. So, in that sense, they’re acting out of idealism. But I do think the fact that the errors seem to be in President Bush’s favor have something to do with the outcry some of the people are making, as well. It might not even be a conscious thing. They’re just more willing to judge their opponents more harshly (as is everyone). It’s the same thing, in reverse, as went on in the Clinton impeachment. Were the people calling for Clinton’s impeachment really bothered that he probably had an affair with an intern and committed perjury? Probably most of them were. But, at the same time, the fact that it was a Democrat who did it, and even moreso, the fact that it was Clinton who did it, increased the severity in their minds. If you start out with the assumption that someone is up to no good, you can always judge them harshly. And, again, I’m not saying the people who did this even realized they did it. They were just predisposed to think the worst of President Clinton, and they did. It’s the same in our personal life, too. Whenever anybody files a motion against any of our clients, everyone in my office is amazed at how poorly written and full of logical falsehoods it is, while our response is always witty, well constructed, and legally supported (Yet, for some strange reason, the other side sometimes wins). It’s the same reason that everyone’s wife is beautiful, everyone’s baby is adorible, and everyone’s kid is special. People are biased, and I don’t know if there’s any getting around that. So (and how’s that for a long answer to a short question), I don’t know. John Conyers is no dummy, and he knows how politics works. I’m sure that he really wants to hurt both the President and Ken Blackwell (who has further political aspirations than just being Sec. of State of Ohio) politically, and knows this report will do that. At the same time, I’ve got no reason to doubt that he is concerned with voters being disenfranchised. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2005, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/43 "2005-01-06T20:09:25Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > **Captain Amazing** : Let’s say that for some of the Dem’ leadership, it is about making trouble for Bush. Isn’t it possible, even probable that for some, like myself, democracy and our political system are more important than the person who gets elected? > > **Manhattan** Why would this be about making problems for some minor functionary? I do not grok, what’s the motivation? I’m sure that you’re actually offended by voting errors in Ohio. Take a look at my post to **Bricker** , for more detail. And, Ken Blackwell is more than a “minor functionary”. He’s a pretty major force in the Ohio Republican party, and probably the leader of the conservative wing of the party in the state. He’s also charismatic, a good speaker, was a celebrity (he played for the Cowboys), and has a reputation for honesty and political integrity. He’s pretty definately going to run for governor in 2006, and is even talked about as a presidential candidate in 2008 (although I doubt that would happen). ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2005, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/44 "2005-01-06T21:21:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Often it’s about whining. [And of course it goes both ways](http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2002142483_recount06m.html). ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2005, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/45 "2005-01-06T21:27:12Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > [And of course it goes both ways](http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2002142483_recount06m.html). Right you are. And I’ve already gone on record here as saying that the GOP is whining in Washington, and should just shut up and accept that they lost. The people have spoken. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2005, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/46 "2005-01-06T21:36:15Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Why the hell isn’t this major news? It was covered today on _Talk of the Nation_, and it’s been mentioned in several of the NPR newsbriefs as “unusual” Congressional action. You may just have jumped the gun a bit. Oh, and on preview, now it’s on the Yahoo! front page. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2005, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/47 "2005-01-06T21:39:15Z")
> [@manhattan](#): > > In this case, it’s all about trying to ruin Ken Blackwell’s career before he advances further in Ohio. It’s too bad, really. He might’ve made a good VP for Taft in '08. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/48 "2005-01-07T00:48:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Right you are. Cool. > [@Bricker](#): > > And I’ve already gone on record here as saying that the GOP is whining in Washington, and should just shut up and accept that they lost. The people have spoken. You might be interested to know, since you’re not a Washington State resident, that the state Republican party has begun blanketing the local airwaves with twaddle about “we don’t know who won” and “we didn’t count every vote” and a whole bunch of stuff that sounds a hell of a lot like the whining the Dems did after the 2000 election debate was closed down by SCOTUS but that the Dems didn’t spend millions of dollars putting into radio and TV ads. They are deliberately poisoning the whole system, from the legislature to the courts, in a short-sighted effort at regaining power. If they’re willing to go to the mat on it, it feels to me like a Mutually Assured Destruction ploy: Give us what we want or we’ll tear the whole thing down. Rather more than whining, I think. [More irritating details on their website](http://wsrp.org/). ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/49 "2005-01-07T01:08:27Z")
Oh, and beyond that, they’re also making noises about [devouring their own for following rule of law above party loyalty](http://archives.seattletimes.nwsource.com/cgi-bin/texis.cgi/web/vortex/display?slug=reed03m&date=20050103&query=sam+reed) (requires free registration; very interesting, if infuriating, reading). ---
**Author:** ![ZombiesAteMyBrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b4bc9f/32.png) [@ZombiesAteMyBrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZombiesAteMyBrain)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325/50 "2005-01-07T14:15:39Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > That is a lie, and you are a liar, and those zombies are freakin’ STARVING if their only nourishment comes frmo your brain. Well, if **you** had switched on **your** brain **before** your rabid reply to my post, you would have noticed that the “quote” you ascribe to me actually came from the article I cited. The author’s e-mail address is at the bottom of the article - if you want to indulge in name-calling, why not write to him - or are you afraid that he might have actual proof of what he says? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-conyers-report/283325.md?page=2)