# The Dallas ebola guy just died. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 8, 2014, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768 "2014-10-08T16:25:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/61 "2014-10-10T01:10:32Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > We now have an alternative explanation why Duncan was turned away (the original one being the hospital was too stupid to recognize ebola): > “The Dallas hospital that treated the Ebola patient who died this week tried to fend off accusations on Thursday that it initially turned him away because he was a poor African immigrant without insurance.” > [http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/09/us-health-ebola-usa-hospital-idUSKCN0HY2HQ20141009](http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/09/us-health-ebola-usa-hospital-idUSKCN0HY2HQ20141009) > > Of course something like that never happens in America, right? I wondered a lot about it, before I had insurance thanks to Obamacare I was subjected last year in Arizona to a very similar situation, (very weird symptoms, one usually does get a flu or sore throat gradually, in my case it came like if someone had given me a sudden kick in the neck) so I did go to the emergency room in a nearby hospital, very crowded indeed, with needy people. After a long conversation with a nurse that made sure to let me know that I needed to sign paperwork that in essence would leave my family in the poor house if this was a very serious issue, I decided to once again (Yeah, there was another time in my past that I had no health insurance and somehow survived a very serious internal bleeding) risk it and go home, luckily the anger that I had made me notice that I was felling better with my neck so it seemed to be a good gamble. I was lucky but this guy was not. I would not be surprised that a lot of pressure to not hospitalize poor or uninsured people is one bit that many nurses or front office people **do** get training for, unlike getting training to be really ready for an epidemic. This IMHO is specially the case on states that have opposed health care reform. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/62 "2014-10-10T01:14:57Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > We now have an alternative explanation why Duncan was turned away (the original one being the hospital was too stupid to recognize ebola): > “The Dallas hospital that treated the Ebola patient who died this week tried to fend off accusations on Thursday that it initially turned him away because he was a poor African immigrant without insurance.” > [http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/09/us-health-ebola-usa-hospital-idUSKCN0HY2HQ20141009](http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/09/us-health-ebola-usa-hospital-idUSKCN0HY2HQ20141009) > > Of course something like that never happens in America, right? Haven’t people learned to ignore Jesse Jackson by now? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/63 "2014-10-10T01:24:21Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > Haven’t people learned to ignore Jesse Jackson by now? IMHO sometimes one has to use a controversial fellow like him when the hospital is treating your family like dirt. > **[Ebola patient's family say he got shoddy medical treament because he was...](https://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/10/08/1335231/-Thomas-Eric-Duncan-s-family-say-he-got-bad-healthcare-because-he-is-a-poor-Black-man-with-an-accent)** > > The nephew of Ebola sufferer Thomas Eric Duncan, Josephus Weeks, was interviewed by MSNBC's Ronan Farrow. He had some striking things to say about the way Texas Health Presbyterian Hospital ... > [@](#): > > “We were being mistreated,” Weeks said. “We were again being stigmatized. We go in there we being like you know ostracized. Like we didn’t belong there … by the hospital staff. We call. We get the phone hang up on. We stay on hold for 30 minutes. Sometimes we call we get bounced around the hospital about fifteen minutes and then get told we can’t speak to Eric. But after Reverend Jackson stepped in and he cried out for help for us, then a lot of people started changing their mindset. And coming in to assist and being more receptive to our needs.” > > Ronan Farrow then asked why he believed Weeks’ uncle was turned away from the hospital. Weeks could not be clearer. “Again, he did not have insurance. And he is a poor black man. He had a very deep accent coming from West Africa. I believe they didn’t believe he deserved the care that everyone else should get. And you don’t treat people like that.” ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/64 "2014-10-10T02:11:31Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > I needed to sign paperwork that in essence would leave my family in the poor house if this was a very serious issue, I decided to once again (Yeah, there was another time in my past that I had no health insurance and somehow survived a very serious internal bleeding) risk it and go home, Luckier than you know. Mrs. Plant (v.2.0) decided she was dying, and after signing in at the ER became bored and went home. I was out several hundred dollars, despite her having insurance. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/65 "2014-10-10T04:03:26Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > IMHO sometimes one has to use a controversial fellow like him when the hospital is treating your family like dirt. > > [Ebola patient's family say he got shoddy medical treament because he was poor, black and foreign](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/10/08/1335231/-Thomas-Eric-Duncan-s-family-say-he-got-bad-healthcare-because-he-is-a-poor-Black-man-with-an-accent) That is an opinionated account and not supported by the stated facts that the hospital fucked up in sending him home the first time. Never attribute to malice what can be accounted for by stupidity. That doesn’t make it right, but I have a hard time believing Duncan was sent home with antibiotics because of racism. In my opinion, people cave in to Jackson because he is a loudmouthed blowhard with a soapbox and a good eye for publicity. As for his not being given the experimental treatment, it was an unproven drug with no guarantee it would have any results. There were probably good sound medical reasons for doing so. At this point, there is no cure for Ebola. The best treatment is to provide supportive care while the patient fights off the infection. There is no magic bullet for Ebola. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/66 "2014-10-10T04:57:28Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > That is an opinionated account and not supported by the stated facts that the hospital fucked up in sending him home the first time. Never attribute to malice what can be accounted for by stupidity. That doesn’t make it right, but I have a hard time believing Duncan was sent home with antibiotics because of racism. In my opinion, people cave in to Jackson because he is a loudmouthed blowhard with a soapbox and a good eye for publicity. Did not think so either, but poverty does explain a lot, and it was one of the reasons they mentioned. (I also do think that poverty was the issue in my case too, but knowing how lot of the efforts against health care reform have a racist component I can not agree that we should eliminate racism that a factor completely). In any case I was not talking about it, the only thing it is clear that you missed the main point, the family was being treated like dirt, and in a case like that I would even accept the help of Fox’s Hannity in pressuring an organization that is not doing the proper thing. > [@cochrane](#): > > As for his not being given the experimental treatment, it was an unproven drug with no guarantee it would have any results. There were probably good sound medical reasons for doing so. At this point, there is no cure for Ebola. The best treatment is to provide supportive care while the patient fights off the infection. There is no magic bullet for Ebola. And I can see that there is no magic bullet to prejudice, and in this case it is mostly an economical one. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/67 "2014-10-10T05:39:33Z")
So, you believe the hospital knowingly sent Duncan home with antibiotics in spite of having symptoms of Ebola because he was poor and black when the right thing to do would have been to hospitalize him and put him into quarantine, if only to prevent the spread of infection to the general public? :rolleyes: Alrighty, then. I’ll say again, never attribute to malice that which can be accounted for by stupidity. Again, human error. Regrettable, but not motivated by racism. If you believe the hospital’s error was malicious in nature, you have to believe they also had a disregard for the rest of the public who would have had reason to come into contact with Duncan. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/68 "2014-10-10T05:57:24Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > So, you believe the hospital knowingly sent Duncan home with antibiotics in spite of having symptoms of Ebola because he was poor and black when the right thing to do would have been to hospitalize him and put him into quarantine, if only to prevent the spread of infection to the general public? :rolleyes: Not really, my position is more nuanced than the caricature you want to make. > [@cochrane](#): > > Alrighty, then. I’ll say again, never attribute to malice that which can be accounted for by stupidity. Again, human error. Regrettable, but not motivated by racism. If you believe the hospital’s error was malicious in nature, you have to believe they also had a disregard for the rest of the public who would have had reason to come into contact with Duncan. Curiously I also do consider the error angle, but I do think that, just like in the case I encountered in Phoenix, there are more prone to error when they are trained to discourage poor people to get treatment. Sorry, on this one you can not change what I experienced, and it is interesting that to make your incomplete and caricature points you are also ignoring what I did go through, and the experiences of many others when there is no good health access for the uninsured. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/69 "2014-10-10T07:21:17Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Sorry, on this one you can not change what I experienced, and it is interesting that to make your incomplete and caricature points you are also ignoring what I did go through, and the experiences of many others when there is no good health access for the uninsured. Possibly if you shared what you went through, I’d be unable to ignore it? Otherwise I can’t consider your experience if I’m unaware of it. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/70 "2014-10-10T07:29:12Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > Possibly if you shared what you went through, I’d be unable to ignore it? Otherwise I can’t consider your experience if I’m unaware of it. 😕 I already did so in my note to **PastTense** , but to deal more with it: I guess I have to deal with where the malice is IMHO: No, I did not see any malice on the eyes of the nice lady/nurse that discouraged me from getting treatment when I thought I needed to last year. I got the impression that she was also concerned about my health indeed; but there was, besides the health forms filled, the problem of me not having insurance then, it was similar to watching a car salesman (sales woman) discouraging you from going to a different dealer. So it was clear to me that the risk was too much in the economical sense, as it happens with many poor people it would not matter much if I had died in my sleep if I had had a really bad condition, as I got out I did thank her for her attention but I let her know that this was not really a good thing, and could see that she mostly did agree and was concerned by the choice I made. Indeed I did not see any malice, nor incompetency even, she was just very capable and competently trained on discouraging a poor guy with no insurance from getting treatment. Can not blame her anyhow, as I was aware that nurses associations are fighting to avoid having to make those discouraging efforts that are prone to cause mistakes, particularly when epidemics rear their ugly microscopic but deadly heads. (And if I was correct on my assessment of what the nurse/staff person was thinking, this discouraging way of dealing with the poor and uninsured is a soul crushing effort for them). I like to think that she was part of groups like the ANA: [http://nursingworld.org/AccessHC](http://nursingworld.org/AccessHC) > [@](#): > > ACCESS TO HEALTH COVERAGE POSITION > > ANA is committed to comprehensive health care reform that will ensure universal access to > health care (preferably through a single-payer system) > > ANA also continues to support progressive, incremental steps to cover the milli > ons of Americans who lack health care coverage and to oppose efforts to exempt new insurance pools such as association health plans (AHPs) from state insurance laws and regulations. > In 2010, the ANA reaffirmed its longstanding position that health care is a basic human right for all people, and all individuals living in the US **(documented or not)** should have access to health care. So where is the malice? I would think that the evidence shows that it is coming from politicians that should know better, from powerful groups that still want to prevent any reform from taking place, from the medical bean counters that impose those practices to the staff in a hospital; but then again, they could also be mostly incompetent… Either way, they do not deserve to be returned to congress. ---
**Author:** ![buddy431](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@buddy431](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddy431)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/71 "2014-10-10T07:54:17Z")
This whole thing has already entered the “Chicken Little” stage. There was an article in the paper about how the Chicago marathon is preparing for ebola. Despite the fact that there are no participants from West Africa (there are a number from East Africa, and god-dammit those dirty foreigners must be bringing the plague). There’s a BBC article about this becoming “the next AIDS”. Ebola will not be the next AIDS. It will not be the next malaria. It will not be the next flu. It might be the next African sleeping sickness, although that kills about 9,000 people a year, and I sort of doubt ebola is going to hit that sort of toll on a regular basis. The only place this disease is spreading is in an area which recently had a civil war and has very little in the way of medical infrastructure. It is perfectly safe to shake the hand of those tourists from Senegal. Your kid who goes to school in Dallas is not at risk. Medical workers are at a slight risk, just like they are for every other nasty disease out there. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2014, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/72 "2014-10-10T08:33:29Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > 😕 I already did so in my note to **PastTense** , I apologize. I missed that. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2014, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/73 "2014-10-12T12:09:08Z")
[Texas Department of State Health Services:](https://www.dshs.state.tx.us/news/releases/20141012.aspx) > [@](#): > > “A health care worker at Texas Health Presbyterian Hospital who provided care for the Ebola patient hospitalized there has tested positive for Ebola . . . .” ---
**Author:** ![Mithras](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@Mithras](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mithras)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2014, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/74 "2014-10-12T15:54:31Z")
That’s it. I’m panicking. At this rate it’ll only take 15 million years for every person in America to become infected. ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2014, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/75 "2014-10-12T21:53:37Z")
Maybe this is all just a PR stunt for the season premiere of _The Walking Dead_ tonight. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2014, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/76 "2014-10-12T22:28:25Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > Maybe this is all just a PR stunt for the season premiere of _The Walking Dead_ tonight. I wish. Texas borders Arkansas. I work at a school and catch every damn thing the kids get. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2014, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/77 "2014-10-13T01:08:55Z")
Its inevitable. I see only one solution… Nuke Dallas from orbit. Its the only way to be sure. Now, obviously, people need a chance to pray before they meet their maker, so I’ve prepared a handy list of [Sunday dates available](http://www.ticketmaster.com/Dallas-Cowboys-tickets/artist/805931). Obviously, I’d prefer Oct 27th or Later. (more time to Pray) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Sarabellum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarabellum/32/3492_2.png) [@Sarabellum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarabellum)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2014, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/78 "2014-10-13T22:17:27Z")
And now one of his nurses has come down with Ebola… how on earth did that happen! She was gowned, gloved, masked - and of course, this freak occurrence is going to make people even more crazy. Even though she asked for privacy and for her name not to be released, the media outed her anyway. Poor thing. She’s just a nurse, doing her job, and now she’s going to be the public face of this disease in the United States - maybe for her whole life; however long that happens to be. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2014, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/79 "2014-10-13T23:16:03Z")
Calm down. Seriously. How a gowned and gloved person can become infected has been addressed in numerous forums, but to say it again, in a nutshell, when you are removing a garment that is contaminated on the outside unless you do it exactly right you risk exposing yourself to the contagion. Taking the protective garments off is when a person is most likely to make a mistake. Or maybe a small hole was torn in the garments. Or maybe she suffered a needlestick through a glove. These sorts of things happen _every day_ in medicine, that’s how even careful doctors can catch things like HIV and hepatitis and so on. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2014, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768/80 "2014-10-13T23:40:03Z")
> [@Sarabellum1976](#): > > And now one of his nurses has come down with Ebola… how on earth did that happen! She was gowned, gloved, masked. Perhaps she scratched her nose, like the Spanish nurse. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dallas-ebola-guy-just-died/700768.md?page=5)